Bargains

[Mark Meldon]

Well, it is such a hard job the recommend Bach's Cantatas (thank goodness we are not comparing Beethoven 9ths!). As I have said previously, the Harnoncourt/Leonhardt Teldec set is my favourite, and I have only heard bits of the Rilling (very fine) but, just as a thought, why not try one of the Berlin Classics recordings. A while back I bought from Amazon a set of sacred cantatas (11 CDs) performed by the Thomanerchor Leipzig, Neues Bachisches Collegium Musicum, Gewandhaus Orchester, conducted by Hans-Joachim Rotzsch, and several of these recordings are available inexpensively on Amazon (my set cost £4.79!! a couple of years ago). Here we have modern instruments from the former DDR and, like Rilling, they are a bit "big-band", but idiomatic, I guess, and beautifully sung. I play them now and again.

As others have said, sample before you buy!

[verismissimo]

... My own collection of the Cantatas is put together from various sets and Verismissimo's & Gurnemanz's appreciative comments about the (very cheap) Leusink set tally with my own ...

Following fernery's thoughtful piece, I thought I'd make a list of what I have (by conductor - or should I say director).

I don't have any complete cycle by one director: I have most of Leusink and much Harnoncourt/Leonhardt; some Rilling, Koopman, JEG, Herreweghe, Coin, and Jurowski - all on CD; and on LP I have some Schreier, Rotzsch, Winschermann, Vandernoot, Goennenwein, Parrott and Marriner.

Altogether they cover over half a century of changing performance practice. And they all have a place!

[MickyD]

When the boys voices on the Harnoncourt/Leonhardt set are good, they are very good...this is a favourite aria of mine taken from Cantata 68, sung by the wonderful Peter Jelosits. It would certainly tip the balance for me in choosing this set!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImPY64vmy4M&index=29&list=FLBc5HbFSu_TDvzxC8-xga4Q

[mikealdren]

I ordered Hilary Hahn's encores CD in September from the grocers. I got a note today saying that it had been dispatched, is this a record (well no it's a CD, but you see what I mean!!)

Mike

[Dave2002]

A while back I bought from Amazon a set of sacred cantatas (11 CDs) performed by the Thomanerchor Leipzig, Neues Bachisches Collegium Musicum, Gewandhaus Orchester, conducted by Hans-Joachim Rotzsch, and several of these recordings are available inexpensively on Amazon (my set cost £4.79!! a couple of years ago). Here we have modern instruments from the former DDR and, like Rilling, they are a bit "big-band", but idiomatic, I guess, and beautifully sung. I play them now and again.

Maybe your set is only now available in the USA - http://www.amazon.com/J-S-Bach-Canta.../dp/B0012NOT5Q I can't track down any cheap versions which fit your description.

You were lucky to get it so cheaply.

Others I found which might be of perhaps slight (very slight?) interest are:

http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Documents/233519

an 8 CD set for about £15 with performances by the Thomanerchor, but some of the recordings are old

and this 10 CD set from Berlin Classics http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/B...sics/0300034BC which also features Hans-Joachim Rotzsch - I think both as a singer and conductor - but it costs rather more.

Both have a few cantatas and some of Bach's major choral works.

[MLF]

I just picked up the Thomanerchor 8 CD set for £6 on amazon:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007LKHOWE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3A72FJ03Q9CJT

An historically interesting set. Further acquisitions to follow.

[Dave2002]

I just picked up the Thomanerchor 8 CD set for £6 on amazon:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007LKHOWE/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A3A72FJ03Q9CJT

An historically interesting set. Further acquisitions to follow.

Well done. Currently the best price seems to be £9.98 - http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-lis...&condition=new

Let us know what it's like when it comes. Some of the recordings may be rather old.

I have some newer recordings of the Thomanerchor - they're really rather good, and sound well.

[Mark Meldon]

Well done. Currently the best price seems to be £9.98 - http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-lis...&condition=new

Let us know what it's like when it comes. Some of the recordings may be rather old.

I have some newer recordings of the Thomanerchor - they're really rather good, and sound well.

This set, from Membran, contains very old "big band" Bach, I believe. Membran's record with "public domain" recordings is, shall we say, "patchy". I have bought a few and most (but not all) of the transfers have been terrible.

Going back to the Berlin Classics set of Cantatas, I actually bought three boxes, all for less than £10 and they were indeed supplied from an Amazon reseller in the USA (Abundatrade, from memory). I was chuffed at the time, and the Mass is very good.

[Dave2002]

This set, from Membran, contains very old "big band" Bach, I believe. Membran's record with "public domain" recordings is, shall we say, "patchy". I have bought a few and most (but not all) of the transfers have been terrible.

I agree that some - though not all - of Membran's issues are very poorly recorded. In some cases though this might be forgiveable, as sometimes the recordings are themselves very old, and possibly never existed in good versions in the first place. Some recordings are worth having simply for the performances - almost irrespective of the sound quality, though this isn't always the case as there are many good modern performances of works in decent sound quality - a historical issue has to be really special now to justify a purchase.

