"La Tribune des Critiques de Disques" - France-Musique

[Barbirollians]

As has been observed before, BaL is meant to end up with one or more (subjective) recommendations, not a 'winner'.

Very true - Le Jardin however does appear to demand a winner . If you have excluded the Arkle of recordings from the field then it rather undermines the race .

[Nick Armstrong]

Very true - Le Jardin however does appear to demand a winner.

No more or less than BAL really - the idea is to end the programme with a selected version (called variously the version "élue" or "choisie" or - yes - sometimes, "gagnante") - but I can't see the difference from the endgame of BAL.

[Barbirollians]

No more or less than BAL really - the idea is to end the programme with a selected version (called variously the version "élue" or "choisie" or - yes - sometimes, "gagnante") - but I can't see the difference from the endgame of BAL.

Well with BAL it does seem to depend on the reviewer and how they express it. Sometimes it is treated as the winner other times merely as a personal choice .

The fairest view I always think of BAL ( and my bugbear is much more often also the exclusion of legendary recordings even from consideration ) is when it is expressed as a library choice i.e. to get to know the work from rather than the last word .

[Sir Velo]

Caution - French pronunciation even of names can be tricky, I remember never managing to work out who they were talking about when they praised "Oyn Yom"

The one that used to get me was their pronunciation of Vaughan Williams. Always used to sound like an injunction to "Phone William".

[akiralx]

Very true - Le Jardin however does appear to demand a winner . If you have excluded the Arkle of recordings from the field then it rather undermines the race .

But most of these Arkles are now really only fit for the knackers yard aren't they...

[Nick Armstrong]

Now catching up with a TCD from late March (so I think I can speak freely about the runners and riders) covering Chopin's First Piano Concerto... They concentrated on 6 relatively recent recordings, so a contest for yearlings rather than the Arkles of the catalogue...

Great fun!

After long extracts from the first movement, three were eliminated.

Two were from the Frederick Chopin Institute series of recordings:

Lukas Geniušas / Warsaw PO - Wit http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/F.../NIFCCD604-605
Leonora Armellini Sinfonia Varsovia - Jacek Kaspszyk http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/F...tute/NIFCCD615

And then the fun started.

The third to be summarily eliminated first time round was the subject of lacerating criticism.... and even before hearing the comments, it did seem to me to be intolerably fussy - the 'camp' school of Chopin playing I can't stand. Among the phrases used by the French critics about this version were:

It's a catalogue of everything you shouldn't do in this music.... full of silliness.... sounds like a young pianist who could be decent when he grows up.... over-accentuated contrasts.... affected mannerisms, decorations like vulgar tinsel Christmas decorations... basically a lack of musical intelligence

And the pianist on this version?

Daniel Barenboim (with the Berlin Staatskapelle under Andris Nelsons)



The critics were unrepentant - great musician in many areas but this just not his repertoire.

And yet... what is one to make of this: http://www.theguardian.com/music/201...1-and-2-review (I see it was Gramphone 'Editor's Choice' in August 2011.. and other positive reviews are helpfully extracted here http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/DG/4779520 )

Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice...

Will report on the rest of the programme when I get a chance to hear it, to see who's on the podium!

[BBMmk2]

Cali, do you have this recording? Or any other boarders on here? Seems quite an attractive acquisition.

[Nick Armstrong]

Cali, do you have this recording? Or any other boarders on here? Seems quite an attractive acquisition.

What, Barenboim? Nah... don't get on with the chap!

[Barbirollians]

Now catching up with a TCD from late March (so I think I can speak freely about the runners and riders) covering Chopin's First Piano Concerto... They concentrated on 6 relatively recent recordings, so a contest for yearlings rather than the Arkles of the catalogue...

Great fun!

After long extracts from the first movement, three were eliminated.

Two were from the Frederick Chopin Institute series of recordings:

Lukas Geniušas / Warsaw PO - Wit http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/F.../NIFCCD604-605
Leonora Armellini Sinfonia Varsovia - Jacek Kaspszyk http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/F...tute/NIFCCD615

And then the fun started.

