Essential Classics - The Continuing Debate

[DracoM]

Actually, for me, R3's LATE evening slots are the ones I enjoy most, and significantly are the ones least duplicated by other stations.
I echo ferney very strongly. And v.much like FF's contextual wisdom on this.

[french frank]

Are other musics not part of R3's remit? I ask because I don't know, and perhaps it's time I did know. It's possible I'm expecting more of R3 than in fact it is meant to deliver.

Yes, they are, mostly. But they aren't integrated with the the rest of the station output: they take up a particular slot, every night which means that since they filled the late night slot every night, there is no late night classical music until after midnight. And I was saying that having been 'locked out' of the late night listening slots, the listeners who want something more, to be vague, 'Radio3-like' are now locked out of the entire mornings too, because those programmes are aimed at a different audience.

When Late Junction started, it was on four nights a week. When it proved a success, it was extended in length. But I can't see that Late Junction is part of the remit, and I think the overlap in audiences is quite small.

[french frank]

Actually, for me, R3's LATE evening slots are the ones I enjoy most

Ironically, it's the 'Other Musics' that seem to attract least criticism: they satisfy the audiences they're intended for. It's the classical audiences who are worst treated. More doesn't necessarily mean better.

[oddoneout]

I don't want to "go back" to a previous style of presentation - honest! - I would prefer to see the station progress forward to a much more widely attracting style than the awkward, faux-chumminess that stains the airwaves at present.

I would agree with not going back, but that's not to say that looking at some of what was done in the past isn't worthwhile; I'm not convinced that all of it is irrelevant, out of touch, not attractive to modern audiences.

It was interesting though in the recent 70th anniversary celebrations to hear again presenters like David Munrow . That straightforward , intelligent , style of presentation with no false chumminess seems to have gone out of fashion - in peak hours at any rate .I wonder if young people today would prefer that.

Shouldn't be that hard to find out. At least it wouldn't smack of trying to be 'yoof friendly' and missing the mark completely. TV equivalents seem to work well(such as 'Wild China' on BBC4 again tonight).
Perhaps more effort on the quality of the programmes(content, accuracy, presenter) and less focus on a specific target audience tick box would get better results - just a thought.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Apologies as this is slightly off thread . But Jonathan Swain's link out of the superb Kissin Haydn Piano Sonata and into the John Adams just now was a model of intelligence and thoughtful musical insight all delivered in an understated manner with no false chumminess . Ye Gods ...what are they doing moving him ?Back on thread - a model of how to do it on every day of the week.

[HerbieG]

Essential Classics

Am I the only one who is mortified at the change of format and presenter for Essential Classics? It seems to me that this is yet another futile attempt to wean listeners away from Classic FM. For what it's worth, I think that this past two weeks has been a nightmare; too much chatter by the presenter and the guests and bite-sized morsels, single movements of works and a roller-coaster ride from one brief snatch of music to another. The most amusing bit for me was the first Monday of this rag-bag, which ended just before midday with a piano arrangement by Billy Mayerl of 'Phil the Fluter's Ball', followed by This Week's Composer, Alexander Goehr, and three of his acerbic piano pieces!

He who tries to please everybody pleases nobody. They axed CD Masters some years ago and then replaced it with Essential Classics, which was pretty much the same thing. Rob and Sarah are simply outstanding presenters whose exceptional knowledge and warm-hearted enthusiasm are second to none. What the BBC has now done is make Essential Classics an extension of the Breakfast Show. I can no longer stand this mish-mash and chatter so it's goodbye from me until they revert to doing what they do best and leave the rest to Classic FM.

[Nick Armstrong]

Am I the only one...

Not at all! The debate has been a long one and is continuing here: http://www.for3.org/forums/showthrea...tinuing-Debate

I'd suggest we add your post to that thread, and suspect there'll be a lot of agreement with it!

Welcome to the Forum, incidentally!

[Ein Heldenleben]

Welcome Herbie . You are not the only one. There is an Essential Classics Thread in the forum with many like minded people sharing your opinion.

[french frank]

Welcome, Herbie!

Later today I thought to start an actual new thread, just clarifying - in a reasonable way (!!!) [that's a message to members, not getting at you Herbie!] - where the differences are perceived and why we think they matter. I may be alone in this but I think people do respond to sensible comments …

Just one thing: we've only just changed the discussion title from 'Essential Classics, surely a programme on the wrong station', as many members still hark back to the more specialist days of CD Masters and didn't like Essential Classics before these changes. Classical Collection was already the first step down the 'easy listening' slippery slope.

[french frank]

Postprandial: I suppose we need to understand the thinking behind this: it seems to me that they're not after ferney's 'young audience' but what the BBC calls the 'replenisher audience'. For Radio 3 I think this means the 35-45 age group. Essential Classics already has a huge cumulative audience (gathered throughout the 3 hours), but it would benefit from bringing down the average age which is slightly above the station average. The gamble is that although Ess. Cla. wouldn't increase its reach, Radio 3 won't lose any because the listeners who give up on the programme will still be listening to other programmes on R3. Perhaps …

We need to see what will happen under Rob's watch to judge what is presenter input and what is changed policy, but HerbieG seems to have nailed the principal point that the music content is now no different from Breakfast's: short, varied pieces with no obvious overall plan, and crucially no full-length (= 35-45 minutes) work. So there are just different regular 'features' from the Breakfast regulars, all of them equally annoying(?).

[LMcD]

Am I the only one .....

Definitely not! The previous policy - which I thought worked quite well - of luring listeners in with short, mainly approachable pieces and then moving on to complete performances of substantial works has been ditched. And they've also got rid of a first-rate presenter!

[Richard Tarleton]

A letter in today's Times slagging off the new-look EC, cancelled out by a letter praising R3's am output (both occasioned by recent debate over changes at the Today programme on R4). The author of the first letter, if not already a forumite, would be quite at home here, that of the second is clearly a member of the audience Breakfast and EC are trying to attract.

[french frank]

(both occasioned by recent debate over changes at the Today programme on R4)

Anyone hear this?

(I've had another email this morning from someone who'll probably now be listening to R4 until midday.)

[Bryn]

Anyone hear this?

(I've had another email this morning from someone who'll probably now be listening to R4 until midday.)

There's this, which has no paywall to keep us from it.

[Richard Tarleton]

Anyone hear this?

(I've had another email this morning from someone who'll probably now be listening to R4 until midday.)

Sarah Sands the editor has been trying to get the programme to be more in touch with its feminine side. One example was a hilarious interview of the drily witty Alexandra Shulman by John Humphrys the other day.....

I hadn't actually noticed the change in editorial tone until it was pointed out to me by The Times......