Record Review: non-BaL discs reviewed, etc.

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  • HighlandDougie
    Full Member
    • Nov 2010
    • 3082

    Originally posted by amateur51 View Post

    Has anyone had a chance to hear the complete performance?
    It would probably never be a BaL recommendation but this performance has really got under my skin. Roll on Barenboim recording the 1st.

    Comment

    • amateur51

      Originally posted by HighlandDougie View Post
      It would probably never be a BaL recommendation but this performance has really got under my skin. Roll on Barenboim recording the 1st.
      Many thanks HD - I just hope it gets on to Quobuz/Spotify soon so that we can listen to the full performance

      Comment

      • Thropplenoggin
        Full Member
        • Mar 2013
        • 1587

        Originally posted by HighlandDougie View Post
        It would probably never be a BaL recommendation but this performance has really got under my skin. Roll on Barenboim recording the 1st.
        I heard the clip on CD Review this morning, which merely served to remind me that I just don't get his symphonies whoevers playing them. Apart from the opening melody of the First, they really don't make sense to me. I can't get into them, finding them a sort of aural pot pourri (I can hear Tchaikovsky, Wagner, Brahms, etc.) whose elements, counterpoint and internal logic I can't seem to fathom.
        It loved to happen. -- Marcus Aurelius

        Comment

        • Barbirollians
          Full Member
          • Nov 2010
          • 11671

          Originally posted by amateur51 View Post
          Whatever happened to 'quiet enjoyment' Cali?
          Unless the landlord is doing the works that won't get you anywhere - nuisance however...

          Comment

          • HighlandDougie
            Full Member
            • Nov 2010
            • 3082

            Originally posted by Thropplenoggin View Post
            they really don't make sense to me.
            It took me a long time to "get" Elgar's symphonies and the 2nd in particular. It was hearing Solti's recording of the 1st (a revelation) and then the live wartime Boult recording of the 2nd, followed by hearing them a number of times in concert which convinced me that they stand comparison with any great symphony. To me, they sound distinctively "Elgarian". As it pains me that anyone cannot fathom them, you can expect a parcel in the post, Thropps.

            Comment

            • Nick Armstrong
              Host
              • Nov 2010
              • 26524

              Originally posted by amateur51 View Post
              Whatever happened to 'quiet enjoyment' Cali?
              They have Council permission for Saturday mornings, ams


              Originally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post
              It really was a fascinating BaL this morning, especially the Schumann and Elgar.
              I was able to hear these segments (as well as hear myself think) this morning, the examples played were very interesting.

              The Barenboim Elgar started so well, that striding theme well played and ideally paced... but then on slammed the brakes into a terribly slow, pulse-free second subject, that just seemed mannered and self-regarding to me. I know that 'architectural' issues such as that are hard to judge from shortish extracts.... but it sounded to be a non-starter for me. (See the 'Tribune des Critiques' thread in a while for another example from the same celebrated artist )

              And then there was more of the same in the Rattle way with the scherzo of the Schumann 2nd symphony It really did sound precious. And after a 1st Symphony that started so well!

              The Nézet-Séguin/COE scherzos did sound much better, and their reading of the 4th sounded great too... But I thought their speedy approach to the 1st movement of the 1st Symphony trivialised it.

              No need to pass over our Japanese pressings of the Sawallisch performances, Jayne!
              "...the isle is full of noises,
              Sounds and sweet airs, that give delight and hurt not.
              Sometimes a thousand twangling instruments
              Will hum about mine ears, and sometime voices..."

              Comment

              • Nick Armstrong
                Host
                • Nov 2010
                • 26524

                Originally posted by Thropplenoggin View Post
                I heard the clip on CD Review this morning, which merely served to remind me that I just don't get his symphonies whoevers playing them. Apart from the opening melody of the First, they really don't make sense to me. I can't get into them, finding them a sort of aural pot pourri (I can hear Tchaikovsky, Wagner, Brahms, etc.) whose elements, counterpoint and internal logic I can't seem to fathom.
                Like HD, I'm sorry about this although totally understand from my own experiences with other pieces. But the Elgar symphonies are pretty central for me. Do tell us what's in Dougie's parcel!
                "...the isle is full of noises,
                Sounds and sweet airs, that give delight and hurt not.
                Sometimes a thousand twangling instruments
                Will hum about mine ears, and sometime voices..."

                Comment

                • Warlock
                  Full Member
                  • Apr 2014
                  • 35

                  Some JB I hope!

                  Comment

                  • Barbirollians
                    Full Member
                    • Nov 2010
                    • 11671

                    Originally posted by Warlock View Post
                    Some JB I hope!
                    I hope so . He needs it.

