Liszt's Piano Music

[silvestrione]

I read two lengthy reviews of the Hilmes and saw nothing in it for me - it has the look of yet another trawl through the secondary sources and as you say is not about the music.

NB Walker - it is a great read - second time through I even read all the voluminous footnotes which are every bit as fascinating as the main text . Up there with David Cairns's Berlioz. He met or knew just about every figure of musical consequence in the 19th century, from Beethoven to Tchaikovsky and beyond....

There is also an excellent earlier (1970) book edited by Alan Walker, Franz Liszt, the Man and his Music, which has superb essays by Louis Kentner, John Ogdon, and David Wilde on the piano music.

You may find it, as I did, in your local library!

[Thropplenoggin]

Some great contributions so far - many thanks.

The 6 Consolations are very Chopin-esque. I only discovered these today (Nelson Freire) - very nice they are, too. What of contemporary Liszt interpreters? HD mentions Chamayou. I'm eager to hear Trifonov. And this disc of miscellaneous Liszt by Lugansky seems to have an endeared itself with the Amazon fraternity: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Liszt-Franz...liszt+lugansky

[EdgeleyRob]

There are a couple of cracking Philips Duo sets,
Complete Etudes,Arrau,Magaloff
Complete Années,Brendel,Kocsis.

The best Sposalizio ever played by Brendel in his front room

http://youtu.be/b-XjrjzXjjA

Link may not work,bit of difficulty with the hotel wi-fi,it's on you tube anyway.

[richardfinegold]

Richard Tarleton describes Liszt as lovable. I offer the following Liszt quotation for your consideration.
"The day will come when all nations amidst which the Jews are dwelling will have to raise the question of their whole wholesale expulsion , a question which will be one of peaceful existence or perpetual social fever."
from Are These Things So?

You will pardon me if I am unable to understand how such an individual can be considered lovable.

Quite independently of his Political Convictions, to paraphrase Richard Strauss, I find Liszt to be a second rate Second Rate
Composer. I think he suffered from terrible Compositional Logorrhea. I don't think anyone will disagree that not everything he wrote was a masterpiece, but Mr Tarleton notes that Leslie Howard took 99 CDs to record his entire published output. I would have to be waterboarded for at least a week to compel me to listen to 99 CDs of Liszt. I can't claim to have heard this 'lovable' composer's complete output but I have explored it through the years, and I would identify enough music to fill up about 2, perhaps 3, Cds of compositions that I would want to hear again. the Sonata. the Mephisto Waltz, a few of the Transcendental Etudes (a pompous title if there ever was one), a few of the Years of Pilgrimage Works, and that does it for me. I hope to God I never waste another half hour of my life trying to like one of his Operatic Fantasies.
but don't take it from just me
The Pianist Kenneth Hamilton, in an op ed Piece for the New York Times in 2011, has a few interesting quotes:
"Mendelssohn though Liszt a wonderful interpreter of others' music who lacked creativity in his own. Chopin remained notably noncommittal; the silence itself was instructive. Berlioz progressed from not entirely disinterested support of Liszt's creative efforts to outright condemnation.
Rober Schumann speculated in print that Liszt's flaws as a composer would be obvious even in his most mature works. Schumann's wife, Clara, was blunter in private, calling Liszt's compositions tasteless and a 'chaos of dissonances'. "

Actually, I am a bit more generous than those contemporaries. I actually agree with the OP that some of Liszt's later music sounds as if it could be Debussy, and I regard that as a compliment.
Sorry, but I felt someone had to shine the light of reality on this Listzian fanboy thread

[visualnickmos]

"Sorry, but I felt someone had to shine the light of reality on this Listzian fanboy thread".

And absolutely correct that you should.

[Richard Tarleton]

Richard Tarleton describes Liszt as lovable. I offer the following Liszt quotation for your consideration.
"The day will come when all nations amidst which the Jews are dwelling will have to raise the question of their whole wholesale expulsion , a question which will be one of peaceful existence or perpetual social fever."
from Are These Things So?

You will pardon me if I am unable to understand how such an individual can be considered lovable.

Richard, I am surprised by the tone of your post and you'll forgive me if I only deal a couple of points just now, as I haven't had my breakfast - but, alas, these lines were written not by Liszt but by Princess Carolyne von Sayn-Wittgenstein and published in his name, without his knowledge, when she was living as a recluse in Rome and revising his writings and he was a thousand miles away. This passage and these views were entirely her own, and in no way representative of his. She did him a grave disservice both in his lifetime and (it appears ) to this day, among people who do not trouble to read the full story. I refer you to his letter to the editor of the Gazette de Hongrie, dated 6 February 1883, in Budapest. To understand Liszt's complex relationship with the princess and understand why he simply didn't disown her outright you'll just have to read vols 2 and 3 of Walker I'm afraid.

As for Leslie Howard, I don't think there's the remotest chance I'll listen to all 99 CDs, but at the price of 6 full-price CDs the chance to familiarise myself with some of the less frequented pieces is very worthwhile. You're entitled to your opinion of the operatic paraphrases of course, I've heard one or two of them played to great effect in concert which made me interested to explore the rest, and very fine some of them are too.

