Jascha Horenstein on Pristine Audio--Part I

[richardfinegold]

I am presuming that both of the names in the Header are known quantities, but just in case, J.H. was a well known Conductor active in the U.K. after WWII
until his death in 1971, and Pristine Audio is a label dedicated to the sonic restoration of Historical Performances.
Andrew Rose, the CEO of Pristine, has been working with a descendent of J.H., and quite a few concert performances and studio recordings are being issued
by the label. I have recently bought 3 of these:
1) Mahler 5, a Concert broadacast (1961, Edinburgh Festival, with the Berlin PO);
2) Beethoven 9, with a German Radio Orchestra, a "restoration' of a vox Studio recording,
3) Brahms 1st Symphony/Bruch Scottish Fantasy, with Oistrakh, a set of stereo recordings made for Readers Digest.

I have to quit goofing off from work now, but having listened to these 3 extensively over the past week, a mini review will follow

[Tony Halstead]

I am presuming that both of the names in the Header are known quantities, but just in case, J.H. was a well known Conductor active in the U.K. after WWII
until his death in 1971, and Pristine Audio is a label dedicated to the sonic restoration of Historical Performances.
Andrew Rose, the CEO of Pristine, has been working with a descendent of J.H., and quite a few concert performances and studio recordings are being issued
by the label. I have recently bought 3 of these:
1) Mahler 5, a Concert broadacast (1961, Edinburgh Festival, with the Berlin PO);
2) Beethoven 9, with a German Radio Orchestra, a "restoration' of a vox Studio recording,
3) Brahms 1st Symphony/Bruch Scottish Fantasy, with Oistrakh, a set of stereo recordings made for Readers Digest.

I have to quit goofing off from work now, but having listened to these 3 extensively over the past week, a mini review will follow

He was still very much alive in 1972 and some of 1973.. I took part in several recordings made by JH with the LSO in those years.
'Wiki' gives his dates as:
"24 April] 1898 – 2 April 1973".

[richardfinegold]

He was still very much alive in 1972 and some of 1973.. I took part in several recordings made by JH with the LSO in those years.
'Wiki' gives his dates as:
"24 April] 1898 – 2 April 1973".

I defer I was going off the top of my rather flat head

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

- very possibly the most neglected (by the recording studios) of the great 20th Century composers - most of his recorded legacy comes from off-air recordings of live events (and the studio recordings are often with less-prestigious orchestras, which he makes sound like the very best there could be). He worked quite frequently with the BBC Northern Symphony Orchestra in Manchester in the '60s - with Barbirolli at the Hallé at the same time, it must have been a golden age for Lancastrian concert-goers.

There is also a superbly-performed Live Mahler #7 with the New Philharmonia from 1969 - with, IIRC, at least one of of our fellow Forumistas playing quite magnificently in the Horn section. It'd be very good if Pristine gave that their attention. In the meanwhile, that BPO Mahler#5 might tempt me to dust the cobwebs off my wallet.

[Richard Tarleton]

He was still very much alive in 1972 and some of 1973.. I took part in several recordings made by JH with the LSO in those years.
'Wiki' gives his dates as:
"24 April] 1898 – 2 April 1973".

I (last) saw him in 1972 - RFH, Dvorak Cello Concerto with Tortelier, Bruckner 6....not sure which orchestra, I thought it was the Philharmonia. could it have been the LSO, Tony? First sighting was in Exeter with Hornspieler's lot, Also Sprach, in 1971, I think there may have been a Bruckner 3 in between....

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I took part in several recordings made by JH with the LSO in those years.

Aha! Ididn'tRC! The Mahler #3 with the LSO, perhaps? (I remember a discussion on the old BBC messageboards some years - and nom-de-web changes - ago! The playing was, nonetheless, quite splendid.)


And the LSO, need I add, could never be referred to as one of the "less-prestigious" orchestras!

