Beethoven String Quartets on record

[Tapiola]

Any views on the Tokyo Quartet? I have read that their approach is a little too refined, too pretty? Is this a fair appraisal?

[LaurieWatt]

Knowing of your extraordinary depth of musical Knowledge, Laurie, I stepped back in amazement. What joys to come!
And with so much emphasis in this thread on the late quartets, it's easy to forget how wonderful (and revolutionary) the early opus 18 set is.
I can't pretend to have surveyed the field, but when I reach for them, it's usually for the early Lindsays recordings.
But then, like ferney, I heard that great quartet play them (rather often over the years).
Of current young quartets, the Heaths remind me most of the Lindsays.

You are too kind, verismissimo, but the small chamber group repertory is still quite a green field for me and I am really grateful to everyone for all these amazing recommendations and suggestions that have arisen so far in this thread.

[visualnickmos]

Without an in-depth check, I don't think the Juilliard Quartet have been mentioned in this regard. Certainly not to be overlooked.

[richardfinegold]

Any views on the Tokyo Quartet? I have read that their approach is a little too refined, too pretty? Is this a fair appraisal?

I have their latest cycle on SACD and I mentioned earlier in this thread that both they and the Italians occupy my shelves and get played frequently but that both of them occasionally sound a bit to bit to rarified (in different ways) when LvB demands some grit.
In both cases, it is a minor flaw. It would be like discovering that Michelangelo had put a zit on the forehead of the David and that someone had sanded it off. I was listening to the Tokyo in Op 131 last night and it is still pretty hair raising. My favorite Op. 131 is an old recording by the Yale Quartet and in comparison the Tokyo sounds suave and smooth and less on the edge of the abyss, but if I didn't know the Yale recording I wouldn't be complaining.

[richardfinegold]

You are too kind, verismissimo, but the small chamber group repertory is still quite a green field for me and I am really grateful to everyone for all these amazing recommendations and suggestions that have arisen so far in this thread.

Some other great Chamber Music that you might want to explore:
Mozart- Clarinet Quintet
Schubert-Trout Quintet
Brahms and Dvorak-Piano Quintets
Beethoven--Archduke Trio

This could be a whole thread in and of itself

[Thropplenoggin]

I have their latest cycle on SACD and I mentioned earlier in this thread that both they and the Italians occupy my shelves and get played frequently but that both of them occasionally sound a bit to bit to rarified (in different ways) when LvB demands some grit.
In both cases, it is a minor flaw. It would be like discovering that Michelangelo had put a zit on the forehead of the David and that someone had sanded it off. I was listening to the Tokyo in Op 131 last night and it is still pretty hair raising. My favorite Op. 131 is an old recording by the Yale Quartet and in comparison the Tokyo sounds suave and smooth and less on the edge of the abyss, but if I didn't know the Yale recording I wouldn't be complaining.

The Busch Quartet nail that otherworldly atmosphere in op.131. I have it in the new(ish) Dutton re-mastering. It's compelling listening.

[Tapiola]

I have their latest cycle on SACD and I mentioned earlier in this thread that both they and the Italians occupy my shelves and get played frequently but that both of them occasionally sound a bit to bit to rarified (in different ways) when LvB demands some grit.
In both cases, it is a minor flaw. It would be like discovering that Michelangelo had put a zit on the forehead of the David and that someone had sanded it off. I was listening to the Tokyo in Op 131 last night and it is still pretty hair raising. My favorite Op. 131 is an old recording by the Yale Quartet and in comparison the Tokyo sounds suave and smooth and less on the edge of the abyss, but if I didn't know the Yale recording I wouldn't be complaining.

richard,

Many thanks

(and apologies for failing to remember your earlier mentioning of the Tokyo)

Nice Michelangelo analogy!

[richardfinegold]

richard,

Many thanks

(and apologies for failing to remember your earlier mentioning of the Tokyo)

Nice Michelangelo analogy!

No sweat, I only referenced my previous reference to remind myself that I haven't yet crossed the edge into senility.
Off topic, I'm reading the book Beethoven's Hair at the moment. I think everyone posting here would love it.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Off topic, I'm reading the book Beethoven's Hair at the moment. I think everyone posting here would love it.

Endlessly fascinating from so many different angles: and that terrible story of the Danish village in WW2* ...

EDIT: * = Gilleleje; and I'm ashamed I had forgotten the name - it should be universally known.

[ostuni]

I've now had a listen to the Borodin op 132 which Thropps recommended back in #2. Marvellous playing, in a very 'public' sort of way: strongly projected - very different from the more inward approach of the Végh quartet. The latter is probably my overall favourite for Beethoven, though Végh himself is sometimes a little wayward (not as much as Cropper, though...).

