How Many Rings Do You Need?

[Mr Pee]

The Barenboim set will do very well for me. Besides, the cast are very largely the one that played Covent Garden, when I did my very first complete thing under Uncle Bernie Haitink, standing up for the whole shebang in the 90s. (I couldn't do that now of course!)

I agree. I rarely have the time to settle down for an extended Ring session with one set, never mind trying to find the time to listen to more. Barenboim is an excellent modern choice, although I do find the on-stage noises very off-putting on live recordings. And Wagner in English- in fact, Opera in English generally- just doesn't do it for me, I'm afraid. The Goodall's a no-no for that reason alone, quite apart from his ponderous tempi.

Colonel D- my first live Ring was the previous Prom cycle at ROH- Colin Davis, Dir. Gotz Friedrich. I remember trying to stand up at the end of Gotterdammerung and my legs had gone to sleep! A great experience though and a pretty good production. There was a section of stage mounted on hydraulics that rose and fell throughout the cycle to represent different scenes. Perhaps the most striking use of it was as Wotan summoned Erda in Siegfried. He stood on the very edge and was gradually raised to a great height as Erda appeared below. Highly impressive. And the only time the stage was completely flat, if I remember correctly, was the very beginning of Rheingold, and the very end of Gotterdammerung, which symbolised the whole shebang rather well, I thought.

[martin_opera]

I am a relative newcomer to the Ring and have the Levine on DVD and enjoy it a great deal, although I have been told it's too traditional - so what! I have just purchased the Bohm for less than £20 and am blown away by it. I also have the Krauss on my i-pod but tend to shy away from poor sound unless it's absolutely necessary. On the strength of the Bohm I sense it isn't. My next Ring purchase would likely be the Karajan because Solti rarely stirs me and I do fancy hearing the BPO tackle this wonderful music.

Of course every collection needs this Ring http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQlmXU1zqfc

Played with total conviction and nearly always moving me to tears at the end.

[Mr Pee]

I am a relative newcomer to the Ring and have the Levine on DVD and enjoy it a great deal, although I have been told it's too traditional - so what!

The Levine Ring is probably the best recent recording, whether on CD or DVD. And there's nothing wrong with the traditional approach. It's beautifully realised by the Met. And I'd rather have that than some of the more ridiculous modern takes on it that have been offered recently.

[makropulos]

Bohm (Phillips, 1967) - exciting, but a bit superficial and roughly recorded. The ideal Ring for car journeys, though! .

Böhm is the one I would take if I could only have a single Ring cycle. I've always loved its sense of theatre - I don't find it superficial, but it is swift and dramatic.

After that, I'd take Solti and Furtwängler/RAI. Keilberth is very good but yes, I agree, it was rather over-praised when it finally appeared.
Krauss - for some reason - just doesn't do it for me, and I've still not worked out why.
Karajan is at near bottom of my list for all the reasons you give - sonority (even if its beautiful) over drama, and some weird casting.
Totally agree with your description of Janowski.
Goodall...well, this is difficult. Having seen most of the operas in the theatre when the cycle was staged at ENO, and been much moved by them, I feel a sentimental attachment. The translation doesn't worry me, but the vastly slow speeds do become rather impossible on repeated hearing.

On DVD I very much like Barenboim's Bayreuth set, and watch Boulez/Bayreuth occasionally. The Copenhagen Ring grew on me somewhat, the Valencia one did the reverse.

But the one I'd rescue is still Böhm on CD.

[Mandryka]

Good to hear these choices. Keep 'em coming!

I have the Krauss but haven't listened for many years. I can remeber preferring it to the Keilberth, which was issued around about the same time as the most recent Krauss remastering.

As to DVD Rings.....the Levein/Schenk/Schneider-Siemssen Met production is a decent stab at a naturalistic Ring, but - given the Met's limitless financial resources - I'm surprised it isn't better than it is. The dragon in Rheingold is a joke (bad) and the dragon in Siegfried barely exists. Plus, the production itself at times amounts to little more than an old-fashioned 'stand and point' affair.

