Bruckner's 7th Symphony

[Pikaia]

I imagine that performance is about twice as long as Walter's !!!

Walter takes 63:24 in his recording of the 1885 version, Celi takes 86:15 with one of his recordings of the same version.

http://www.abruckner.com/discography/symphonyno7inemajo/

[richardfinegold]

That's an excellent point!

It often bewilders me when some describe Bruckner's music in general as being 'austere' and 'unapproachable'. I've always found it quite the opposite.

However, I do think conductors can instill an 'atmosphere' in any performance. The genial Eugen Jochum did this wonderfully well with Bruckner. There is no Karajan-like closing of the eyes in deep reverence but instead passion and love, mixed with flashes of humour. I'm not knocking the Karajan approach at all, it works very well with this music too.

There is a video recording on YouTube of Jochum conducting Bruckner 7 in Tokyo which demonstrates that the music can still sound grand and magnificent whilst retaining every inch of its innate warmth and 'humanity'.

If any Brucknerian here has not seen this video, they should do so and give themselves a treat!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0F3cjPnEIA

Thank you for that link. I was first exposed to Bruckner via the Jochum Dresden set, and have recently returned to it.

[richardfinegold]

Interesting that Stephen Plaistow has just used this word in his BaL of Mozart's K.310 to describe Dinu Lipatti's playing in the slow movement. SP is invariably spot-on when describing the attributes of different pianists, so why did he single out DL in this way? Did no other pianist in his survey display 'humanity' in their playing? Was there any 'inhumanity' to be heard? - I doubt it; but it's certainly hard to put a finger on exactly what humanity 'means' in the context of any kind of music making. Solomon is, perhaps, another pianist who comes to mind.

I would add Kempff, Arrau, and for the last phase of his career, Rubinstein. The young Rubinstein was more of a showman, but from his middle age he seemed to put himself at the service of music, instead of the reverse. Might this be one of the things we mean when we use the term "humanity" with respect to musicians?

[richardfinegold]

Walter takes 63:24 in his recording of the 1885 version, Celi takes 86:15 with one of his recordings of the same version.

http://www.abruckner.com/discography...onyno7inemajo/

Whoa! If I had a full bladder and I was at the Celi concert, I would consider that as "inhumane".

[Barbirollians]

I think it is something to do with warmth and an ability to sound like it is being played for the benefit of the listener rather than the performer in their own bubble - I would use Walter and Karajan's Mahler 9s as an example - the latter better played but to my ears very cold .

It is a word well used of Lipatti !!!

[BBMmk2]

I have HvK's and Jochum's in my collection. Has Abbado recorded this symphony, and if so, is it up to his usual standard?

[scottycelt]

I have HvK's and Jochum's in my collection. Has Abbado recorded this symphony, and if so, is it up to his usual standard?

Yes, with the VPO, though it's never been in my collection ... and I see there's at least 47 others from which to choose ... talk about being spoilt for choice.

http://www.allmusic.com/album/anton-bruckner-symphony-no-7-in-e-major-mw0001802407

[BBMmk2]

I forgot about Gunther Wand's recording and Haitink's too OMG!! :)

[Petrushka]

Yes, with the VPO, though it's never been in my collection ... and I see there's at least 47 others from which to choose ... talk about being spoilt for choice.

http://www.allmusic.com/album/anton-bruckner-symphony-no-7-in-e-major-mw0001802407

I have a good few of those! I think this must be the symphony I've most often heard in the concert hall (including VPO/Abbado) with accounts from Bernard Haitink with almost every orchestra he's conducted!

In typical Petrushka fashion my favourite Bruckner 7 isn't even included in the above listing! It is on the Andante label and is a live 1976 performance given at the Salzburg Festival with Karl Bohm and the VPO. The commercial recording made at the same time is very good but the live performance just has the edge.

[richardfinegold]

I forgot about Gunther Wand's recording and Haitink's too OMG!! :)

Funny, I also had Jochum & HvK holding down the fort for many years on this work, and then recently added Wand and Haitink. I added the Tink after attending one of the concerts in Chicago that was used for the recording, but I never warmed to the recording. I guess it was a case of enjoying a concert but not wanting to hear the same event repeated.
Lately I've been listening to Kreizberg on Pentatone. The beautiful sonics enhance the experience considerably.

[Mandryka]

On balance, BW is probably my all-time favourite conductor, though I have not heard this performance. It's an annoyance to me that there are so many gaps in his discography - so many important works that he never recorded (I wish we had at least one full-length Wagner opera from him).

Nor have I heard Karajan's final recording - the very last thing he ever recorded, I believe - from 1989. Would anyone recommend it?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

On balance, BW is probably my all-time favourite conductor, though I have not heard this performance. It's an annoyance to me that there are so many gaps in his discography - so many important works that he never recorded (I wish we had at least one full-length Wagner opera from him).

Stravinsky (not the name I would've most readily associated with Walter) also lamented that BW's Fidelio hadn't been committed to disc.

Nor have I heard Karajan's final recording - the very last thing he ever recorded, I believe - from 1989. Would anyone recommend it?

Guess who! The gentlest recording he made of this work, made with the orchestra towards which he felt such gratitude after the previous five or more years of acrimony with the Berliners.

[Petrushka]

Karajan's final recording is a thing of great beauty and I would most certainly recommend it. The completist in me would want it anyway no matter what any reviewer said.

I, too, am coming to see Bruno Walter as a much more important conductor than hitherto and in a century dominated by the giants of Furtwangler, Toscanini, Karajan and Klemperer, Walter's wonderfully humane (that word again!) way with music seems to me to be a realisation of the real truth.

Over the years I have picked up numerous second hand CD's of the Columbia SO recordings but availabillity seems patchy. Let's hope that Sony have more boxes in the pipeline.

[Barbirollians]

Yes there are some gaps that one wishes had been filled - no Bruckner 8 or Mahler 3 & 6-8for example.

I much prefer this Bruckner 7 to many of the others I have heard - Barbirolli , Klemperer and the EMI Karajan would be my other favourites.

[roberta]

Karajan's final recording is a thing of great beauty and I would most certainly recommend it. The completist in me would want it anyway no matter what any reviewer said.

I, too, am coming to see Bruno Walter as a much more important conductor than hitherto and in a century dominated by the giants of Furtwangler, Toscanini, Karajan and Klemperer, Walter's wonderfully humane (that word again!) way with music seems to me to be a realisation of the real truth.

Over the years I have picked up numerous second hand CD's of the Columbia SO recordings but availabillity seems patchy. Let's hope that Sony have more boxes in the pipeline.

i am gonna try bruckner 7 now as part of my musical journey but i want to know what you all mean by humane. it keeps cropping up as a description - whAT do you all mean?