Elgar: Symphonies Nos 1 and 2

[Hornspieler]

Elgar 1 is my favourite symphony. Without reservation. My favourites are Barbirolli (Pye) and Barbirolli(EMI). The live Barbirolli I'm less happy with. I quite like SNO/Gibson and the Previn too
Elgar 2 is not even in my top 10, though I do admire it. Here I would go for either of the EMI Barbirollis, Boult on Lyrita or Andrew Davis

Total agreement EA. Like Walton, the first symphony was written from the heart - something that just had to come out.
The second symphony, wonderful orchestral work though it is, was written because Elgar's admirers wanted more and Elgar obliged with a very fine symphony, but without the emotional content of his first. (Again, I feel, as is the case with Walton's 1st and 2nd)

HS

[Bryn]

No that's Norrington's Elgar 1

What a very silly attack on the Stuttgarters. Your lack of the musical sensibility to appreciate their particularly fine performances under RN's baton is no excuse for such disparagement.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Elgar 2 over 1 every day of the week btw.

The first is splendid (especially the middle two movements and especially in Barbirolli's Live recording) - but the emotional and intellectual power of the Second eclipses it completely for me. It might rashly be said that the First was written merely because his friends and admirers expected him to write a Symphony, and/or that it was obligatory for him to get to know how to write one before he could come up with the genuine symphonic masterpiece that is the Second, but I would not be so foolish as to make such claims. It would be foolhardy in the extreme for anyone to attempt to state categorically that either is demonstrably better than the other; there can only be personal preference here.

[Op. XXXIX]

For me, Previn in No.1 and Handley in No.2.

Nice to see the Previn mentioned, still my favourite of them all.

As for 2, I would agree with you about Handley, though with 14 recordings I get spoiled for choice! Thomson (sumptuously recorded) is just too slow IMO in the first movement, though his last movement feels ideally paced. The arrival at the 'Nobilmente' (rehearsal 142) has an exalted inevitability which I have never quite experienced in other recordings.

[Cheapskater]

Elgar 1 was on R3 only last night, BBM.

I love both of these equally and I've got lots of recordings. Boult's 1968 Lyrita tapings are very special indeed as are, in No 1, Solti, Barbirolli (1957) and, of course, Elgar himself which still packs quite a punch 80+ years on. Also strongly recommend Haitink and Colin Davis with the Dresden Staatskapelle. The 1976 Boult Prom is electrifying.

Handley is fine in No 2 as is Barbirolli (1954 & 1964) and Boult of course.

Incidentally, PG, I inderstand that Handley's 1981 LPO recording is in digital sound. The organ addition in the finale makes this my favourite No 2.

Two wonderful symphonies which one can listen to again and again, always some new detail to hear. For Sym. No.1 I also would go for Sir Colin Davis with the Dresden Staatskapelle, or Sir Charles Mackerras with the LSO. I do like dear departed Sir Charles Mackerras readings of Elgar and Mahler, they're most insightful; across the board I find him a most reliable conductor.

Tod Handley's Elgar was previously my favourite (Except for his Gerontius!).

[Cheapskater]

Yes, I like No. 3 (and attended the premiere) but don't play it as often as the others. Anthony Payne did a marvellous reconstruction for it and the tunes are truly elgarian, but I don't find it as deeply satisfying as the first two somehow.

[Cheapskater]

Good shout

I have No 1 and it's v good indeed.

Yes indeed, Sir Mark and the Halle truly understand Elgars music. Also full marks for their Alassio 'In the South', bringing out details and nuances that are lacking elsewhere.

[Bryn]

Total agreement EA. Like Walton, the first symphony was written from the heart - something that just had to come out.
The second symphony, wonderful orchestral rk though it is, was written because Elgar's admirers wanted more and Elgar obliged with a very fine symphony, but without the emotional content of his first. (Again, I feel, as is the case with Walton's 1st and 2nd)

HS

I find myself in agreement with you in this, HS. It's no great disparagement to the Second to recognise that it is not really up to the magnificent standard set by the First. In the 1-9 thread I was very much torn between the Walton and the Elgar as my prime choice for a 1st symphony. I do admire the Elgar Second, but it has never quite had the impact on me that the First has (the latter especially, but not exclusively, when under the baton of Sir Roger Norrington).

[Mr Pee]

But he composed 2 phenomenal ones, so the unfinished one is derided. a pity, but perhaps inevitable.

Going wildly off-topic perhaps, but having just watched The Godfather Part 2, to my mind one of the greatest films ever made, the sequence is rather like that film trilogy; the first 2 are so fantastic, that part 3 is never going to seem as good;although judged on its own, it would be perfectly good in its own right.

(And isn't Nino Rota's score absolutely superb?)

Anyway, back to Elgar....

I seem to recall Leonard Slatkin made a couple of decent recordings of the symphonies. And I would love Sir Simon to record them with the BPO before he moves on to pastures new.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

What a very silly attack on the Stuttgarters. Your lack of the musical sensibility to appreciate their particularly fine performances under RN's baton is no excuse for such disparagement.

. I would not disagree that the Stuttgarters can play brilliantly, as they did under Schuricht. but wearing handcuffs to play Elgar, they played with a thin and wiry tone, reminiscent of a school orchestra, albeit a good one.

[Mr Pee]

i would not disagree that the Stuttgarters can play brilliantly, as they did under Schuricht. but wearing handcuffs to play Elgar, they played with a thin and wiry tone, reminiscent of a school orchestra, albeit a good one.

[Nick Armstrong]

I seem to recall Leonard Slatkin made a couple of decent recordings of the symphonies.

I found my copy of Slatkin's No 1 earlier on... Must listen again (that's two I need to hear this weekend - his and Haitink's.)

[Nick Armstrong]

. ...but wearing handcuffs to play Elgar, they played with a thin and wiry tone, reminiscent of a school orchestra, albeit a good one.

I have to say that is precisely the analogy that has occurred to me when hearing a Norrington/Stuttgart performance... Sorry, Bryn.

[BBMmk2]

Goodness, what a wealth of recoprdings people have mentioned already!! Some I think I will have to acquite. (Why i think of these threads in the firstr place, i dont lknow what MrsBBM will say!!)

[Nick Armstrong]

Goodness, what a wealth of recoprdings people have mentioned already!! Some I think I will have to acquite. (Why i think of these threads in the firstr place, i dont lknow what MrsBBM will say!!)

Glutton for punishment.. err... sorry, for Elgar!