[HighlandDougie]

I am presuming that both of the names in the Header are known quantities, but just in case, J.H. was a well known Conductor active in the U.K. after WWII
until his death in 1971, and Pristine Audio is a label dedicated to the sonic restoration of Historical Performances.
Andrew Rose, the CEO of Pristine, has been working with a descendent of J.H., and quite a few concert performances and studio recordings are being issued
by the label. I have recently bought 3 of these:
1) Mahler 5, a Concert broadacast (1961, Edinburgh Festival, with the Berlin PO);
2) Beethoven 9, with a German Radio Orchestra, a "restoration' of a vox Studio recording,
3) Brahms 1st Symphony/Bruch Scottish Fantasy, with Oistrakh, a set of stereo recordings made for Readers Digest.

I have to quit goofing off from work now, but having listened to these 3 extensively over the past week, a mini review will follow

Although the Readers Digest recordings used Decca engineers (most notably Kenneth Wilkinson), the Bruch Scottish Fantasia was a genuine Decca recording and Decca release, coupled with the Hindemith Violin Concerto. I have an excellent Japanese remastering (K2HD - whatever that might be) so will be interested to hear what Andrew Rose has made of it. Scribendum has recently reissued some of the Unicorn recordings (no Robert Simpson, alas).

[Barbirollians]

That Oistrakh Hindemith Violin Concerto is something on a different plane . The work sounds vastly less interesting in any other hands .

[HighlandDougie]

That Oistrakh Hindemith Violin Concerto is something on a different plane . The work sounds vastly less interesting in any other hands .

Hmm, while not denying the merits of the Oistrakh, "any other hands" is a bit sweeping. Frank Peter Zimmerman (live and recorded) is no less interesting - in fact, if I dare, ever so slightly more interesting.

[Barbirollians]

Hmm, while not denying the merits of the Oistrakh, "any other hands" is a bit sweeping. Frank Peter Zimmerman (live and recorded) is no less interesting - in fact, if I dare, ever so slightly more interesting.

FPZ rather a "safe" violinist to my ears .

[HighlandDougie]

I've seen/heard FPZ maybe a dozen times live and "safe" wouldn't be the first word that springs to mind - and certainly not in the Hindemith Concerto, where he made what can seem a bit dull pretty exciting. But my idea of "exciting" might well be Barbs's definition of "safe".

[frankwm]

...so will be interested to hear what Andrew Rose has made of it.

Jingling €€€'s: but you do realise that Decca's recording isn't Public Domain until 2034.
As you have a fancy JVC-technology (K2) CD - you could play-around with it using an audio-editor - as a CD would've been the CEO's source.....
The Brahms 1st is also 'in copyright'.

[richardfinegold]

