Mahler: Das Klagende Lied

[Richard Barrett]

This is all very interesting. I would say that I know Mahler's symphonies and songs in some detail, but I have no clear image in my mind of this work. I think I've listened once or twice to the first Boulez recording but a long time ago, and I put the Gielen in my Qobuz Favourites when it came out (that's where I put things I'm planning to listen to but haven't yet had time, after which they either get sent back where they came from or transferred to one of my playlists) but haven't got any further. I see that the Haitink is combined with the Third Symphony on an "Originals" reissue. I think it's the kind of thing that Kubelik would have done really well, but his (live) recording isn't on Qobuz as far as I can see. Here

https://mahlerfoundation.org/mahler/discography/das-klagende-lied/

is what is presumably a fairly authoritative list of released recordings.

[Bryn]

This is all very interesting. I would say that I know Mahler's symphonies and songs in some detail, but I have no clear image in my mind of this work. I think I've listened once or twice to the first Boulez recording but a long time ago, and I put the Gielen in my Qobuz Favourites when it came out (that's where I put things I'm planning to listen to but haven't yet had time, after which they either get sent back where they came from or transferred to one of my playlists) but haven't got any further. I see that the Haitink is combined with the Third Symphony on an "Originals" reissue. I think it's the kind of thing that Kubelik would have done really well, but his (live) recording isn't on Qobuz as far as I can see. Here

https://mahlerfoundation.org/mahler/discography/das-klagende-lied/

is what is presumably a fairly authoritative list of released recordings.

I have my doubts regarding some of the "1880 Original Version" attributions. As mentioned earlier, the Jurowski appears to be 2 harps and a boy alto short of the original scoring. I wish I could find my copy of the Nagano.

[Richard Barrett]

the Jurowski appears to be 2 harps and a boy alto short of the original scoring

Does the original scoring feature different parts for all six harps, I wonder? I'm guessing that there would be many unisons between them, so that the only real difference would be in volume, which isn't so important in a recording anyway.

[Bryn]

Does the original scoring feature different parts for all six harps, I wonder? I'm guessing that there would be many unisons between them, so that the only real difference would be in volume, which isn't so important in a recording anyway.

The Jurowski is a video of a concert performance at the RFH, 19th September 2007.

[Richard Barrett]

The Jurowski is a video of a concert performance at the RFH, 19th September 2007.

That is clear.

[LHC]

I have my doubts regarding some of the "1880 Original Version" attributions. As mentioned earlier, the Jurowski appears to be 2 harps and a boy alto short of the original scoring. I wish I could find my copy of the Nagano.

Jurowksi's performance does include a boy soprano in the last two movements.

[Richard Barrett]

I'm listening to Gielen now. Very clear and atmospheric sound.

[Bryn]

Jurowksi's performance does include a boy soprano in the last two movements.

But no boy alto. My understanding is that the original version had solo parts for both boy soprano and boy alto.

[Roslynmuse]

Does the original scoring feature different parts for all six harps, I wonder? I'm guessing that there would be many unisons between them, so that the only real difference would be in volume, which isn't so important in a recording anyway.

Just dug out my copy of the UE score used for the Nagano recording. Although six harps are listed as required, the footnote says "verdopplung von 2 notierten Harfen" and from a quick flick through I can only see one place where all six are used, for four bars of C major chords as the the chorus sings "Freude! Heia" at bars 85-8 of the "Hochzeitsstuck".

Mahler specifies two boy soloists as well as the adult vocal quartet.

Edit - there are also half a dozen places in the opening movement where M asks for six harps, sometimes in unison, sometimes 3 plus 3. There's one other short patch in the third mt too. Often he uses 4 harps, 2 plus 2. He's often getting them to play arpeggio figures, or chords with 8 notes, and I wonder whether he was simply after volume, or the effect of hearing several instruments playing the same thing but with tiny differences in timing to create that bardic quality which seems so appropriate to this rather grim legend. I can see I'm going to have to dig out the concert programme from '97 to see how many harps Nagano had on the platform!

[Roslynmuse]

Found the programme - 7th October 1997 - and there were indeed six harps used!

[Richard Barrett]

I wonder whether he was simply after volume, or the effect of hearing several instruments playing the same thing but with tiny differences in timing

We'll never know of course but I'm inclined to think it's the former, since having multiple harps in unison is quite a common feature in the orchestral repertoire. Shostakovich for example usually writes for two harps which are always or almost always in unison, and I don't think he's generally aiming at a bardic quality! In Mahler's 8th Symphony at least four harps are needed but they never play more than two different parts. And so on.

edit: by the way I got to the end of the Gielen recording earlier on today, having started it a couple of times before being interrupted. Highly recommended. The final chord nearly knocked me out of my seat.

[BBMmk2]

Alas, BBM, the Klagende Lied in the Universal, "Gustav Mahler: The Complete Edition", is the Chailly recording. I don't think that Abbado ever recorded it. The 'Knaben Wunderhorn' in the box is, though, the Abbado recording so not difficult to confuse the two works.

0089 477 8825 is the catalogue number. The box set is The Complete Gustav Mahler Edition.

[Richard Barrett]

0089 477 8825 is the catalogue number. The box set is The Complete Gustav Mahler Edition.

I see a few online references to that release which mention the recording of Das klagende Lied or contain a complete tracklist with performers (Presto, Classics Today, jpc etc.) and they all say that it's the Chailly recording!

[Bryn]

I see a few online references to that release which mention the recording of Das klagende Lied or contain a complete tracklist with performers (Presto, Classics Today, jpc etc.) and they all say that it's the Chailly recording!

It also sounds identical to the single-disc Chailly recording.