John McCabe

[peterthekeys]

This morning's programme included a review of the new boxed set of all the CBSO recordings under Louis Fremaux, and - as I hoped when I heard about this on the trailer - it includes their recordings of John McCabe's Symphony no.2 and the orchestral song-cycle Notturni ed Alba (magnificent work in a magnificent performance, with Jill Gomez at her ravishing best.) They've been out of the catalogues for a while, and it's really good to see them available again - even if only as part of a big box set.

They played a bit from Notturni ed Alba during the programme - I was hoping that they'd leave it running for a bit longer, but no such luck (immediately after the point where they faded out the extract, there's a truly terrifying whip-crack which marks the start of the setting of Petronius' poem "Somnia" (about nightmares) which is the climax of the work.)

Can't recommend it strongly enough. McCabe's music is ridiculously neglected at the moment - IMHO he was one of the most important composers of the last part of the 20th century.

[pastoralguy]

McCabe's 'Chagall Windows' was the first 'modern' work I ever heard performed in a live concert. Inevitably, it was 1977 so I don't remember anything about it but I was very pleased to get a cd of it. It's an interesting piece and well worth hearing.

It's perhaps worth mentioning that Hyperion's site has a sale on just now which includes the 4th Symphony and the Flute Concerto for only £2.50. It finishes soon so don't hesitate if you're interested.

[Richard Tarleton]

the orchestral song-cycle Notturni ed Alba (magnificent work in a magnificent performance, with Jill Gomez at her ravishing best.)

I caught this on the car radio - it sounded fabulous. Ashamed to say I don't know McCabe at all......

[Gordon]

McCabe's 'Chagall Windows' was the first 'modern work I ever heard performed in a live concert. Inevitably, it was 1977 so I don't remember anything about it but I was very pleased to get a cd of it. It's an interesting piece and well worth hearing.

I have the Chagall Windows by Halle Loughran [another neglected conductor?] on an EMI disc and have enjoyed it. It also has Symphony 2 and Notturni et Alba with Fremaux/CBSO. I also have a couple of his string quartets on Hyperion which are worth a listen too.

My first piece of his was the Symphony "Elegy" on a Pye LP [LPO and John Snashall, IIRC done at the Barking TH] which I got on spec out of the Wembley lending library around 1970 when I worked nearby. Nice piece and I still have a copy of that LP recording which I also have on a Naxos CD [8.571 370] with some other pieces of his.

As a performer his Haydn piano sonatas are worth a listen.

[Pulcinella]

The former coupling, which I have, and which has just been mentioned by Gordon, is available here:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/McCabe-Chagall-Windows-Symphony-Notturni/dp/B000026BZO/ref=sr_1_7?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1503744964&sr=1-7&keywords=Mccabe

Chagall Windows, Symphony 2, Notturni ed albi.

McCabe came in for a bit of a beating recently on the Haydn Piano sonatas thread.
Don't know any other of his music, but tempted by Edward II; anyone know it?

(Could a kind host move this thread into the Composers subforum, perhaps?)

[pastoralguy]

I'd certainly agree that Loughran is an unfairly neglected conductor. Even today, his 1970's Brahms' recordings are very highly regarded.

[peterthekeys]

The former coupling, which I have, and which has just been mentioned by Gordon, is available here:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/McCabe-Chagall-Windows-Symphony-Notturni/dp/B000026BZO/ref=sr_1_7?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1503744964&sr=1-7&keywords=Mccabe

Chagall Windows, Symphony 2, Notturni ed albi.

That's the one I've got. But it's now deleted (the copies on Amazon are all secondhand or old stock.) Hence my delight that it's now back in circulation with the new boxed set. (The symphony is also a masterpiece - inspired by the film "The Wild Bunch" (not so much by the violence, but what McCabe perceived as the "extraordinarily satisfying, thoroughly musical shape of the work".))