                    Comment

                    • ferneyhoughgeliebte
                      Gone fishin'
                      • Sep 2011
                      • 30163

                      Originally posted by Caliban View Post
                      The Barenboim Elgar started so well, that striding theme well played and ideally paced... but then on slammed the brakes into a terribly slow, pulse-free second subject, that just seemed mannered and self-regarding to me. I know that 'architectural' issues such as that are hard to judge from shortish extracts.... but it sounded to be a non-starter for me.
                      - exactly my own reaction, Cali (and AndrewMcG was spot on about those gleeful "whoops" from the horns: superb! And then everything just got stuck in the mud )

                      And then there was more of the same in the Rattle way with the scherzo of the Schumann 2nd symphony It really did sound precious. And after a 1st Symphony that started so well!

                      The Nézet-Séguin/COE scherzos did sound much better, and their reading of the 4th sounded great too... But I thought their speedy approach to the 1st movement of the 1st Symphony trivialised it.
                      Yes - so many of Rattle's recent recordings of 19th Century repertoire are blighted by heavy-handed rubato (IMO). But I disagree about N-S; I was really taken up by the verve of what was played yesterday morning.
                      [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

                      Comment

                      • Thropplenoggin
                        Full Member
                        • Mar 2013
                        • 1587

                        Originally posted by HighlandDougie View Post
                        It took me a long time to "get" Elgar's symphonies and the 2nd in particular. It was hearing Solti's recording of the 1st (a revelation) and then the live wartime Boult recording of the 2nd, followed by hearing them a number of times in concert which convinced me that they stand comparison with any great symphony. To me, they sound distinctively "Elgarian". As it pains me that anyone cannot fathom them, you can expect a parcel in the post, Thropps.
                        I wasn't convinced by the Barbirolli EMI set (resold) but hearing both of your own troubles in this respect, and Caliban's in other Elgar works, I will approach the contents of this parcel with an open mind. I must remember to send you my new address.

                        I also struggle with Vaughan-Williams's symphonies. Again, it's not for want of trying.
                        Last edited by Thropplenoggin; 18-05-14, 21:13.
                        It loved to happen. -- Marcus Aurelius

                        Comment

                        • Thropplenoggin
                          Full Member
                          • Mar 2013
                          • 1587

                          Originally posted by Caliban View Post

                          And then there was more of the same in the Rattle way with the scherzo of the Schumann 2nd symphony It really did sound precious. And after a 1st Symphony that started so well!
                          Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post
                          Yes - so many of Rattle's recent recordings of 19th Century repertoire are blighted by heavy-handed rubato (IMO). But I disagree about N-S; I was really taken up by the verve of what was played yesterday morning.
                          That's Rattle for me - an admixture of unwelcome interventionism and the clinical pristineness of everything.

                          His most remarkable feat is how long he's managed to stay at helm of the Berliner Phil. That and his perma-perm.
                          It loved to happen. -- Marcus Aurelius

                          Comment

                          • teamsaint
                            Full Member
                            • Nov 2010
                            • 25196

                            Originally posted by Thropplenoggin View Post
                            I wasn't convinced by the Barbirolli EMI set (resold) but hearing both of your own troubles in this respect, and Caliban's in other Elgar works, I will approach the contents of this parcel with an open mind. I must remember to send you my new address.
                            I feel sure that there is plenty in HDs collection that I cant fathom.
                            I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.

                            I am not a number, I am a free man.

                            Comment

                            • Thropplenoggin
                              Full Member
                              • Mar 2013
                              • 1587

                              Originally posted by Caliban View Post
                              Like HD, I'm sorry about this although totally understand from my own experiences with other pieces. But the Elgar symphonies are pretty central for me. Do tell us what's in Dougie's parcel!
                              Perhaps he'll throw in a few Sibelius discs to help sugar the pill.
                              It loved to happen. -- Marcus Aurelius

                              Comment

                              • EdgeleyRob
                                Guest
                                • Nov 2010
                                • 12180

                                Originally posted by Thropplenoggin View Post
                                I wasn't convinced by the Barbirolli EMI set (resold) but hearing both of your own troubles in this respect, and Caliban's in other Elgar works, I will approach the contents of this parcel with an open mind. I must remember to send you my new address.

                                I also struggle with Vaughan-Williams's symphonies. Again, it's not for want of trying.
                                Strange isn't it Thropple.

                                Elgar and RVW symphonies IMO have everything and are about everything.
                                Who said a symphony should be about the world (Mahler?),to me these works are just that.
                                More than that they are essential for my well being and sanity.
                                I just can't fathom why other people can't fathom them.
                                I've no room to talk though,I can't fathom Sibelius.

                                Comment

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