Yet another gaffe on Breakfast - can R3 get any worse???

[hafod]

On the subject of gaffes, what is intriguing me about the current Genius of Mozart marathon is the frequently repeated plug that Radio 3 will play ‘every note that Mozart wrote’. It is even repeated in the press release.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2010/12_december/03/mozart.shtml

Are we to assume therefore that the lost scores have been found? If it matters, SM-P’s misattribution pales into insignificance against this claim which is presumably a team effort.

[Paul Sherratt]

>>>every note that Mozart wrote ... but not necessarily in the Wright order ?

[french frank]

Look, I never said presenters shouldn't be criticised.

I don't believe anyone suggested that you did. I think it was clear that I was being defensive of presenters and sympathising given that they often get the flak for what are the shortcomings of others.

But, while what you say may be correct, this is not a 'public advocacy' forum: it's a forum for any Radio 3 listeners to express their views. They all have their individual ways of expressing them, which may make us wince, fume or nod in agreement. But the forum doesn't have any aim other than to be, like the BBC boards, an open meeting place for listeners to Radio 3.

[Eudaimonia]

Fair enough, but when I said "public advocacy group," I was specifically referring to the Friends of Radio 3. And from what I've read in press archives re. the kind of coverage you've been getting, it appears you have a wee bit of a PR image problem. Even Mister Pleasant himself seemed annoyed. And you know that can't be a good sign!

What can you do to get people to quit throwing the "e word" at you? Even if you don't have a problem with it personally, it's incredibly damaging when that's one of the first adjectives that springs so readily to people's minds. In any event, whether they're representative of the views of FoR3 or not, "let's pile on the presenter" threads make normal people think "fussy old elitist kooks", and I don't think it's doing anybody any favours.

[french frank]

but when I said "public advocacy group," I was specifically referring to the Friends of Radio 3.

But you mentioned the "public advocacy group" with reference to criticism of individual presenters, which FoR3 specifically does not do, and has made it very clear that, as a group, it will not do. Those who have criticised presenters on the BBC boards (and this one) are Radio 3 listeners. As this is not a FoR3 forum, they are free to express whatever views they wish as long as they are not libellous.

it appears you have a wee bit of a PR image problem

I don't think you would have found much about our 'image problem' in recent years. When we started, all sorts of people had axes they want to bury in our skulls . Last time we met RW he brought the Head of Speech and Drama so that we could discuss the whole range of R3 output. It was he who suggested thast we should have a further meeting. We've been invited to a meeting with the BBC Trust. I was offered a complimentary Proms ticket a couple of seasons ago . We received Roger's thanks and good wishes for setting up this forum. So I'm not one to grumble about our relationship or image with the BBC . Most of the so-called 'image problem' was years ago or with idiot journalists who can't read

[Simon]

Thank you Bro. Paul. I think! :)

I can't believe grown men dressed like that!

This is far more to my taste: no tight leathers yet in this clip, but still the sexiest rock chick I've ever seen. Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwos1Dxc_iI

[Paul Sherratt]

>>I can't believe grown men dressed like that!

Brave though, don't you think, like that boy named ' Sue ' ?

[Eudaimonia]

FF:

If I were you, I'd still be concerned with your group's public image and making sure you're always putting your "best face forward", so to speak. Every once awhile--even in recent articles--it comes across that some perceive you as elitist, "out of touch", and representing a tiny minority of listeners. If that's the fault of idiot journalists, so be it, but perhaps it might make sense to put a little effort into making your case and winning them over. Not just the journalists, but the educated, R3-listening public itself. Running these boards impartially could be a good start--and a tremendous help.

And speaking of being won over...You're being treated well, but can you honestly say you feel like you're being heard in any meaningful way? As affable as RW may be, it's important to remember that politeness is a social strategy. Or as Schopenhauer once put it: "Politeness is a false coin with which it is foolish to be stingy." Seriously, think about it: anyone who's shrewd enough to have reached the position he has (and keep it for decades!) is likely very, very adept at sussing out what people want to hear and giving it to them. All I know is that if I were the Controller and someone who had the ear of the media repeatedly accused me of ruining the station, "dumbing down", etc. I'd say whatever I needed to say (and do whatever I needed to do) to get you to ease up and calm the hell down, whether I actually cared what you said or not. But then, maybe that's just me, YMMV.

And if you really do feel like you have any meaningful input, it might be worth using this forum to brainstorm more concrete "action items" you can bring to the table for consideration. I like your idea of doing some kind of analysis of the "Mozart Experience", but what kinds of things can you bring up that nobody on staff is already thinking about?

Something to think about...thanks for reading!

[amateur51]

Thank you Bro. Paul. I think! :)

I can't believe grown men dressed like that!

This is far more to my taste: no tight leathers yet in this clip, but still the sexiest rock chick I've ever seen. Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mwos1Dxc_iI

Oh dear, a report from the intimate workings of Simon's erotic inner life ... 'Too Much Information', as my younger friends say (TMI in text-speak!).

And regarding 'Enjoy!', as Sir Nico Henderson responded apparently to the rejoinder 'Have A Nice Day!' for the first time in New York, "eerrrr I've made other plans!"

[James Wonnacott]

Eudaimonia:
I, for one, cannot imagine that anyone could describe me as elitist (at least not on the topic of Radio 3/classical music): I have no musical training and very limited musical knowledge- I can't read a note).
I listen to Radio 3 because I enjoy the variety of classical music, I make a note of those things that I like and may decide to purchase for my collection.
I don't, however, want the gaps between the music filled with something resembling a television game show, or the programmes presented in a manner and voice more suited to Listen with Mother.
I don't care if such and such a piece of music was playing when a listener, whom I don't know, met their wife/husband. Neither am I interested if their cat/dog/budgie turns cartwheels when a particular piece is played.
If a presenter, who is probably very well paid, can't be bothered to check his or her facts before going on air or cannot string two words together when interviewing "guests" without putting "um" and "er" between them, I will say so.
It's not elitist, it's just expecting a good standard of broadcasting.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

James, I agree completely.

[Norfolk Born]

As do I.

[StephenO]

Further agreement here.

[Word]

But not here

(sorry, I couldn't resist ).

Thankfully James hasn't described my Radio 3 listening experience and though I very rarely listen to Breakfast on weekdays, on the couple of occasions that I have done so, that too wasn't as described.

Please excuse my naivety but has there ever been a Radio 3 programme that regularly featured the horrors of audience members phoning-in with requests and dedications?


p.s. Hi, French Frank, and thank you for taking the time to run the message board. Oooo, we even have the old MB smilies .

[Suffolkcoastal]

Me too of course! Presentation is of paramount importance, presenters should be well prepared, research done as thoroughly as possible, websites should be kept up to date and accurate. If the general sloppiness creeping in isn't attended to, you risk driving away not only your core listeners but often any new listeners as well.