For more on the Documents set see http://www.membran-online.de/product...oducts_id=4362 which shows that some date from the 1940s. The 1950s recordings may well sound OK, if the transfers aren't terrible. I have a recording of parts of the Christmas Oratorio with Agnes Giebel and Dietgrich Fischer-Dieskau also conducted by Kurt Thomas which sounds OK - but that's on the Berlin label.

£6 sounds a reasonable price for the Membran originated box, but much more than a tenner perhaps not.

[MLF]

£6 sounds a reasonable price for the Membran originated box, but much more than a tenner perhaps not.

I am prepared for recordings which are a little home grown - but for the price of a couple of pints I considered it was worth a shot.
Beyond that, Mark and Mick's comments are now steering me towards Harmoncourt in due course.

Incidentally, looking beyond the Cantatas, this looks quite fun:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bach-Masterworks-Original-Jackets-Collection/dp/B00D6OP1HY/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=34J7WQ64CI854&coliid=IHZ168EV1XQSR

[hafod]

I agree that some - though not all - of Membran's issues are very poorly recorded. In some cases though this might be forgiveable, as sometimes the recordings are themselves very old, and possibly never existed in good versions in the first place. Some recordings are worth having simply for the performances - almost irrespective of the sound quality, though this isn't always the case as there are many good modern performances of works in decent sound quality - a historical issue has to be really special now to justify a purchase.

For more on the Documents set see http://www.membran-online.de/product...oducts_id=4362 which shows that some date from the 1940s. The 1950s recordings may well sound OK, if the transfers aren't terrible. I have a recording of parts of the Christmas Oratorio with Agnes Giebel and Dietgrich Fischer-Dieskau also conducted by Kurt Thomas which sounds OK - but that's on the Berlin label.

£6 sounds a reasonable price for the Membran originated box, but much more than a tenner perhaps not.

Talking of Membran issues, if anyone is looking for a door-stop this might fit the bill:

http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Zauber-der-Operette-100CD-Box/hnum/1841767

On the other hand if operetta is for you then 100cds for €50 may be of interest, in which case further info below:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=777843

[Dave2002]

Incidentally, looking beyond the Cantatas, this looks quite fun:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bach-Masterw...=IHZ168EV1XQSR

Oh dear - yet another box set to think about!

There is some good stuff in there, indeed. It includes some of JEG's cantatas, though Pinnock's versions of the orchestral suites, rather than Goebels versions - which have been on my wish list for some time. Pinnock's Goldbergs are very good.

An interesting mix of styles in the box. I'll file this away for later.

...now steering me towards Harnoncourt in due course.

What is your timescale? How much do you think you'll eventually spend?

I'm sure that Harnoncourt's are pretty good, and can be obtained at reasonable prices. Box sets generally offer better value - for example see Suzuki's set, which BIS are reluctant to issue as a box. In a few years time CDs may not be available, many boxes may be remaindered, and then we'll be stuck with downloads - which in some cases may give better sound quality - in some cases possibly worse - though can most people tell the difference (320 kbps mp3?). Some will be available as SACDs, but as a format that may not last too much longer, which means that high quality sound will only be possible via Blu Ray or downloads - the latter mostly still only being 2 channel. Does it matter anyway for older recordings? Some older recordings are still very well worth hearing for the music - and many recordings since 1960 are decent enough.

[Beef Oven!]

Oh dear - yet another box set to think about!

There is some good stuff in there, indeed. It includes some of JEG's cantatas, though Pinnock's versions of the orchestral suites, rather than Goebels versions - which have been on my wish list for some time. Pinnock's Goldbergs are very good.

An interesting mix of styles in the box. I'll file this away for later.


What is your timescale? How much do you think you'll eventually spend?

I'm sure that Harnoncourt's are pretty good, and can be obtained at reasonable prices. Box sets generally offer better value - for example see Suzuki's set, which BIS are reluctant to issue as a box. In a few years time CDs may not be available, many boxes may be remaindered, and then we'll be stuck with downloads - which in some cases may give better sound quality - in some cases possibly worse - though can most people tell the difference (320 kbps mp3?). Some will be available as SACDs, but as a format that may not last too much longer, which means that high quality sound will only be possible via Blu Ray or downloads - the latter mostly still only being 2 channel. Does it matter anyway for older recordings? Some older recordings are still very well worth hearing for the music - and many recordings since 1960 are decent enough.

Dangerous business. Just casually reading your toings and froings, I downloaded #55 from the Suzuki set and now I'm thinking about some Harnoncourt. Anyone know what JEG's performances are like?

[groovydavidii]

Sorry, not about the Bach cantatas, but might be of interest to fellow bargain-hunters, just won on eBay Solti's Ring cycle, sealed/unused, for the princely sum of £30, which when compared to £123.00–Presto and £89–Amazon, is a real bargain, so may I suggest, don't overlook eBay!

[PJPJ]

Box sets generally offer better value - for example see Suzuki's set, which BIS are reluctant to issue as a box.

Just announced........