I've yet to see the whole of the Boulez-Chereau Bayreuth production, but what I have seen of it - Die Walkure, Act 1 - struck me as very imaginative and powerful. It's annoying that the current R2 DVD issue does not include the 'Making Of...' documentary that comes with the R1 version.

What's the general thinking on the most recent Ring recordings? The late 80s/90s efforts by Haitink and Levine don't seem to be that highly rated by collectors, though I think Haitink's cycle is very satisfying as an interpretation - his 'underplaying' of the score really pays off by the time we get to Gotterdammerung. The flaw of both of these versions lies in the casting - Eva Marton and Reiner Goldberg just don't cut the mustard - though they were probably all that was available by the mid-eighties.

[Roehre]

The Levine Ring is probably the best recent recording, whether on CD or DVD. And there's nothing wrong with the traditional approach. It's beautifully realised by the Met. And I'd rather have that than some of the more ridiculous modern takes on it that have been offered recently.

This reasoning is exactly why I would go for Levine on DVD as well.
I've got the Böhm on Philips LPs, the Karajan on DGG LPs and the Janowski on CD.
I prefer the Böhm (though I dislike the stage noises), but am mostly listening to the "neutral" Janowski, which IMO is the best value for money set.

[makropulos]

I've yet to see the whole of the Boulez-Chereau Bayreuth production, but what I have seen of it - Die Walkure, Act 1 - struck me as very imaginative and powerful. It's annoying that the current R2 DVD issue does not include the 'Making Of...' documentary that comes with the R1 version.

What's the general thinking on the most recent Ring recordings? The late 80s/90s efforts by Haitink and Levine don't seem to be that highly rated by collectors, though I think Haitink's cycle is very satisfying as an interpretation - his 'underplaying' of the score really pays off by the time we get to Gotterdammerung. The flaw of both of these versions lies in the casting - Eva Marton and Reiner Goldberg just don't cut the mustard - though they were probably all that was available by the mid-eighties.

As far as the Boulez/Chéreau Ring goes, I agree - the "making of" would be a welcome addition. (I have the old Philips DVDs). Quite a lot of this production is impressive - Act II of Götterdämmerung is well worth watching, I think. As for the most recent Rings - well, you put it very well: Haitink conducts in a deeply satisfying way, but the singers just don't seem up to that level. Similarly, James Morris does no favours to the Levine Ring - I find his Wotan quite a power disincentive, sadly. Of the 21st century ones, Mehta's conducting of the Valencia Ring drives me completely nuts - it seems downright lazy - so many missed opportunities, so little sense of dramatic engagement. Haenchen (Pierre Audi's Netherlands Opera production) is much (much) better, and Schønwandt is more than respectable in the Copenhagen Ring. But do either of them compete with Böhm or Solti - or, more recently, Boulez or Barenboim? I tend to think not. And it was certainly no match for the best conducting of a Ring Cycle I've heard in the last few years: that was Richard Armstrong at Scottish Opera - much of it incredibly impressive in the theatre (especially the Theatre Royal, Glasgow, which is quite a small house).

[Biffo]

The Solti Ring is magnificent and dreadful in equal measure. He is both too fast and too slow, I think this is a combination of the way the work was recorded (in 20 minute chunks) and Solti's inexperience. The Vienna Philharmonic and Birgit Nilsson are magnificent throughout and Solti gets the best out of Windgassen. For some reason Windgassen usually sounds permanently middle-aged in the role of Siegfried, even when he was younger; Solti managed to make him more heroic.

The Keilberth set grows as you listen to it (or at least it did with me); initially I felt it would be dull but Keilberth brings off all the great moments and the cast is excellent. In some ways I prefer Varnay to Nilsson as Brunnhilde (except perhaps when I am listening to Nilsson). The 'stereo' sound doesn't live up to the advanced publicity but is adequate.

I only have Rheingold from Knappertsbusch (Bayreuth 1956); it is dreadfully slow, Hotter sounds bored and the whole thing is disfigured by extravagant coughing from the bronchitic audience. His Act I of Walkure with Flagstad (Eloquence) is fine.