The third to be summarily eliminated first time round was the subject of lacerating criticism.... and even before hearing the comments, it did seem to me to be intolerably fussy - the 'camp' school of Chopin playing I can't stand. Among the phrases used by the French critics about this version were:

It's a catalogue of everything you shouldn't do in this music.... full of silliness.... sounds like a young pianist who could be decent when he grows up.... over-accentuated contrasts.... affected mannerisms, decorations like vulgar tinsel Christmas decorations... basically a lack of musical intelligence

And the pianist on this version?

Daniel Barenboim (with the Berlin Staatskapelle under Andris Nelsons)



The critics were unrepentant - great musician in many areas but this just not his repertoire.

And yet... what is one to make of this: http://www.theguardian.com/music/201...1-and-2-review (I see it was Gramphone 'Editor's Choice' in August 2011.. and other positive reviews are helpfully extracted here http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/DG/4779520 )

Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice...

Will report on the rest of the programme when I get a chance to hear it, to see who's on the podium!

I suspect that older recordings need to be top class ( as distinct from the performances )to avoid their age betraying the performer to the blind listening panel

[Nick Armstrong]

I suspect that older recordings need to be top class ( as distinct from the performances )to avoid their age betraying the performer to the blind listening panel

It's surprising, that's not really the case... apart from voices, when it is difficult not to spot a Jessye Norman or a Peter Pears, it's just as difficult to identify individual performances in older readings, other than the fact often that they are older - there's a lot of older recordings out there, Barb!

[BBMmk2]

What, Barenboim? Nah... don't get on with the chap!

:) Who do you recommend? :)

[Barbirollians]

:) Who do you recommend? :)

I don't know about Caliban but I should strongly recommend the recent Ingrid Fliter disc of both concertos on Linn . Quite splendid all round .

If one is just considering the E Minor I always think there are two classic recordings from the 1960s - Pollini /Kletzki on EMI and Argerich/Abbado on DG.

[Nick Armstrong]

:) Who do you recommend? :)

Well of the recent ones, I love Rafael Blechacz's version with Jerzy Semkow conducting the Concertgebouw

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Chopin-Piano-Concertos-Rafal-Blechacz/dp/B002GJ3MQ2/ref=sr_1_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1400709819&sr=1-2&keywords=chopin+blechacz

Also Jan Lisiecki's performance, with Howard Shelley conducting

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Piano-Concerto-Fminor-Eminor/dp/B00383YC1O/ref=sr_1_fkmr2_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1400709871&sr=1-2-fkmr2&keywords=chopin+lisiecki+concertos

I confess I haven't heard Ms Fliter in the first concerto and must remedy that!

However:

to continue the saga above, the remaining three considered by the Tribune critics were a rather odd bunch:

Yevgeny Borzhanov and the Warsaw Phil under Antoni Wit

Nikolai Lugansky and the Sinfonia Varsovia under Alexander Vedernikov

and the 'Winner'...

Daniil Trifonov and the Warsaw Philharmonic, again under Antoni Wit.

So 4 of the 6 versions considered were recordings from the Fr. Chopin Institute (as is the Lisiecki I mentioned earlier); 3 were conducted by Antoni Wit; 3 were with the Warsaw Phil and 2 with the Sinfonia Varsovia...

Not very representative, one might argue - esp. given the recent versions from Blachacz, Lisiecki and Fliter

However I have no complaints about the concept of Trifonov in Chopin, and propose to acquire that recommended version, and Barbs's recommendation of Fliter, to add to Blechacz and Lisiecki

[BBMmk2]

Nikolai Lugansky, I havn't heard of that named artist for a long while!!

[Nick Armstrong]

This series starts again Sunday next.... but reduced from 2 hours to 90 minutes

The new France-Musique season has sparked off a lengthy debate on one of the presenters' facebook page, mirroring debates about R3 - the tendency to sacrifice quality to the chase for ratings etc. A telling exchange: "Who now keeps the radio tuned to France-Musique from Saturday morning to Sunday night, as many of us used to?" ... "No one".