Tearjerker, Downtown Symphony, Piano Flow, Happy Harmonies and other Saturday padding

[french frank]

French - If I may be so familiar - I don’t listen to Breakfast a lot either. But I gather from the Breakfast strand that Petroc’s recent Yorkshire tour was very highly thought of by many on the forum and it struck me as the very distillation of what public service is broadcasting is about (from the two excerpts I heard ) Aren’t you in danger of letting your desire for recovering an Elysian past obscuring the achievements and beauties of the present ? A bit like Thomas Hardy ?

Yes. But it's a matter of what the individual values in life, and that is very different for different people. I hear and appreciate that there are those who find pleasure in Breakfast (at least sometimes), but the format doesn't suit me as someone who finds music either a waste when I'm working because I literally don't hear it, or a distraction from what I'm doing. I could concentrate while eating my metaphorical cornflakes, but then I don't want the music interrupted by birdsong or someone batting on about the beauties of Yorkshire/the borders or whatever. Where's the beef, musically? What's the difference between not being able to concentrate fully on longer works at that time in the morning and only being offered a bit of the work anyway?

But that is my rationale: it doesn't have to be anyone else's. Maybe it's just that I've moved on from Radio 3 anyway. What Radio 3 does offer by way of complete performances I can access elsewhere when I feel like it: I see no point in ferreting through the playlists for something I might like to listen to later.

But this thread is about something different: it's about Radio 3's output being gradually eroded by what I see as R3's futile attempt to get 'younger audiences' interested in classical music. Or are they just trying to get younger listeners interested in Radio 3?

[LMcD]

Oh, yes, as I made clear in #661, we are all individuals with different tastes, tolerances and situations. I didn't listen to radio at all once I left home in my late teens. I've now reverted to that situation. I don't have that need state . I cannot see how a programme like Breakfast can be tolerable if presented by someone called Petroc but is unlistenable if presented by someone called Elizabeth. To me, it's the same programme. For the programmes being discussed in this thread they are a stage worse in that the music repels.

But if Radio 3 as a classical music station disappears, I don't think it will be my fault for not listening: it will be evolutionary forces and the BBC thinking its survival is more important.

Some presenters have a more welcoming voice, and more authority, than others, and the best, which IMHO opinion include Petroc Trelawny and Martin Handley, also wear their considerable musical knowledge lightly and are clearly happy to share it without patronizing or lecturing the listener. Rightly or wrongly, that matters to me.

[french frank]

Some presenters have a more welcoming voice, and more authority, than others, and the best, which IMHO opinion include Petroc Trelawny and Martin Handley, also wear their considerable musical knowledge lightly and are clearly happy to share it without patronizing or lecturing the listener. Rightly or wrongly, that matters to me.

Yes, I don't dispute that, in fact I accept it completely - different strokes. But it only matters to those who think the presenter needs to be as important as the content. The shorter pieces mean the presenters, good or bad, keep 'interrupting' the music. With longer pieces a poor presenter can be tolerated. In fact having heard a full-length piece, one can switch off when the presenter's contribution starts - especially if they offer no/little enlightenment about the music. But this is back to Breakfast/Essential Classics again.

I'm resigned to the fact that Radio 3 no longer caters for me as (an individual) classical music listener. It's the programmes that no longer cater for classical music listeners at all (honourable exceptions for the traditional jazz/world/speech). It's the programmes that purport to be classical or semi-classical or a smattering of classical but are aimed at a 'non Radio 3 listener' in the hope they will be attracted to the shows and become regulars.

[oddoneout]

Yes. But it's a matter of what the individual values in life, and that is very different for different people. I hear and appreciate that there are those who find pleasure in Breakfast (at least sometimes), but the format doesn't suit me as someone who finds music either a waste when I'm working because I literally don't hear it, or a distraction from what I'm doing. I could concentrate while eating my metaphorical cornflakes, but then I don't want the music interrupted by birdsong or someone batting on about the beauties of Yorkshire/the borders or whatever. Where's the beef, musically? What's the difference between not being able to concentrate fully on longer works at that time in the morning and only being offered a bit of the work anyway?

But that is my rationale: it doesn't have to be anyone else's. Maybe it's just that I've moved on from Radio 3 anyway. What Radio 3 does offer by way of complete performances I can access elsewhere when I feel like it: I see no point in ferreting through the playlists for something I might like to listen to later.

But this thread is about something different: it's about Radio 3's output being gradually eroded by what I see as R3's futile attempt to get 'younger audiences' interested in classical music. Or are they just trying to get younger listeners interested in Radio 3?

I'm not convinced that the R3 aspect has anything to do with it anymore - they just want to tick the yoof box across the board and "attracting younger audiences to classical music" gives added gloss and pixie points. The fact that it seems to include the various dumbtime exercises shows just how far adrift the stated aim and the actual aim are.Destroying the "home of classical music" in the process is, if it is recognised at all, probably seen as acceptable collateral damage.
Even before the Brexit fiasco the government was clearly not interested in the arts and the ongoing conversion of BBC to T(ory) BC simply continues that trend. Like Anton I'll keep listening as long as I can, but can't say that I see a future for R3 now.

[french frank]

I'm not convinced that the R3 aspect has anything to do with it anymore

By "Radio 3", I meant "the BBC station which occupies c. 91-93FM", regardless of what it's churning out. The BBC is great at identifying new popular music genres that deserve a new station and will expand 'listener choice'. If R3 doesn't get enough listeners as a classical music station they won't close it down, they'll transform it into something else for which it can discern a ready audience. They might even include André Rieux's latest hits in the 4pm slot, just to keep the flag flying.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I'm not convinced that the R3 aspect has anything to do with it anymore - they just want to tick the yoof box across the board and "attracting younger audiences to classical music" gives added gloss and pixie points.