I also had a listen (Spotify) to the op 132 from the more recent Borodin set on Chandos - and certainly agree with Thrp that the Virgin disc is preferable. A pity, since the complete Chandos set is available pretty cheaply. But a quick bit of Googling came up with one good reason for the Virgin's superiority: it dates from the period when Kopelman was still leading the quartet and, as I know well from the Melodiya complete Shostakovich quartets recordings, he's a wonderfully powerful player. And, to my ears, Aharonian (leader since 96) doesn't have that opulent tone or way with the phrasing.

I've just this afternoon listened to the Belcea's op132 on Spotify. An astonishing Heiliger Dankgesang - I do urge everyone to hear it. It's very slow (slower even than the Busch); the vibrato is often absolutely minimal and, like the Véghs, they really mark the (crucial, IMO) distinction between p and pp: that final section is certainly mit innigster Empfindung.

Earlier references to HIPP versions didn't mention a couple of recordings that I have; possibly no longer available. The Quatuor Turner put out a complete set of the op 18s in 1995, and a single disc of 59/3 and 74 in 2001 (Harmonia Mundi). They are/were all principals with Herreweghe's Orch des Champs-Elysées, and their op18, in particular, is really fine.

[Thropplenoggin]

I've now had a listen to the Borodin op 132 which Thropps recommended back in #2. Marvellous playing, in a very 'public' sort of way: strongly projected - very different from the more inward approach of the Végh quartet. The latter is probably my overall favourite for Beethoven, though Végh himself is sometimes a little wayward (not as much as Cropper, though...).

I also had a listen (Spotify) to the op 132 from the more recent Borodin set on Chandos - and certainly agree with Thrp that the Virgin disc is preferable. A pity, since the complete Chandos set is available pretty cheaply. But a quick bit of Googling came up with one good reason for the Virgin's superiority: it dates from the period when Kopelman was still leading the quartet and, as I know well from the Melodiya complete Shostakovich quartets recordings, he's a wonderfully powerful player. And, to my ears, Aharonian (leader since 96) doesn't have that opulent tone or way with the phrasing.

I've just this afternoon listened to the Belcea's op132 on Spotify. An astonishing Heiliger Dankgesang - I do urge everyone to hear it. It's very slow (slower even than the Busch); the vibrato is often absolutely minimal and, like the Véghs, they really mark the (crucial, IMO) distinction between p and pp: that final section is certainly mit innigster Empfindung.

Earlier references to HIPP versions didn't mention a couple of recordings that I have; possibly no longer available. The Quatuor Turner put out a complete set of the op 18s in 1995, and a single disc of 59/3 and 74 in 2001 (Harmonia Mundi). They are/were all principals with Herreweghe's Orch des Champs-Elysées, and their op18, in particular, is really fine.

A superb post, ostuni; wonderfully informative. Glad you enjoyed the Borodins in op.132 (Virgin Classics) - it's how I first encountered the work and, thus, I've struggled to be wowed by anything since. However, I am minded to try the Belceas later.

Thanks for also explaining the difference between the two sets with far more elegance and succinctness than I could have mustered.

[LaurieWatt]

Some other great Chamber Music that you might want to explore:
Mozart- Clarinet Quintet
Schubert-Trout Quintet
Brahms and Dvorak-Piano Quintets
Beethoven--Archduke Trio

This could be a whole thread in and of itself

Ah, Richard, thank you. I am guilty of being imprecise. I am on much surer ground once a piano or other wind instrument(s) are added - or, indeed, larger numbers of strings, although in terms of knowledge of the best recordings, still way behind the expert contributors to this thread.

As a horn player, as well, I love playing the Brahms Horn Trio, Mozart Quintet, Mozart and Beethoven piano and wind (K452 and Op 16 respectively - and in the case of LvB's Op 16 his version for piano and strings) ..etc etc all of the works you mention are great loves of mine and I have a few recordings of each. I also particularly love the Brahms Piano Quartets..

yes, it could make quite a thread....not sure how to do the shift across to "new thread"....

[richardfinegold]

Ah, Richard, thank you. I am guilty of being imprecise. I am on much surer ground once a piano or other wind instrument(s) are added - or, indeed, larger numbers of strings, although in terms of knowledge of the best recordings, still way behind the expert contributors to this thread.

As a horn player, as well, I love playing the Brahms Horn Trio, Mozart Quintet, Mozart and Beethoven piano and wind (K452 and Op 16 respectively - and in the case of LvB's Op 16 his version for piano and strings) ..etc etc all of the works you mention are great loves of mine and I have a few recordings of each. I also particularly love the Brahms Piano Quartets..

yes, it could make quite a thread....not sure how to do the shift across to "new thread"....

Apologize for my error, Laurie. I just started a new thread.

[verismissimo]

I noticed in the Colin Davis programme on BBC4 that he admitted that he had never studied the Beethoven piano sonatas...

[visualnickmos]

I noticed in the Colin Davis programme on BBC4 that he admitted that he had never studied the Beethoven piano sonatas...

Yes - that was a very honest and somewhat surprising revelation, but then it is impossible to study everything that one may be interested in, or indeed passionate about unless near immortality is achieved.