Part II

Some reviewers make rather extravagant claims for the restorative abilities of Pristine Audio and Andrew Rose, perhaps none more so than Henry Fogel, the emeritus President of the CSO and reviewer for Fanfare (who also happened to be my neighbor and with whom I have breakfasted with). Fogel and others speak highly of the 'Ambient Stereo' effect. Most of my experiences with Pristine have come from recordings that were interwar, and while I have always been impressed
by the quality of digital restoration in general on recordings of such vintage, I am not sure that i see a world of difference between Pristine, Marston, Dutton, and other companies specializing in such fare. This is my first experience with Pristine on recordings that are closer to, and actually stretch into, the modern Stereo era.
First up is the Mahler 5. Horenstein for me is one of the real vital Mahler Conductors, and never recorded the 5th. This recording was, per the notes, done in the setting of great dissension between J.H. and Karajan's BPO, most of whom had never played and were niot convinced of the merits of the music. This being a concert performance, there is no commercial recording to make a comparison with.
It's a stunner. One would never know that the Orchestra was at near rebellion or had never played the work. The opening trumpet fanfare and the themes that follow are not played at a dirge like tempo that frequently has become the norm, but at andante tread that always seems to have an inner tension. The terracing of the dynamics of the opening fanfare is captured superbly. II and II are very sardonic and extremely well played, the Adagietto is on the swift side
and radiant (the only distortion of significance is during the clima of IV), and J.H. makes more of V than any other Conductor, affirmative but with some residual doubts.
There is inconsequential audience noise (and an announcer at the end), a few non important flubs by the players, and my ear quickly adjusted to the clear but dry mono sound. This will be my 5th of choice.
Next up is the Beethoven 9th. Here the Pristine input is more problematic. I believe that Rose generally works from the best lps or 78s that he can find for a given recording and never from the masters tapes (if they exist). This recording was one ofthe first Classical records I had purchased as a teenager, for about $1 from an American Record Mail Order club on what was a dim sounding and no doubt noisy Vox lp. I then purchased the Vox issued CD ('Vox Legends') a few years ago and was delighted to be reacquainted the eprformance, which reminded me of
Toscanini in it's tautness without sounding stentatorian in the way his final NBC recording did. The Vox sound is best described as hard hitting mono-incisive, clear, without distortion, if not particularly flattering. I have compared the Pristine and Vox recordings and here the Vox is the clear winner. The bold tympani strokes in the Vox in I are clear and slice through the Orchestra; in the Pristine rendering they sound like the sticks have been wrapped in marshmellows. The soloists in IV sound like they are coming from behind the stage by comparison in the Pristine. THe "Vienna Pro Musica" (Vienna Symphony?) has much more color in the Vox.
Fogel claims in his recent review ofthe Pristine that Pristine has issued a true stereo version that they unearthed and not the mono recording that Vox uses.
I have listened 3 times to the Pristine and I can't detect any channel seperation at all.
Finally, the LSO Brahms 1 and the oddball Scottish Fantasy coupling. I had owned the Brahms , a stereo recording made by the Decca recording team under contract to RCA, on lp but haven't heard it for years. I would be surprised if this hasn't been issued in CD. The Brahms is a wonderful performance, with Horenstein building tension throughout I, a wonderfully flowing II, and a dramatic and exciting IV. the Bruch strikes me as underpowered--reportedly Oistrakh had to relearn the part at a days notice to replace another soloist and while he plays beautfiully there is an air of caution that Michael Rabin or Heifetz would have scorned. The Bruch features a rather odd amount of tape hiss or surface noise and Oistrakh's tone becomes uncomfortably filled with vineger under pressure, an effect that I have never heard elsewhere for this Violinist. In short, I doubt that Pristine has done the very best by this early 60s stereo recording.
Rose and Pristine are a virtual factory of reissues, cranking out records weekly. Based on this quite possibly unrepresentative sampling, I think they are best served by confining themselves to the pre lp era, particularly to the presentation of live performances not available elsewhere.

[frankwm]

The Horenstein Beethoven 9 used was the grossly inferior 'RVG' single LP mastering (PL10000) - muffled/very distorted and congested - Decca distictly bettered that in their 1966 transfer - a much scarcer LP:-

http://themusicparlour.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/jascha-horenstein-vienna-pro-musica.html

Mr Fogey must be 'getting-on' if he believed that quoted LP is 'stereo' https://www.pristineclassical.com/pasc293.html

"The end result is a particularly fine-sounding production of exceptional clarity.

Andrew Rose"

[richardfinegold]

The Horenstein Beethoven 9 used was the grossly inferior 'RVG' single LP mastering (PL10000) - muffled/very distorted and congested - Decca distictly bettered that in their 1966 transfer - a much scarcer LP:-

http://themusicparlour.blogspot.co.uk/2011/06/jascha-horenstein-vienna-pro-musica.html

Mr Fogey must be 'getting-on' if he believed that quoted LP is 'stereo' https://www.pristineclassical.com/pasc293.html



"The end result is a particularly fine-sounding production of exceptional clarity.

Andrew Rose"

Hey, thanks for that--I love the rproduction ofthe front and back of the album covers, which I haven't seen for years. I spent a lot of time readingthose liner notes back in the day.
And the name is 'Fogel'-although given the lapse in his judgement that is on display here, I can see how 'Fogey' is suggested...