Eastop - Hanover Band/Halstead: Mozart Horn works - wonderful !

[MrGongGong]

Why would one download music then create a CD that's almost like the "real" one?

It's not important and different folks have different needs.

With a CD like this I would do the option that gives the most to the people who made it.

[Gordon]

Why would one download music then create a CD that's almost like the "real" one?

I don't burn all downloads to CDR, just those that I want keep with a printed booklet. DL is immediate [impatience perhaps a failing of mine] and useful to sample and avoid the storage problem of too many versions of the same pieces, especially complete sets.

It's not important and different folks have different needs.

With a CD like this I would do the option that gives the most to the people who made it.

I agree that buying the CD will possibly be of greater benefit to the musicians involved so perhaps mea culpa applies, especially as you say, in this case.

[JFLL]

Why would one download music then create a CD that's almost like the "real" one?.

Reasons why I often do it from Hyperion:
(1) The CD costs £10.50, the FLAC download £7.99
(2) You don't have to wait for the CD to come (although in the case of the Eastop a few days ago I had to wait a few minutes before the download started, presumably because everyone else was trying to download at the same time. Otherwise I've never had any problems downloading from Hyperion).
(3) The CD is useful for the car.

[richardfinegold]

Mine just arrived today and I am listening right now. My only other recording at present is Alan Civil, who lives up to his name in decorum. There are some really odd sounding notes on this new recording! I'm going to have to listen a bit to adjust my mindset and expectations.

[Barbirollians]

I like the cadenza in No2 particularly but as richard says there are some odd sounding notes throughout the record . There is , however, also a great deal of humour in the playing too which I like a great deal . I should probably prefer the slow movements to be a little more in the smoothed over Montgomery manner but no doubt that it is a very illuminating and enjoyable record .

[richardfinegold]

I like the cadenza in No2 particularly but as richard says there are some odd sounding notes throughout the record . There is , however, also a great deal of humour in the playing too which I like a great deal . I should probably prefer the slow movements to be a little more in the smoothed over Montgomery manner but no doubt that it is a very illuminating and enjoyable record .

Having now listened a couple of times, the odd flatulent sounds are not quite so startling, and as Barbs notes there is a lot of humor. A very enjoyable disc, it probably won't be the first that I reach for when I want to hear this music, but an original sounding and interesting variant.

[Nick Armstrong]

A sizable chunk to audition tomorrow for those that haven't indulged yet:

CD Review: 11.45am Disc of the Week

Mozart: Horn Concertos & Horn Quintet

MOZART: Horn Concertos Nos. 1-4 (complete); Horn Quintet in E flat, K407

Pip Eastop (natural horn), The Hanover Band, Anthony Halstead (conductor), the Eroica Quartet

HYPERION CDA68097 (CD)

... many thanks ( and to all enthusiasts above) - have ordered nice shiny CD from presto for (I think) abt £12 incl p&p

Has it arrived and been played yet?

[Gordon]

Played No1 last Friday PM on that other station that shall not be named as part of its classical hit parade show. I forget where it was in the parade though! Nothing on R3 to lift a boring car journey. Still think the horn is too far forward in the mix.

[Zucchini]

A sizable chunk to audition tomorrow for those that haven't indulged yet: [/COLOR]

Count me out. I love Mozart but to me this is horrible music. I've twice had to sit through one of these concertos whilst waiting for the proper stuff to start. Even though they were very well known players they convinced me that the horn just isn't a concerto instrument - (sinfonia concertante maybe).

[Purcellian]

I've twice had to it through one of these concertos whilst waiting for the proper stuff to start

Err..ummm... please could you elucidate? e.g. what does 'twice had to it through one of these concertos' actually mean?

[MrGongGong]

Count me out. I love Mozart but to me this is horrible music. I've twice had to it through one of these concertos whilst waiting for the proper stuff to start. Even though they were very well known players they convinced me that the horn just isn't a concerto instrument - (sinfonia concertante maybe).

Have you listened to this recording?

the horn just isn't a concerto instrument

what utter nonsense

[french frank]

Count me out. I love Mozart but to me this is horrible music. I've twice had to [s?]it through one of these concertos whilst waiting for the proper stuff to start. Even though they were very well known players they convinced me that the horn just isn't a concerto instrument - (sinfonia concertante maybe).