As a supplement to a complete Ring, there is a magnificent set from Profil of Act I of Walkure and Wotan's Farewell (plus other Wagner arias). It was recorded in Dresden in 1944 with Elmendorff conducting the Staatskapelle and excellent soloists. The sound is exceptional in the Walkure excerpts.

[Barbirollians]

Resuscitating an old thread but what is the general view of the Sawallisch Ring . I am always rather cautious about Wagner - though I love Tristan and enjoyed Tannhauser at the ROH I found Parsifal a terrible bore when I saw it a few years ago .

What cycle do you think might convert me ? There being no Barbirolli Ring !

[Chris Newman]

On DVD I have the Mehta from Valencia which is by far the most spectacular production ever. Think Star Wars with magical hi-tech stage effects and you might get the idea or look at the clips on YouTube. Wotan's flight into the underground realm of Nibelheim is worthy of any blockbuster movie. Mehta is not bad but he is no Keilberth/Boulez/Bohm or Solti. If young friends are likely to share the viewing this set will be a definite hit.

I also have the Boulez on DVD which is again a very good interesting production that brings a contemporary approach to the story and is musically more exciting than Mehta. I do not have but have watched parts of Barenboim's Bayreuth Ring and Levine's Met version. Both are rather traditional (old fashioned productions) though Barenboim is musically much more exciting. Barenboim is also available very cheaply if you shop around. Levine has a good Brunnhilde.

On CD I have Bohm's (I think) excellent Bayreuth set and Goodall's ENO Ring. I love the latter because each time listen I learn more about the story (it is sung in English) and I just lie back in wonder at the fabulous cast whose almost every word comes across, whose singing is so beautiful and the orchestra who often genuinely outplay assorted Bayreuth renderings, Solti's VPO and (easily) von Karajan's artificial sounding BPO. Of course, no recording is perfect and I have Knappertsbusch and am building up Keilberth. Sometimes singers are weak or catch microphones badly, Some conductors are weak at your own favourite moments.

I recently gave a friend my set Gunther Neuhold's Ring which I bought for a fiver in Superdrugs. Some of it was impressive and a lot very ordinary: I never got right through it. (I bought the Zinman Beethoven symphonies for a fiver at the same time...but will not part with them)

I think I have enough Ring sets now.

[Mandryka]

Resuscitating an old thread but what is the general view of the Sawallisch Ring . I am always rather cautious about Wagner - though I love Tristan and enjoyed Tannhauser at the ROH I found Parsifal a terrible bore when I saw it a few years ago .

What cycle do you think might convert me ? There being no Barbirolli Ring !

The Sawallisch Ring was televised in the autumn of 1990 (with a concurrent broadcast on R3) - for me, it holds special memories, as it was that autumn that - in search of something new - I started to listen to Wagner recordings from the local library. Found it hard at first, but perservered and by Christmas, I was a Wagnerian! An exciting time.....:)

That said, I don't think the Sawallisch DVD is recommendable, as Harry Kupfer's production struck me then (and strikes me now) as viciously unimaginative (the end of Gotterdammerung consists of Hagen and Brunnhilde basically 'flopping' onto Siegfried's corpse). That said, the singers do not disappoint (Behrens is in this one, as well as the Levine) and Sawallisch keeps it all together nicely (I think he's an underrated conductor). There used to be a an EMI CD box set of this Ring and that's probably the best way to appreciate it.

An awful lot of people seem to recommend Solti and Bohm as the best 'basic' Rings and both have their attractions for the beginner. My first Ring was Karajan's - not many peoples' idea of the best, but I still love it.

The current ROH Parsifal production is so dull it barely qualifies as a staging; though, to be fair, you'll struggle to find a good production of Parsifal anywhere in the world today. Probably best sticking with recordings (there is a separate thread on this).

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

... the singers do not disappoint (Behrens is in this one, as well as the Levine) and Sawallisch keeps it all together nicely (I think he's an underrated conductor). There used to be a an EMI CD box set of this Ring and that's probably the best way to appreciate it.

