Essential Classics - The Continuing Debate

[Gargoyle]

Not really. The aim of the programme is 90% to boost Radio 3's ratings. They want the largest possible audience to enjoy it as casual listening and any educational benefit is purely incidental.

Disclaimer: This is my own sincere (embittered) opinion, for what it's worth. But try it and see. Many people do like it apparently.

Ok, you’re all unhappy with how Radio 3 has changed over the years. I get that and share some of it.

I naively thought I could a simple and honest description of what the programme is supposed to be about so I could get into it and perhaps enjoy it, rather than more complaining. Lord knows what the Radio 3 people think of this forum.

[french frank]

Ok, you’re all unhappy with how Radio 3 has changed over the years. I get that and share some of it.

I naively thought I could a simple and honest description of what the programme is supposed to be about rather than more complaining.

Sorry Gargoyle, you've been around so long I hadn't realised you weren't a classical listener. Well, it's a three-hour (oops, now three and a half) programme which has a miscellany of talk and bits of music.

This looks like a standard playlist and the blurb tells you a bit more:

Georgia Mann plays the best in classical music, with familiar favourites alongside new discoveries and musical surprises.
1000 Playlist starter – listen and send us your ideas for the next step in our musical journey today.
1030 Song of the Day – harnessing the magic of words, music and the human voice.
1100 Playlist reveal – a sequence of music suggested by you in response to our starter today.
1130 Slow Moment – time to take a break for a moment's musical reflection.
1230 Album of the Week

Giving it a try will give you a better idea of whether it's for you than asking the forum malcontents!

[Gargoyle]

Sorry Gargoyle, you've been around so long I hadn't realised you weren't a classical listener. Well, it's a three-hour (oops, now three and a half) programme which has a miscellany of talk and bits of music.

This looks like a standard playlist and the blurb tells you a bit more:

Georgia Mann plays the best in classical music, with familiar favourites alongside new discoveries and musical surprises.
1000 Playlist starter – listen and send us your ideas for the next step in our musical journey today.
1030 Song of the Day – harnessing the magic of words, music and the human voice.
1100 Playlist reveal – a sequence of music suggested by you in response to our starter today.
1130 Slow Moment – time to take a break for a moment's musical reflection.
1230 Album of the Week

Giving it a try will give you a better idea of whether it's for you than asking the forum malcontents!

Perhaps I should have said that I for one reason or another have only listened to through the night over the last few years and enjoy it very much. I wanted to branch out and listen again during the day now that my new meds keep me more alert daytime.

I suppose I’ll not get a good steer from malcontents, so I’ll listen in and see for myself.

Strewth, that was hard work!

[hmvman]

To be fair, Gargoyle, a lot of us don't listen to the programme - I tend to switch over to a foreign station on weekday mornings after 'Breakfast' (thereby not fulfilling the programme's remit going by the brief ff has mentioned). It's difficult to give a description of what the programme is about when one doesn't understand what it's about, or what it's for! If you're used to listening to 'Through the Night' (TTN) then 'Essential Classics' is going to be a very different listening experience - no complete works, lots of irrelevant chat, games, listener interaction; It's much lighter fare. As ff has said, the only way to see if you like it is to try it.

[Ein Heldenleben]

And here from 2017-18 (who said there was no talk among producers about audiences?)

Currently titled 'Essential Classics', this is a significant part of Radio 3’s weekday daytime schedule, appealing to listeners with a broad interest in mainstream classical music. It has the largest consistent audience on the station and high appreciation scores. However, a significant number of core Radio 3 listeners are tuning to other stations at this time of day and therefore a key challenge is to reclaim this audience at 9am and retain them throughout the programme.

The programme is also potentially a key entry point for new listeners to Radio 3. Currently the average age of the audience is 62 and another important challenge is to widen the programme's appeal to younger listeners.

Proposals for this strand should therefore be strongly audience focused. A clear view is needed of tone and appeal to the listeners. What should it sound like? Why would I listen? These are key questions to address. .......