Unusually, Zucchers, you might be in a minority

[Purcellian]

yes 'utter nonsense' indeed...!
And yet... maybe Zucchini's 'problem' is not with the actual music 'per se' but with the way it is presented?
When we listen to, say, a Mozart Violin Concerto or a Piano Concerto, if we know any of those pieces, we somehow have been programmed to expect a 'cadenza' near the end of the first movement, lasting anything between 30 seconds and one minute ( this is very generalized ! and of course some of those piano cadenzas composed by WAM himself are a good deal longer than that ) ... however, surely it's all a matter of PROPORTION?
Mozart's superb 'written-out' cadenza for the first movement of his Piano Concerto in F K459 represents about 5% of the total playing-time of the whole movement.
BUT a cadenza lasting 2 minutes in the first movement of a horn concerto that ( without cadenza) lasts about 7 to 8 minutes, is surely a stylistic 'elephant in the room' ...? Or am I misunderstanding the basic arithmetic of that entire 'can-of-worms' - 'Classical proportions'?
It's probably - and wholly - inappropriate to quote here the Quantz directive that a cadenza should be 'played 'in one breath' since he was referring specifically to cadenzas for his own instrument, the flute(!) ... nevertheless if we interpret that instruction simply in the 'spirit rather than the letter' we would still find the Eastop cadenzas to be too verbose ( quite apart from their tendency to stray into a harmonic language very far removed from that of Mozart's time).

[Roehre]

yes 'utter nonsense' indeed...!
And yet... maybe Zucchini's 'problem' is not with the actual music 'per se' but with the way it is presented?
When we listen to, say, a Mozart Violin Concerto or a Piano Concerto, if we know any of those pieces, we somehow have been programmed to expect a 'cadenza' near the end of the first movement, lasting anything between 30 seconds and one minute ( this is very generalized ! and of course some of those piano cadenzas composed by WAM himself are a good deal longer than that ) ... however, surely it's all a matter of PROPORTION?
Mozart's superb 'written-out' cadenza for the first movement of his Piano Concerto in F K459 represents about 5% of the total playing-time of the whole movement.
BUT a cadenza lasting 2 minutes in the first movement of a horn concerto that ( without cadenza) lasts about 7 to 8 minutes, is surely a stylistic 'elephant in the room' ...? Or am I misunderstanding the basic arithmetic of that entire 'can-of-worms' - 'Classical proportions'?
It's probably - and wholly - inappropriate to quote here the Quantz directive that a cadenza should be 'played 'in one breath' since he was referring specifically to cadenzas for his own instrument, the flute(!) ... nevertheless if we interpret that instruction simply in the 'spirit rather than the letter' we would still find the Eastop cadenzas to be too verbose ( quite apart from their tendency to stray into a harmonic language very far removed from that of Mozart's time).

It's nice to see what we know of the length of similar cadenzas, not by Mozart, but by Beethoven.
Beethoven's cadenza for Mozart's d-minor KV466 is nearly 5 minutes, his surviving cadenzas for his own concertos [1, 2, 4, op.61a] are all approximately the same length, hence up to approximately 20-25 per cent of the movements' length. This means in case of the horn concertos therefore some 2 minutes.

As far as the harmonic language is concerned: we are not living in Mozart's time and cadenzas are meant to offer the soloist the chance to show off - we don't throw away Beethoven's or Brahms' cadenzas for Mozart, we accept the past great pianists' and violinists' cadenzas for the great concertos of the 18th and 19th centuries, neither of which is particularly "in the style of...." either, and I like also to mention e.g. Schnittke's cadenza written for Kremer's performances of Beethoven's violin concerto.

[Purcellian]

Ok I understand what you're saying, but surely the performers of the Beethoven, Brahms, Schnittke etc cadenzas weren't undertaking an 'authentic' or 'H.I.P.P.'performance, which is what this one apparently sets out to be.
It was quite hard to listen with 'rhythmical comfort' to the 1st Horn Concerto a few minutes ago and I kept wondering whether the soloist was picking up his rhythmic instability from the orchestra ( lots of bars rushed through or slightly cut short) or whether the conductor and orchestra were reacting to the soloist?