If you'll bear with me, I have a tale to relate which has some bearing on McCabe's neglect (might have mentioned it before - can't remember. Apologies if so.) I studied at college with Harold Truscott, who was a keen admirer of McCabe's music (as well as a close friend of his.) He once told me that two works of which he was particularly fond were "Voyage" (a big choral work, to words by McCabe's wife), and "The Teachings of Don Juan" (a choral ballet, based on the book by Carlos Castaneda about his experiences with Don Juan Matus, a native American sorcerer.) I made a note to investigate them, but didn't do anything about it (neither has been recorded or published.) Soon after McCabe's death, I decided it was time to have a look at both these works - so I got in touch with McCabe's publishers and asked if they could make me one-off copies of both works. Reply was that they were hire only, so I couldn't have copies. I said that I was prepared to pay whatever they asked and that the copies were for private study only, and pointed out that copies "out there" might just conceivably play a part in encouraging performances (e.g. money clinking into the coffers!) They just reiterated that the works were hire only. Finally, after more argument, they said that they could let me have copies on perusal for a month. I said that that was not ideal, as being an amateur musician, it would take longer than that for me to assimilate these large and complex works. They suggested letting me have the copies for 6 months, so I agreed to that.

I didn't hear anything more for about a fortnight, so contacted the publishers again to remind them of the agreement. At that point, they told me that after all, they couldn't let me have copies on perusal - the reason being that they didn't have copies themselves! And that's where the matter was left. (And presumably a conductor interested in performing either of these works would be met with the same answer.)

And people wonder why music becomes neglected ...

[peterthekeys]

I'd certainly agree that Loughran is an unfairly neglected conductor. Even today, his 1970's Brahms' recordings are very highly regarded.

Totally agree. In the early '70s, he recorded Brian's 10th and 21st symphonies with the Leicestershire Schools Symphony Orchestra for Unicorn - it was my introduction to Brian's music, and I still think that his performance of no.10 hasn't yet been bettered (the recent one by Brabbins was a big disappointment, particularly after his stunning account of the Gothic at the Proms in 2011.) (Late in 1974, Loughran conducted the Halle in Brian 10 at the Free Trade Hall: I was there, and in my opinion, that performance was even better than the recording. I think the BBC recorded it, but I'm not sure if it was ever broadcast.)

[peterthekeys]

It's perhaps worth mentioning that Hyperion's site has a sale on just now which includes the 4th Symphony and the Flute Concerto for only £2.50. It finishes soon so don't hesitate if you're interested.

Thanks for that tip - will definitely investigate.

[Stanfordian]

Thanks for that tip - will definitely investigate.

Hiya peterthekeys,

I was a regular at Free Trade Hall for nearly two decades when I live inManchester. I attended many of Loughran's concerts with the Hallé but looking back I am left rather non plused by his conducting. I found him steady rather than inspiring.

[BBMmk2]

I rather like McCabe's music. The Chagall Windows was the first work I heard by him. then his brass band music was such a welcome. Although the conservatives amongst the movement abhorred the works. It's a gereat pity that the brass band fraternity can be lik this, because it just doesn't do our movement any good.

[pastoralguy]

I rather like McCabe's music. The Chagall Windows was the first work I heard by him. then his brass band music was such a welcome. Although the conservatives amongst the movement abhorred the works. It's a gereat pity that the brass band fraternity can be lik this, because it just doesn't do our movement any good.

I think that applies to all arts, bbm. 'I know what I like and like what I know...'

[Serial_Apologist]

I think that applies to all arts, bbm. 'I know what I like and like what I know...'

But quite ridiculous in the case of John McCabe, who was, by any norms, really quite a conservative composer for his era, when one compares music he has composed with others' for brass bands, including Iain Hamilton, and Sirs Peter Maxwell Davies and Harrison Birtwistle.

[BBMmk2]

But quite ridiculous in the case of John McCabe, who was, by any norms, really quite a conservative composer for his era, when one compares music he has composed with others' for brass bands, including Iain Hamilton, and Sirs Peter Maxwell Davies and Harrison Birtwistle.

But a damn fine conservative composer, SA!

[Serial_Apologist]

But a damn fine conservative composer, SA!

Oh, I agree entirely, Bbm!

Sometimes what can appear immediately conservative in musical terms is not, as Sir Peter Maxwell Davies found in Sibelius, and Schoenberg in Brahms. And me in Schoenberg, by the way, but there again, what do I know?