The other composers - Chopin died in 1849, and was thus unfamiliar with much of Liszt's output. Mendelssohn in 1847. His relationships with the likes of Robert and Clara, the latter in particular (I would excuse the unfortunate Robert, d. 1856) and Berlioz tell you as much about them as they do about him.

[Thropplenoggin]

Thanks, RT, for correcting this misconception.

I'm somewhat bemused as to why some 'light' had to be cast on this 'fanboy' thread. I thought it was simply the case that like-minded members were simply sharing their knowledge and admiration for Liszt's piano music, as well as recommended albums.

[zola]

What of contemporary Liszt interpreters? HD mentions Chamayou. I'm eager to hear Trifonov. And this disc of miscellaneous Liszt by Lugansky seems to have an endeared itself with the Amazon fraternity: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Liszt-Franz...liszt+lugansky

I would put in a word for Dinara Klinton's release of the transcendental etudes earlier this year which is in danger of being swamped by the new Trifonov and Girstein releases, especially since it only now appears available at an eye watering price ( I acquired it earlier this year at a "normal" price )

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Liszt-DExecution-Klinton-CLASSICS-GEN16409/dp/B01K8L5PGO/ref=sr_1_3?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1474270320&sr=1-3&keywords=dinara+klinton

[BBMmk2]

Daniil Trifonov has recorded an excellent disc of the Transcendental Studies. I do rather like Jorge Bolet's Liszt.

[visualnickmos]

Thanks, RT, for correcting this misconception.
I'm somewhat bemused as to why some 'light' had to be cast on this 'fanboy' thread. I thought it was simply the case that like-minded members were simply sharing their knowledge and admiration for Liszt's piano music, as well as recommended albums.

Indeed, RT, thanks. I agree that it's important to have the misconceptions corrected where possible.

And - Throp nog; I agree with your point, too, but it is inevitable that a thread like this will cover 'the man as well as the music'.... which I think is fine.

[gurnemanz]

Something of a late discoverer of Liszt. Favourite recordings which come to mind are Louis Lortie Années de Pèlerinage on a great sounding Fazioli piano from Chandos, Daniel Barenboim's CD ofWagner Transcriptions, Leslie Howard's complete Schubert Lieder transcriptions and Krystian Zimerman in the B Minor Sonata.

[vinteuil]

I'm always interested to hear a HIP piano approach in such repertoire. The label website offers two generous excerpts: http://www.sfzmusic.co.uk/cd-danielgrimwoo.html

... thanks for that - some interesting reviews. Of course I particularly approved of -

"this is an important double-disc which helps to support our conviction that the future for romantic, classical and pre-classical keyboard music lies with musicians who explore them on good period instruments, which should bring new insights even to those who prefer to stick by modern Steinways, as do many celebrity pianists and their audiences... "

In which vein I wd also recommend the work of Thomas Hitzlberger -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0000E39N9

.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000KLQYWM

- both on the 1873 Steingraeber 'Liszt' piano

[Thropplenoggin]

... thanks for that - some interesting reviews. Of course I particularly approved of -

"this is an important double-disc which helps to support our conviction that the future for romantic, classical and pre-classical keyboard music lies with musicians who explore them on good period instruments, which should bring new insights even to those who prefer to stick by modern Steinways, as do many celebrity pianists and their audiences... "

In which vein I wd also recommend the work of Thomas Hitzlberger -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0000E39N9

.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000KLQYWM

- both on the 1873 Steingraeber 'Liszt' piano

Thanks, vinteuil, for these recommendations. The Hitzlberger appears to be on Qobuz so I should be able to listen via my subscription.

[Richard Tarleton]

Like with silvestrione's recommendations, I'll seek some of yours out, too, on Qobuz, and look forward to hearing your thoughts on the new discs once you've listened to Saturday's programme.

I now have, and an excellent hour it is too - SW's pianistic insights quite outstanding I thought, Record Review at its best

The Melvyn Tan Sonata - fascinating, clear textures. The Russo disc - the Via Crucis is one of the Hyperion complete set I hadn't yet got to, so I'm grateful for the pointer. I don't think I'll be pursuing that Naxos disc....but the discussion of the T. Studies was excellent, I thought. I liked SW's explanation of what the term actually means in this context - transcending what was thought possible on the piano, transcending what was thought of as an étude, transcending the physical realm [Romantic obsession with the supernatural]....and I liked Gerstein's "pianistic Darwinism" - incidentally the prospect of a CD booklet discussion with Tom Service will be a major recommendation for some on this forum . And the Trifonov sounded, well, pretty transcendental. Both pretty tempting actually. The Russo a useful compliation but I already have much of it in several versions, all of it in at least one....

A major theme to emerge from the discussion was the importance of Liszt's later works.

PS Alan Walker describes the transcriptions from the Mozart Requiem as one of the composer's best-kept secrets even among Liszt players - they are superb - again probably prompted by the death of daughter Blandine in 1862.

[BBMmk2]

Marc-Andre Hamlin, Martha Argerich, Jorge Bolet for Liszt's Piano Sonata in B minor