... 'Essential Classics' is a live, presenter-led, CD-based, music sequence programme. Currently it includes regular themed musical features, quizzes, and a daily guest interview ...

... The programme should be appropriate for the time of day and informed by audience insights. Interaction with listeners, through e-mail, texts and social media, is important and suggestions are invited for how this can be made most effective.

There is also a reference which implies that they expected Rob Cowan to continue presenting. He didn't, he left for CFM in 2017.

... Guide price per episode: £1,400 (excluding presenter fees and the cost of using BBC Radio 3 Continuity Studios and studio managers, which are paid for by the network). [NB Same price as six years before.]

It was me probably. This was written by a commissioner not a producer I suspect. No increase in budget in six years - that says it all really.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Perhaps I should have said that I for one reason or another have only listened to through the night over the last few years and enjoy it very much. I wanted to branch out and listen again during the day now that my new meds keep me more alert daytime.

I suppose I’ll not get a good steer from malcontents, so I’ll listen in and see for myself.

Strewth, that was hard work!

Actually I thought my description was pretty accurate . It should be because I listen to it virtually every day.

[LMcD]

Actually I thought my description was pretty accurate . It should be because I listen to it virtually every day.

I would say your description is spot-on! My 'post-Breakfast re-entry point' used to be the Lunchtime Concert, but that's now Mondays only as part of 'Classical Live', so I guess I'm one of those long-time R3 listeners who now tune out at 0930 and only very occasionally tune in again before 0630 the following day (Sunday to Friday). I do listen to TTN , in a rather disorganized way, if I wake up in the small hours and can't get back to sleep. .

[oddoneout]

Well I’m confused!

What is it? (Please put to one side your long standing frustrations).

Apologies, the end of the sentence got missed off. It was a qualified yes to your second query, i.e. the "bridging/holding" aspect.
It's difficult to put aside my long-standing frustrations as until recently I listened to EC whenever I was at home, and throughout those years was always aware of what a missed opportunity it was. On a more positive side it did adapt/change and lost the most tiresome aspects of its format - a change of presenter helped with that - and the music selection would include a fair helping of the(to me) unfamiliar.

[oddoneout]

To be fair, Gargoyle, a lot of us don't listen to the programme - I tend to switch over to a foreign station on weekday mornings after 'Breakfast' (thereby not fulfilling the programme's remit going by the brief ff has mentioned). It's difficult to give a description of what the programme is about when one doesn't understand what it's about, or what it's for! If you're used to listening to 'Through the Night' (TTN) then 'Essential Classics' is going to be a very different listening experience - no complete works, lots of irrelevant chat, games, listener interaction; It's much lighter fare. As ff has said, the only way to see if you like it is to try it.

But even those of us who do/did listen have struggled to answer the question about what it is for.

[Ein Heldenleben]

I would say your description is spot-on! My 'post-Breakfast re-entry point' used to be the Lunchtime Concert, but that's now Mondays only as part of 'Classical Live', so I guess I'm one of those long-time R3 listeners who now tune out at 0930 and only very occasionally tune in again before 0630 the following day (Sunday to Friday). I do listen to TTN , in a rather disorganized way, if I wake up in the small hours and can't get back to sleep. .

Actually went through the websites for last week. Maybe I’m being a tiny bit harsh but the essential classic “canon “ of Palestrina Monteverdi, The Bachs, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert etc is pretty under represented though Brahms got a few plays . Only two pieces from Haydn , nothing from a Beethoven symphony. One piece of Palestrina - Tu es Petrus . But two pieces of Gershwin- both very regularly played.
A lot of what I was call agreeable second and third rate music often from composers I’m not familiar with. As I’ve heard the western canonical works a lot to me thats not a problem and indeed quite interesting . There is the odd very interesting piece But I do wonder whether people new to classical music might think that the works of Morricone , Bruce , Elena Kats -Chernin etc are what it’s all about. In other words how do they get exposed to the classics on the channel?
Of course maybe the whole programme is an exercise in decolonising and deconstructing the western canon with its implicit patriachal etc etc ? Thing is the French , Italians and Germans are quite proud of their contribution to western musical culture.

