Essential Classics - The Continuing Debate

[antongould]

And, incidentally, a pretty smart lesson in searching on Andrew's playlist. All the the works in the programme with full details

It is a thing of beauty and a joy forever .....

[LMcD]

As someone who does listen to EC, as well as comment on it, I have to say SK is edging ever closer to driving me away. The originally rather irritating aspects have become so exaggerated as to be a caricature now, and are tending to taint my enjoyment of the music, doing nothing to foster a positive outlook in this listener.

May I just say that I admire your persistence/tolerance/patience/sense of fair play - she drove me away at quite an early stage.

[Frances_iom]

EC is not intended for serious listening - it is aimed at those who like a bit of a good tune not those deeply into 'Classical music' - like all such shows aimed at a general audience who possess little or no knowledge of the subject the presenter becomes more important than the material presented as the presenter sets the ethos of the show eg what can be dismissed with a quip hence the adoption of an exaggerated persona which the audience can relate to (think of the late top-gear presenter tho in his case I suspect the tv persona was very like the real one - it requires an exceptional presenter to be able to display real knowledge/appreciation yet still keep themselves viewed as 'one of us' by the intended audience

[Richard Tarleton]

EC is not intended for serious listening - it is aimed at those who like a bit of a good tune not those deeply into 'Classical music' - like all such shows aimed at a general audience who possess little or no knowledge of the subject the presenter becomes more important than the material presented as the presenter sets the ethos of the show eg what can be dismissed with a quip hence the adoption of an exaggerated persona which the audience can relate to (think of the late top-gear presenter tho in his case I suspect the tv persona was very like the real one - it requires an exceptional presenter to be able to display real knowledge/appreciation yet still keep themselves viewed as 'one of us' by the intended audience

But...but...its predecessor, CD Masters, was very much appreciated by "serious listeners" (as well as, hopefully, relative newcomers), and the presenters (Rob Cowan, Jonathan Swain) set a serious, knowledgeable and non-frivolous tone, appreciated by all. Heaven knows I was not an RC fan, but in the words of Joni Mitchell, Don't it always seem to go
That you don't know what you've got 'Till it's gone . Actually I didn't have much problem with him until he made the transition to EC..... As for presenters on R3 needing to be "one of us" - what does that mean, exactly? One of who?

[french frank]

As for presenters on R3 needing to be "one of us" - what does that mean, exactly? One of who?

Interesting question. The BBC understands it as 'one of my mates who I enjoy sitting down to a drink with'. To go back to academic life, all lecturers were 'one of us' but we had complementary areas of knowledge. In that sense were 'on the same level' and exchanged information between each other on various topics, including informal interests. There was an assumption that we may know more about A than B, but less about C than D. We didn't sit at the feet of our trusted guides. There is no sense with EC that a section of their audience knows a lot more than they do. (Ian Skelly excluded - he is a bit special).

I should add that I think the majority of human relationships are 'on the same level'. To be mutually satisfactory.

[antongould]

..... There is no sense with EC that a section of their audience knows a lot more than they do. (Ian Skelly excluded - he is a bit special).
.

Skellers as Everyman ........

[Richard Tarleton]

The reductio ad absurdum of Frances's argument is that the main morning listening (3 hours) on the BBC's classical music programme is not for people with an interest in classical music...(just for people who happen to have the radio on, perhaps).

[LMcD]

EC is not intended for serious listening - it is aimed at those who like a bit of a good tune not those deeply into 'Classical music' - like all such shows aimed at a general audience who possess little or no knowledge of the subject the presenter becomes more important than the material presented as the presenter sets the ethos of the show eg what can be dismissed with a quip hence the adoption of an exaggerated persona which the audience can relate to (think of the late top-gear presenter tho in his case I suspect the tv persona was very like the real one - it requires an exceptional presenter to be able to display real knowledge/appreciation yet still keep themselves viewed as 'one of us' by the intended audience

The content of the programme is on thing, but the unbearable attitude of Bossy-Boots Klein is another. If a listener can't get past that, it surely becomes immaterial what the aim of the programme is and whether it is succeeding in what it is setting out to do.

[french frank]

The content of the programme is on thing, but the unbearable attitude of Bossy-Boots Klein is another.

She seems to be playing the role assigned to her by Radio 3 management: "I am your trusted guide." Unfortunately, it is for each listener to decide whether a presenter is to be 'trusted'. Presenters who are a bit weak on factual accuracy tend not to be trusted.

In primary school, teachers are supposed to be dogmatic (not 'nebulous' ). Even when they're wrong, they can be assured that primary school children won't know (until they're much older) that they were wrong. It becomes progressively much more acceptable for teachers to admit to uncertainty or ignorance.

[Bryn]

She seems to be playing the role assigned to her by Radio 3 management: "I am your trusted guide." Unfortunately, it is for each listener to decide whether a presenter is to be 'trusted'. Presenters who are a bit weak on factual accuracy tend not to be trusted.

In primary school, teachers are supposed to be dogmatic (not 'nebulous' ). Even when they're wrong, they can be assured that primary school children won't know (until they're much older) that they were wrong. It becomes progressively much more acceptable for teachers to admit to uncertainty or ignorance.

I don't know what the situation is today, but when I was at school, the approach referred to in your first two sentences applies to the secondary years' science teaching, too. First time round, I failed both Physics and Chemistry ')' levels as a result of giving answers based on then current scientific understanding rather than the historical misunderstanding we were taught, and expected to regurgitate.

I learned my lesson and served up the old-hat stuff for the resit.

[Serial_Apologist]

I don't know what the situation is today, but when I was at school, the approach referred to in your first two sentences applies to the secondary years' science teaching, too. First time round, I failed both Physics and Chemistry ')' levels as a result of giving answers based on then current scientific understanding rather than the historical misunderstanding we were taught, and expected to regurgitate.

I learned my lesson and served up the old-hat stuff for the resit.

In other words, presumably, you had to misunderstand the gravity of the situation?

[Frances_iom]

The reductio ad absurdum of Frances's argument is that the main morning listening (3 hours) on the BBC's classical music programme is not for people with an interest in classical music...(just for people who happen to have the radio on, perhaps).

if all that matters is the 'reach' of the programme then just as once advertising is accepted as a paymaster then the actual contents don't really matter just the numbers attracted or delivered to the paymasters count - the old joke 'don't worry about the quality just feel the width' sums it up.

[Ein Heldenleben]

The 'playlister' piece for which a companion is sought this morning is Eine Alpensinfonie...
Just saying....

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

The 'playlister' piece for which a companion is sought this morning is Eine Alpensinfonie...
Just saying....

Yep. I’ve sent them a long diatribe that they won’t be reading out - all about bleeding chunks and other issues around this whole concept.

[french frank]

The 'playlister' piece for which a companion is sought this morning is Eine Alpensinfonie...
Just saying....

Last time they played Land of the Mountain and the Flood "Pat" was slapped down for suggesting Eine Alpensinfonie. Just saying … Presumably the latest companion piece will not be Land of the Mountain and the Flood. Although presenter today is IS rather than SK