Essential Classics - The Continuing Debate

[french frank]

Bit difficult to have a debate when all the participants are of the same mind?

Well, the thread's been running for almost six years and the vast majority have been of one mind about the programme. But the recent comments have brought up a number of different points and quite a few people have found a small tasty crumb in all this. I've been trying to write this up and note any credit where this seems to have been given. There are some opposing views, but not many; and even people who are broadly favourable mention features which they dislike.

[Barbirollians]

Sarah's Sunday Escape sounds like it was dreamed up by the Director of Better in W1A . Vomitworthy

[oddoneout]

Well, the thread's been running for almost six years and the vast majority have been of one mind about the programme. But the recent comments have brought up a number of different points and quite a few people have found a small tasty crumb in all this. I've been trying to write this up and note any credit where this seems to have been given. There are some opposing views, but not many; and even people who are broadly favourable mention features which they dislike.

I've rather found myself going in circles over this the past few days(which is becoming increasingly uncomfortable as I have a foot in both camps so to speak....)The perception/assumption(and possibly reality) is that the majority of listeners to the programme wouldn't be contributing to discussions here. Whatever views they may have are more likely to be aired on social media if at all?
I do think there probably are ways of making the morning offering less divisive and of better quality - perhaps amalgamating Breakfast and Essential Classics into one shorter, better constructed programme, as part of a cohesive and thought through 'Morning on 3' set-up? How much is really known about who listens to the current programme, how and why, and does this inform decisions about changes to the programme? Is there any reason to suppose, for instance, that attempts to break out of the current historical and geographic straitjacket(250/300 years and European) now and again would have a major negative impact on audience figures? Ditto occasional brief forays into areas of genuine expertise and the treasures of the recorded archive?

[oddoneout]

Brave or foolhardy? Ms Klein is soliciting suggestions for what to follow 'l'Apres midi d'un faune....

[french frank]

Brave or foolhardy? Ms Klein is soliciting suggestions for what to follow 'l'Apres midi d'un faune....

Anyone going to suggest the cavatina from the deerhunter?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Anyone going to suggest the cavatina from the deerhunter?

Had I been listening; had I not felt that responding at all would have been against all my principles; and had I had the wit to think of this, I might have!

[oddoneout]

Anyone going to suggest the cavatina from the deerhunter?

I suspect that any suggestions from this direction will favour bloodsports, but it might be mildly interesting to know how many responses to the programme will pick up on the actual theme rather than the gaffe/misunderstanding(which may have come about as a result of censorship for many folks).

[Bax-of-Delights]

Anyone going to suggest the cavatina from the deerhunter?

Duly done.

[LMcD]

Dream Lover, sung by Bobby Darin

[french frank]

I've rather found myself going in circles over this the past few days(which is becoming increasingly uncomfortable as I have a foot in both camps so to speak....)The perception/assumption(and possibly reality) is that the majority of listeners to the programme wouldn't be contributing to discussions here. Whatever views they may have are more likely to be aired on social media if at all?

Dissenting views need to be read more carefully than majority views in many cases

The BBC carries out extensive audience research (I don't think it's very good research, though). There will be small 'focus groups' and there is (or was and I think it still operates) a BBC-wide exercise called the 'Pulse' survey where a panel of 20,000 people are questioned on their reactions to the programmes they listen to/watch daily. They are asked various 'searching' questions which have been characterised as being as sophisticated as something about the creaminess of mayonnaise (on a scale of 1-5 where 1 means 'not that creamy' and 5 means 'very creamy indeed').

I think there is a fundamental flaw, in that all these groups are carefully selected to be representative of the UK (age, sex, social grade, children in household &c), and there is increasingly no guarantee that the relatively small to insignificant number who have actually listened to Radio 3 are in some way 'representative' of the Radio 3 audience which deviates so completely from the national average. I'm quite willing to believe that a majority of the people who listen to Breakfast and Essential Classics do so because they enjoy them: they are the audience that the programmes are designed to please.

But just because a lot of people listen and enjoy them doesn't mean that that is the kind of thing Radio 3 should provide. It just proves that most of the population prefers light entertainment - you don't need expensive market research to discover that - and that people prefer radio which doesn't distract them from the other things they have to be doing at the same time.

[ChrisBennell]

One movement of the Waldstein? Surely in a 3 hour programme they can manage a complete Beethoven piano sonata. Record Review is there to sample new recordings.

Yes I listened to this and was greatly looking forward to hearing how the succeeding movements went on that piano - when she cut it off - in its prime! Then she went on to play the VW 5 Mystical Songs. After each one I was anxiously awaiting another "cut-off", but no - this time we got the whole work! Inconsistent programming!

[Ein Heldenleben]

All radio stations face the same conundrum - how do you attract new listeners without alienating loyal ones ? Even a slight change of music policy can put off regular listeners. Of course you would expect Radio 3 listeners to have more catholic tastes and accept some change. Even with its very small, by network radio standards , R3 is still in the mass media market trying to justify its budgets and access to bandwidth in a very competitive market. That means there has to be some wider appeal sequence "light ent " programmes when a mass audience is available . If that's the price of Opera on 3 and the evening live concerts then I think it's a small price worth paying. But I could do without the "fantastics" and other hyperbole. Oh yes and please can we have Jolly and Swain back...

[Richard Tarleton]

After each one I was anxiously awaiting another "cut-off", but no - this time we got the whole work!

I was certainly hoping for another cutoff

[Stanfordian]

All radio stations face the same conundrum - how do you attract new listeners without alienating loyal ones ? Even a slight change of music policy can put off regular listeners. Of course you would expect Radio 3 listeners to have more catholic tastes and accept some change. Even with its very small, by network radio standards , R3 is still in the mass media market trying to justify its budgets and access to bandwidth in a very competitive market. That means there has to be some wider appeal sequence "light ent " programmes when a mass audience is available . If that's the price of Opera on 3 and the evening live concerts then I think it's a small price worth paying. But I could do without the "fantastics" and other hyperbole. Oh yes and please can we have Jolly and Swain back...

Hiya Heldenleben,

Some of the presenters should locked up for GBH of the ear'oles!
But seriously the overuse of superlatives comes at the expense of providing relevant interesting and informative dialogue.

[french frank]

I was certainly hoping for another cutoff

Looks like it was a whopping 21 minutes - probably the longest piece yet

But:

a) it's still a short 'full-length' work when 'full-length' implies a lengthy work rather than just 'the whole of it'; and

b) for those who might have been keen to hear it, there seems no sign that it was announced beforehand, whereas th full-length work used to be published in Radio Times.