Forthcoming Klemperer Boxes

[Mandryka]

Yes, the RO notes are predictably excellent.

I have several recordings of the Alto Rhapsody, so am not in need of the words/translation. They're easily found on the web, anyway.

[Thropplenoggin]

The sets I have bought all have scholarly notes by Richard Osborne - the Bruckner, Beethoven and Romantic symphonies sets .
I wouldn't cut my nose offf to spite my face and miss out on that wonderful recording of the Brahms Ein deutsches Requiem .

I expect I'll keep it, especially now I know it does include notes. Now I just have to get over my Schwarzkopf problem (not the voice; rather, her denial of her Nazi past).

[Mandryka]

I expect I'll keep it, especially now I know it does include notes. Now I just have to get over my Schwarzkopf problem (not the voice; rather, her denial of her Nazi past).

She joined the Party to further her career - no other reason. Any other ambitious person under a totalitarian regime would have done the same. End of story.

I have no problem with her (spurious) Nazi past, but I don't care for her voice at all.

[Thropplenoggin]

She joined the Party to further her career - no other reason. Any other ambitious person under a totalitarian regime would have done the same. End of story.

I have no problem with her (spurious) Nazi past, but I don't care for her voice at all.

It's the fact that she hid it for so long that I find disconcerting.

[Sir Velo]

She joined the Party to further her career - no other reason. Any other ambitious person under a totalitarian regime would have done the same. End of story.

Not so fast!

Paul Hindemith didn't; even Strauss didn't. And others too numerous to mention. Or were they not ambitious?

[Thropplenoggin]

Not so fast!

Paul Hindemith didn't; even Strauss didn't. And others too numerous to mention. Or were they not ambitious?

Are you suggesting that Mandryka is guilty of a sweeping generalisation?

[Dave2002]

Yes, the RO notes are predictably excellent.

I have several recordings of the Alto Rhapsody, so am not in need of the words/translation. They're easily found on the web, anyway.

http://davidsbuendler.freehostia.com/rhap.htm

[richardfinegold]

Phillip Kerrw who writes a series of fictional Detective novels that are set in Nazi Germany, alleges that Schwartzkoff was sleeping with a Nazi Cultural Minister, and then dumped him for Goebbels.

[Barbirollians]

Phillip Kerrw who writes a series of fictional Detective novels that are set in Nazi Germany, alleges that Schwartzkoff was sleeping with a Nazi Cultural Minister, and then dumped him for Goebbels.

Well one cannot libel the dead I suppose .

What next Karajan was having a secret affair with Eva Braun ?

[Nick Armstrong]

Phillip Kerrw who writes a series of fictional Detective novels that are set in Nazi Germany, alleges that Schwartzkoff was sleeping with a Nazi Cultural Minister, and then dumped him for Goebbels.

Perhaps the clue is in the adjective....

[akiralx]

Not so fast!

Paul Hindemith didn't; even Strauss didn't. And others too numerous to mention. Or were they not ambitious?

Strauss didn't, correct - but he did interract quite often with the Nazi regime for the sake of expediency, which at the end of the day is the only real reason Schwarzkopf and Karajan joined the party.

[Pabmusic]

Strauss didn't, correct - but he did interract quite often with the Nazi regime for the sake of expediency, which at the end of the day is the only real reason Schwarzkopf and Karajan joined the party.

Beware of sweeping statements about something you cannot know. Karajan joined the Nazi party in Austria in 1933, five years before the country came under Nazi control. Perhaps he was prescient and wanted to ensure his future after 1938. He joined the party a second time in Germany (just to be on the safe side, perhaps).

As for Strauss, he was appointed head of the Reichsmusikkammer in 1933. We don't know how freely he consented to the appointment, but he insisted he'd never been consulted. The next few years were not easy ones, during which Strauss tried to ignore the ban on Jewish composers. He also successfully completed Die schweigsame Frau, insisting Stefan Zweig's name appear on the programme for the premiere. He was sacked from the Reichsmusikkammer in 1935.

