First Three Tchaikovsky Symphonies

[Conchis]

I recently picked this up in a charity shop:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Symphonies-Arensky-Variations-Lso-Dorati/dp/B0000041JT/ref=sr_1_12?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1483566790&sr=1-12&keywords=tchaikovsky%2C+dorati

These are the best performances I've heard of these early symphonies - better even than Markevitch and Karajan. Dorati gets a very authentic 'Russian' sound from the LSO and the analogue recordings are vital and colourful.

I've never been that much of a fan of the first three, but this recording is -as they say - a game-changer for me!

[pastoralguy]

Nice find. Well done!

The Dorati version is very fine although I do have a soft spot for Herbie and his band's Tchaikovsky No.2. (I remember my mother taking me to Rae Mac's in South Queensferry Street, Edinburgh for my 16th birthday and she bought me FOUR full price DG Lps!)

But both versions are excellent and have helped put this wonderful music in its rightful place in music lover's affections.

[Dave2002]

I had to check to see if these are in any of the Mercury box sets. It seems they are - http://www.deccaclassics.com/au/cat/4787896 - CDs 10 and 11.

I think I've got that one somewhere, so will give the CDs a spin shortly.

We had a thread recently about Tchaikovsky symphonies.

[BBMmk2]

I had to check to see if these are in any of the Mercury box sets. It seems they are - http://www.deccaclassics.com/au/cat/4787896 - CDs 10 and 11.

I think I've got that one somewhere, so will give the CDs a spin shortly.

We had a thread recently about Tchaikovsky symphonies.

Yes, Tchaikovsky Symphony Cycles. (Started by yours truly)

[Alain Maréchal]

better even than Markevitch

I disagree, but they are very good.

[Dave2002]

I disagree, but they are very good.

Both with the LSO I notice.

[BBMmk2]

Having not heard those versions mentioned already, just wondering about Gergiev's with the LSO, on their own label? Thoughts?

[richardfinegold]

The Dorati recordings have long been regarded as amongst the best recordings of 1-3 (or, for that matter, 1-6, no Manfred afaik). Gergiev? I haven't heard all 6, to be fair. Of the one that I have heard, I really dislike the acoustic, it sounds like a closet. And the conducting is nothing special in such a crowded recording field.
The Ormandy box on Sony is an amazing bargain and my personal favorite is Muti and the Philharmonia, also very cheap on Brilliant Classics

[Dave2002]

I was trying to find out which orchestras Markevitch was associated with, but he seems to have recorded with very many - not a consistent pattern, see - https://www.discogs.com/artist/448010-Igor-Markevitch

He had been associated with the Lamoreux Orchestra, and also the Monte-Carlo Orchestra, as well as a Spanish one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Markevitch

Dorati, on the other hand, was associated for a long time with a few orchestras - in particular the Minneapolis and the Detroit SOs. That is why I was surprised and curious about his Tchaikovsky symphony recordings, which are with the LSO. I assumed initially when the charity shop bargain was pointed out that it would be with the Detroit orchestra, since many Mercury recordings were made with that orchestra.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antal_Dor%C3%A1ti

[Alain Maréchal]

I assumed initially when the charity shop bargain was pointed out that it would be with the Detroit orchestra, since many Mercury recordings were made with that orchestra.

Most of Dorati's Mercury Living Presence recordings were with the Minneapolis SO and the LSO. I do not think Mercury recorded Dorati in Detroit, but Decca did, later.
The history of what Mercury recorded is confusing, but if you check the Amazon reviews of the recent huge box set reissues, there are some very detailed explanations (and some entertainingly acrimonious exchanges, *of the type that we never find on this forum).

*engage irony filter.

[mikealdren]

Dorati actually made lots of recordings with the LSO in the 60s for Mercury and Philips including not only all the Tchiak symphonies and The Nutcracker but also various violin concertos with Szeryng, the Listz Hungarian Rhapsodies, Enescu Romanian Rhapsody No.1 Firebird, Dvorak symphonies, Haydn symphonies and many more.

[seabright]

Dorati actually made lots of recordings with the LSO in the 60s for Mercury and Philips including not only all the Tchiak symphonies and The Nutcracker but also various violin concertos with Szeryng, the Listz Hungarian Rhapsodies, Enescu Romanian Rhapsody No.1 Firebird, Dvorak symphonies, Haydn symphonies and many more.

Not forgetting the four Tchaikovsky Orchestral Suites which Dorati recorded for Mercury with the New Philharmonia. We don't hear these in the concert hall much these days, nor indeed on the radio, yet they all contain some really lovely music. Indeed, Boult thought the Suite No. 3 fully deserved a place alongside the six symphonies and recorded it twice. If memory serves, it was his EMI version with the LPO that was the top choice of the work in a BAL some time ago.

Maybe the Proms organisers could arrange for all four Tchaikovsky Suites to played in a single season sometime. In particular, it would be fun to see the four accordionists required for the 2nd Suite's 'Scherzo Burlesque' up on the RAH platform. It would be a new and unique experience for all concerned, since the last Proms performance of the work took place as long ago as 1930!

[Dave2002]

I do not think Mercury recorded Dorati in Detroit, but Decca did, later.

It is confusing trying to keep track of who recorded what, and which "label" the recordings appear(ed) on. I see now that Warner are using the Decca label for some issues (or so it appears to me) and some of the "Decca" issues may well be Mercury recordings - or presented as such. There seems to be a whole lot of post hoc rebranding.

You're probably right about the particular recordings, though.

[richardfinegold]

I was trying to find out which orchestras Markevitch was associated with, but he seems to have recorded with very many - not a consistent pattern, see - https://www.discogs.com/artist/448010-Igor-Markevitch

He had been associated with the Lamoreux Orchestra, and also the Monte-Carlo Orchestra, as well as a Spanish one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Igor_Markevitch

Dorati, on the other hand, was associated for a long time with a few orchestras - in particular the Minneapolis and the Detroit SOs. That is why I was surprised and curious about his Tchaikovsky symphony recordings, which are with the LSO. I assumed initially when the charity shop bargain was pointed out that it would be with the Detroit orchestra, since many Mercury recordings were made with that orchestra.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antal_Dor%C3%A1ti

Dorati united with the Detroit SO in the 1980s, long after the label (Mercury) stopped recording Classical Music.
I was in Medical School in Detroit in Dorati had his tenure there. Decca made some great sounding recordings in Detroit's Orchestra Hall--the Miraculous Mandarin, a Copland album, Szymanowski Symphonies are the ones that I remember best

[Alison]

Having not heard those versions mentioned already, just wondering about Gergiev's with the LSO, on their own label? Thoughts?

You would think this repertoire would suit Gergiev and the LSO but I find their set pretty disappointing overall, with only the likeable Third coming anywhere near to delivering the goods.