Brandenburg 6

[Bryn]

I had a similar response and went to my latest Brandenburg acquisition, the excellent Café Zimmermann box.

Tonight I will be mostly listening to Brandenburg 6: Café Zimmermann, Le Concert des Nations/Savall (SACD), La Petite Bande/Kuijken (SACD), AAM/Egarr and maybe some others, too. Indeed, I might dig out the old HCO/Newstone LP to check how I respond to that these days. It was, after all, my introduction to the work.

[Oh, and il Giardino Armonico/Antonini, of course.]

[vinteuil]

. Indeed, I might dig out the old HCO/Newstone LP to check how I respond to that these days. It was, after all, my introduction to the work.

... same here!

- happy memories. I think it was probably my first LP purchase (from Milsom's / Duck, Son, & Pinker in Bath... )

[MickyD]

Tonight I will be mostly listening to Brandenburg 6: Café Zimmermann, Le Concert des Nations/Savall (SACD), La Petite Bande/Kuijken (SACD), AAM/Egarr and maybe some others, too. Indeed, I might dig out the old HCO/Newstone LP to check how I respond to that these days. It was, after all, my introduction to the work.

[Oh, and il Giardino Armonico/Antonini, of course.]

I shall be fascinated to hear your verdict, Bryn!

[Dave2002]

... same here!

- happy memories. I think it was probably my first LP purchase (from Milsom's / Duck, Son, & Pinker in Bath... )

bryn and vint

That's 3 of us at least who first heard these pieces from those Saga LPs, then. I don't know if I've still got them - shame if not, though a bit rough in places. In the meantima I found #6 on Spotify -
http://open.spotify.com/track/7nv6OCCwH84IZaWsYs6m0X. Now for the Boult version - maybe.

[Bryn]

http://www.for3.org/forums/showthrea...658#post198658

Hmm, so which of the instruments used by MAK for their recording did NA hear being strummed? Perhaps he just couldn't keep up with the bowing. I think their tempo choice works rather well, though that is not to say it is the 'correct' tempo. Since none was indicated in what has come down to us, it is up to each group of performers to make their own decision on the matter. I find MAK's articulation very much to my taste, and not "sketchy strumming", nor sketchy arco, come to that.

[heliocentric]

I can't hear any strumming in that recording... but for me it's the least successful in the MAK set; I prefer the flavour of that instrumentation to be intensified by more sustain. Which isn't to say I think it's "wrong" or that I never listen to it. Kuijken's (2009) first movement is 6'45" by the way, almost as slow as Carlos which I don't remember at all, must dig that up later. As I remember, her interpretative choices regarding matters like tempo, articulation and ornamentation usually tend towards the conservative. Maybe it's time for a HIP electronic realisation.

[MickyD]

But if I recall, Carlos took the third movement of the Third Brandenburg Concerto quite fast. I was about 12 or 13 when I first heard it and found it absolutely thrilling and still do. In fact, it was the first time I had heard any Brandenburg concerto; whatever criticisms are made about Carlos' treatment, I owe her a huge debt of gratitude for opening my ears to Bach's music and baroque music in general.

[Bryn]

Savall takes a full 7 minutes, and that just sounds too slow to my ears. Ironically, perhaps, it is in NA's favoured recording, the Antonini, that one finds strumming, though admittedly not of sketchy variety.

[Dave2002]

And finally ... Very surprised at Boult, which has now been unwrapped and in the player. Not sure what I was expecting, but at least the speeds are OK,, though perhaps a bit sluggish in the last movment, and somehow the syncopated sections sound smoothed out. The full bodied sound took me somewhat aback. This was much better than I feared it might be. It's not horrid. I don't know what Boult thought of HIP - or even if anyone in the mainstream was really aware at the time of recording. There are conductors, such as Davis who are aware of HIP, but don't fully want to go there - though his early Messiah, while not going as far as the version by Mackerras, was going in the right direction.

I like to think that conductors like Boult and Klemperer would not have totally disapproved of or dismissed HIP, even if they couldn't join in themslves, but maybe that's just speculative wishful thinking.

Boult's version is one to listen to occasionally rather than being a first, or even fifth choice, but is not Room 101 material IMO.

[Ariosto]

And finally ... Very surprised at Boult, which has now been unwrapped and in the player. Not sure what I was expecting, but at least the speeds are OK,, though perhaps a bit sluggish in the last movment, and somehow the syncopated sections sound smoothed out. The full bodied sound took me somewhat aback. This was much better than I feared it might be. It's not horrid. I don't know what Boult thought of HIP - or even if anyone in the mainstream was really aware at the time of recording. There are conductors, such as Davis who are aware of HIP, but don't fully want to go there - though his early Messiah, while not going as far as the version by Mackerras, was going in the right direction.

I like to think that conductors like Boult and Klemperer would not have totally disapproved of or dismissed HIP, even if they couldn't join in themslves, but maybe that's just speculative wishful thinking.

Boult's version is one to listen to occasionally rather than being a first, or even fifth choice, but is not Room 101 material IMO.

I never got to ask Boult what he thought of HIPP mainly because at the time (mid 1960's to mid 1980's) no one was bothered too much by it. The general concenscious was that HIPP was not very good, owing to the incompetence of the performers. Things may have changed somewhat by now where we have some good and some bad.

Of course had one asked Boult what he thought he might not have given a straight answer anyway, due partly to his sense of humour. He could certainly make interesting comments about student (and other ) conductors - usually in an aside - or an obliquely put question, such as, "anyone in the orchestra feel they could do better????"

[heliocentric]

So, Wendy Carlos. I quite like the fact that the two often closely imitative top lines are placed hard left and right in the stereo panorama, something that real players would never do of course, although on the other hand the timbres chosen for these lines often have envelopes more reminiscent of keyboard instruments than of strings, which is maybe a shame, and those timbres change every few bars which removes the attractive focus on particular instrumental colours in the original. I can see why she does this, given that such changes of "registration" were the main source of expressivity with synthesizers in the days before velocity sensitivity, aftertouch etc., also given that she didn't want the music to sound like an imitation of acoustic instruments, but the result is no overall distinction in timbral range between no.6 and say no.1. The continuo realisation in the first movement is so swirly it would make Ton Koopman blush. I don't think I'll be returning to this one for some time...

[Dave2002]

I'm wondering if I need to bite the bullet and get this - http://www.amazon.co.uk/J-S-Bach-Con...8&sr=8-1-fkmr0 by Café Zimmerman. Goes against the grain a bit - over £6 per CD, but the performances I've heard sounded excellent. Maybe I should wait until Christmas.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

That's 3 of us at least who first heard these pieces from those Saga LPs

....not my first exposure but my first set -- the Klemperer belonged to my sister ...

[amateur51]

I'm wondering if I need to bite the bullet and get this - http://www.amazon.co.uk/J-S-Bach-Con...8&sr=8-1-fkmr0 by Café Zimmerman. Goes against the grain a bit - over £6 per CD, but the performances I've heard sounded excellent. Maybe I should wait until Christmas.

Under a fiver/disc (£27.66) at Amazon.es Dave2002

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

There are conductors, such as Davis who are aware of HIP, but don't fully want to go there - though his early Messiah, while not going as far as the version by Mackerras, was going in the right direction.

Now if I said that, but in reverse, there would be venomous shouts from many HIPPsters. I think Davis's Messiah has the perfect balance, making great music great, and not in any way trying to prove a point.