On the positive side Skellers is back ! Though starting with the Shostakovich Festival Overture - another massively overplayed piece - like West Side Story also in last weeks playlist I see.

[Andrew Slater]

Actually went through the websites for last week. Maybe I’m being a tiny bit harsh but the essential classic “canon “ of Palestrina Monteverdi, The Bachs, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert etc is pretty under represented though Brahms got a few plays . Only two pieces from Haydn , nothing from a Beethoven symphony. One piece of Palestrina - Tu es Petrus . But two pieces of Gershwin- both very regularly played.

You might find this useful as an automated list. Just change the end date for previous / subsequent weeks or the end date and number of days for a summary over a longer period:

https://radio-lists.org.uk/r3/pldb/pl_v12-05.php?reptype=std&replen=600&incartists=no&composer=*&title=*&artist=*&prog=*ssential*&latest=2024-04-05&days=5&repoff=0&datalen=0#results

[Roger Webb]

On the positive side Skellers is back ! Though starting with the Shostakovich Festival Overture - another massively overplayed piece - like West Side Story also in last weeks playlist I see.

Yes, he just played Doreen Carwithen's (aka Mary Alwyn) Suffolk Suite, another overplayed piece (.at least compared to her husband William Alwyn, who rarely gets a lookin).

I've just returned from Aldeburgh with a side-trip to Blytheburgh and a walk through the reed beds behind their house 'Larkrise'. I did take Carwithen's string quartets away with me - these convey the beauty of that region more than the bland picture post card view of the Suffolk Suite.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Yes, he just played Doreen Carwithen's (aka Mary Alwyn) Suffolk Suite, another overplayed piece (.at least compared to her husband William Alwyn, who rarely gets a lookin).

I've just returned from Aldeburgh with a side-trip to Blytheburgh and a walk through the reed beds behind their house 'Larkrise'. I did take Carwithen's string quartets away with me - these convey the beauty of that region more than the bland picture post card view of the Suffolk Suite.

I know that part of Suffolk very well as a relative has a holiday home there. One of those places where you can combine having a pint at a riverside pub and birdwatch. I don’t know the string quartets - must have a listen . They were a very interesting couple - her reputation seems to be eclipsing his.

[Ein Heldenleben]

You might find this useful as an automated list. Just change the end date for previous / subsequent weeks or the end date and number of days for a summary over a longer period:

https://radio-lists.org.uk/r3/pldb/pl_v12-05.php?reptype=std&replen=600&incartists=no&compos er=*&title=*&artist=*&prog=*ssential*&latest=2024-04-05&days=5&repoff=0&datalen=0#results

thanks Andrew - quite incredibly useful. One staggering headline
In the last 28 days just one piece of J.S. Bach arguably the greatest composer who ever lived and some one who repays daily study,

oh and two pieces by Haydn

but three from -

Agathe Backer-Grondahl

[french frank]

It was me probably. This was written by a commissioner not a producer I suspect. No increase in budget in six years - that says it all really.

It was you! The point is that the commission required certain results from the indie production company which won the contract. Success, or lack of it, would be measurable (more people switching off at 9am? Fail. Average listener age going up rather than down? Fail). But I don't see why BBC producers would need to 'talk about' the audiences and what they were trying to achieve. Their own remit requirements would be built into the programme they set out to produce.

I maintained for years that Radio 3's budget had been squeezed for years, compared with the increased millions that went into the other BBC stations, notably Radio 2. Before Davey took over I showed him the budget figures over past years to illustrate this fact and put to him the view expressed by others that he was being employed as a cost-cutter. He said that was not the job he was being asked to do. He may have been sincere in that, but in that case he was unable to stop the squeeze imposed by the BBC higher echelons.