I agree; I have that boxed set (the most modern recording I have) and I think it's Sawallisch's finest performance on record ever! Just three caveats: Fafner spits very audibly when Wotan prevaricates in Rheingold, there is a prominent Timp roll just before the final moments of the cycle (not heard in any other recording: can't recall it in the score) and EMI could've made better side breaks (particularly in Siegfried which could have fit onto three discs). On the plus side, the Tuba playing is wonderfully rich and sonorous, bringing out Wagner's shading superbly.

My first Ring was Karajan's - not many peoples' idea of the best, but I still love it.

Oh so do I! Far from perfect, but with the best orchestral playing and recording on disc. Had Karajan had Solti's cast (and Sawallisch's Tuba player!) ...

[Biffo]

I have the Sawallisch Ring on CD and while it has many fine things in it, not least Sawallisch's conducting, it is a long way from being the finest recorded performance ever. Behrens is fine but not in the same class as Nilsson or Varnay; Robert Hale is also good but no Hans Hotter (or even Thomas Stewart). Rene Kollo is not my idea of Siegfried at all, Walther or Lohengrin but not Siegfried.

Karajan started to record the Ring all over again for video release but only Rheingold was ever finished. It is a great shame Karajan didn't use his video cast for the audio recording. Stewart is incomparably better than Fischer-Dieskau, Stolze better cast as Mime (rather than Loge) and Schreier a superb Loge.

[Mr Pee]

On DVD I have the Mehta from Valencia which is by far the most spectacular production ever. Think Star Wars with magical hi-tech stage effects and you might get the idea or look at the clips on YouTube. Wotan's flight into the underground realm of Nibelheim is worthy of any blockbuster movie. Mehta is not bad but he is no Keilberth/Boulez/Bohm or Solti. If young friends are likely to share the viewing this set will be a definite hit.

I also have the Boulez on DVD which is again a very good interesting production that brings a contemporary approach to the story and is musically more exciting than Mehta. I do not have but have watched parts of Barenboim's Bayreuth Ring and Levine's Met version. Both are rather traditional (old fashioned productions) though Barenboim is musically much more exciting. Barenboim is also available very cheaply if you shop around. Levine has a good Brunnhilde.

On CD I have Bohm's (I think) excellent Bayreuth set and Goodall's ENO Ring. I love the latter because each time listen I learn more about the story (it is sung in English) and I just lie back in wonder at the fabulous cast whose almost every word comes across, whose singing is so beautiful and the orchestra who often genuinely outplay assorted Bayreuth renderings, Solti's VPO and (easily) von Karajan's artificial sounding BPO. Of course, no recording is perfect and I have Knappertsbusch and am building up Keilberth. Sometimes singers are weak or catch microphones badly, Some conductors are weak at your own favourite moments.

I recently gave a friend my set Gunther Neuhold's Ring which I bought for a fiver in Superdrugs. Some of it was impressive and a lot very ordinary: I never got right through it. (I bought the Zinman Beethoven symphonies for a fiver at the same time...but will not part with them)

I think I have enough Ring sets now.

I watched the Mehta/Velencia Ring on Sky Arts recently and after all the hype I was looking forward to it immensely, having almost bought the Blu-Ray set. I'm afraid that for me it didn't live up to expectations. I found a lot of the effects obtrusive, and the stage hands wheeling cranes around were distracting to say the least.

The Boulez Ring, on the other hand, is a classic and a must-have on DVD. I also have the Levine Ring, which is, I think, an excellent traditional production. The perfect first cycle to own if you want to get to know the work without distracting and confusing production ideas getting in the way.

[Mandryka]

Oh so do I! Far from perfect, but with the best orchestral playing and recording on disc. Had Karajan had Solti's cast (..

I recall reading somewhere that Karajan made a conscious decision to go with younger, smaller-voiced singers who would complement his so-called 'chamber music' approach to the score. Besides which, many of Solti's cast were moving gracefully towards retirement by the late sixties, so using them was probably not going to be an option; and von K apparently didn't get on with Nilsson (a couple of funny stories, which I'm sure we've all heard).