As for the 'expediency' you talk of, much of it concerned his family. His daughter-in-law and grandchildren were Jewish, and Strauss successfully managed to use his international reputation and the influence of Baldur von Schirach (Gauleiter of Vienna, and a friend) to protect them, even though his son and daughter-in-law were arrested and imprisoned by the Gestapo at one point. He didn't succeed in saving his daughter-in-law's parents, despite visits to Theriesenstadt camp. Oh - and he was 68 in 1933, 80 in 1945, perhaps not the prime of youth.

Karajan twice joined the Nazi party (possibly) to further his career; Strauss 'interacted' with the regime to protect his family. It is fortunate that - whatever we think of particular governments - we have never had to deal with comparable pressures.

[verismissimo]

It is fortunate that - whatever we think of particular governments - we have never had to deal with comparable pressures.

Amen.

[Mandryka]

Beware of sweeping statements about something you cannot know. Karajan joined the Nazi party in Austria in 1933, five years before the country came under Nazi control. Perhaps he was prescient and wanted to ensure his future after 1938. He joined the party a second time in Germany (just to be on the safe side, perhaps).

As for Strauss, he was appointed head of the Reichsmusikkammer in 1933. We don't know how freely he consented to the appointment, but he insisted he'd never been consulted. The next few years were not easy ones, during which Strauss tried to ignore the ban on Jewish composers. He also successfully completed Die schweigsame Frau, insisting Stefan Zweig's name appear on the programme for the premiere. He was sacked from the Reichsmusikkammer in 1935.

As for the 'expediency' you talk of, much of it concerned his family. His daughter-in-law and grandchildren were Jewish, and Strauss successfully managed to use his international reputation and the influence of Baldur von Schirach (Gauleiter of Vienna, and a friend) to protect them, even though his son and daughter-in-law were arrested and imprisoned by the Gestapo at one point. He didn't succeed in saving his daughter-in-law's parents, despite visits to Theriesenstadt camp. Oh - and he was 68 in 1933, 80 in 1945, perhaps not the prime of youth.

Karajan twice joined the Nazi party (possibly) to further his career; Strauss 'interacted' with the regime to protect his family. It is fortunate that - whatever we think of particular governments - we have never had to deal with comparable pressures.

Nazi mud-slinging is a pet hate of mine. As you say, we have never had to deal with comparable pressures - this fact alone means we should hold our tongues about matters of which we can only have an imperfect understanding.

Just because someone 'joined' the Nazi Party, it doesn't follow that they were Nazis (ie, believers in racial supremacy, etc). As has been asserted, many joined for reasons of political expediency. Schwarzkopf and Karajan joined early and if you look at their subsequent careers, that would be consonant with the way they typically behaved: Schwarkopf, it should be noted, went on to share the bed of a member of the American occupation forces before marrying a Jew (Walter Legge). Not to put to fine a point on it, she was on the side of whoever might advanced her career/do her a favour. This might not be admirable behaviour, but it is recognisably human. The worst these people can be accused of is a lack of heroism - a charge that would also be levelled, I would suggest, at most of us, if we ever find ourselves in a similar position.

[Thropplenoggin]

Nazi mud-slinging is a pet hate of mine. As you say, we have never had to deal with comparable pressures - this fact alone means we should hold our tongues about matters of which we can only have an imperfect understanding.

Just because someone 'joined' the Nazi Party, it doesn't follow that they were Nazis (ie, believers in racial supremacy, etc). As has been asserted, many joined for reasons of political expediency. Schwarzkopf and Karajan joined early and if you look at their subsequent careers, that would be consonant with the way they typically behaved: Schwarkopf, it should be noted, went on to share the bed of a member of the American occupation forces before marrying a Jew (Walter Legge). Not to put to fine a point on it, she was on the side of whoever might advanced her career/do her a favour. This might not be admirable behaviour, but it is recognisably human. The worst these people can be accused of is a lack of heroism - a charge that would also be levelled, I would suggest, at most of us, if we ever find ourselves in a similar position.

You still haven't addressed the aspect of her behaviour which I find most troubling - the fact that she went to such great lengths to deny these events ever happened: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2006...secondworldwar