If that's what they are trying to do, they need to go back to school. Young people are like everyone else, and don't like to be talked down to. And that's exactly what Radio 3 does. My 9 year old granddaughter could teach them a thing or two.

[AuntDaisy]

Here's what we missed this morning; available to our European friends via EBU Notturno, e.g. Swedish radio

https://sverigesradio.se/avsnitt/1745755

01:01 Arnold Schoenberg; Pelleas und Melisande, Op 5; Sydney Symphony Orchestra, Edo de Waart (conductor)
01:43 Claudio Monteverdi; Magnificat for 6 voices from Vespro della Beata Vergine (Venice, 1610); Montreal Early Music Studio, Christopher Jackson (conductor)
01:59 Fryderyk Chopin; Ballade for piano No.1 (Op.23) in G minor; Hinko Haas (piano)
02:09 Giovanni Ambrosio ; Rostiboli Gioioso; Ensemble Claude Gervais, Gilles Plante (director)
02:14 Henryk Gorecki; Three Dances for Orchestra; National Polish Radio Symphony Orchestra, Wojciech Michniewski (conductor)
02:30 Catharina van Rennes; 3 Quartets for women's voices and piano (Op.24); Irene Maessen (soprano), Rachel Ann Morgan (mezzo soprano), Christa Pfeiler (mezzo soprano), Corrie Pronk (alto), Franz van Ruth (piano)
02:35 Dmitri Kabalevsky; Violin Concerto in C major, Op 48; Moshe Hammer (violin), Kazuhiro Koizumi (conductor), Winnipeg Symphony Orchestra
02:51 Ignaz Moscheles; La Gaité - Rondo brillant pour le Piano Forte in A major; Tom Beghin (fortepiano)
Info from https://www.ebu.ch/files/live/sites/...ust%202021.pdf

The Monteverdi & Kabalevsky were excellent and I enjoyed the jump from Chopin to Ambrosio (new to me).

[Serial_Apologist]

Here's what we missed this morning; available to our European friends via EBU Notturno, e.g. Swedish radio

https://sverigesradio.se/avsnitt/1745755

01:01 Arnold Schoenberg; Pelleas und Melisande, Op 5; Sydney Symphony Orchestra, Edo de Waart (conductor)
01:43 Claudio Monteverdi; Magnificat for 6 voices from Vespro della Beata Vergine (Venice, 1610); Montreal Early Music Studio, Christopher Jackson (conductor)
01:59 Fryderyk Chopin; Ballade for piano No.1 (Op.23) in G minor; Hinko Haas (piano)
02:09 Giovanni Ambrosio ; Rostiboli Gioioso; Ensemble Claude Gervais, Gilles Plante (director)
02:14 Henryk Gorecki; Three Dances for Orchestra; National Polish Radio Symphony Orchestra, Wojciech Michniewski (conductor)
02:30 Catharina van Rennes; 3 Quartets for women's voices and piano (Op.24); Irene Maessen (soprano), Rachel Ann Morgan (mezzo soprano), Christa Pfeiler (mezzo soprano), Corrie Pronk (alto), Franz van Ruth (piano)
02:35 Dmitri Kabalevsky; Violin Concerto in C major, Op 48; Moshe Hammer (violin), Kazuhiro Koizumi (conductor), Winnipeg Symphony Orchestra
02:51 Ignaz Moscheles; La Gaité - Rondo brillant pour le Piano Forte in A major; Tom Beghin (fortepiano)
Info from https://www.ebu.ch/files/live/sites/...ust%202021.pdf

The Monteverdi & Kabalevsky were excellent and I enjoyed the jump from Chopin to Ambrosio (new to me).

The Kabalevsky VC is a pleasant enough work, though one takes into account that it dates from the dark Zhdanov period of artistic repression, and Kabalevsky was a "yes man"; likewise the Cello Concerto, written that same year (1948), with its Dr Zhivago-like slow movement theme - (to me it always sounds as if it could have been written for the balalaika).

I would have liked to have heard the Gorecki dances - after abandining serialism he did not always compose in the "Holy Minimalist" style of the 3rd symphony.

[AuntDaisy]

Here's what we missed this morning on Through the Night. Available in its entriety to our European friends, e.g. via Swedish radio

https://sverigesradio.se/avsnitt/1748601

01:01 Johannes Brahms, Arnold Schoenberg (orchestrator); Piano Quartet in G minor, Op 25; Sydney Symphony Orchestra, Edo de Waart (conductor)
01:43 Francesco Cavalli; Plainsong Antiphon and Magnificat; Concerto Palatino
02:01 Clara Schumann; Prelude and Fugue in B flat major, Op 16 no 2; Angela Cheng (piano)
02:06 Antonin Dvorak; Two Slavonic Dances, op.46 - No. 8 In G Minor and No.3 In A flat major; Oslo Philharmonic Orchestra, Arvid Engegard (conductor)
02:14 Jacobus Vaet; Postquam consumati essent dies; Huelgas Ensemble, Paul van Nevel (conductor)
02:20 Leevi Madetoja; The Ostrobothnians, Suite for Orchestra (Op.52) (1923); Finnish Radio Symphony Orchestra, Jorma Panula (conductor)
02:36 Boldizsar Csiky; Divertimento for wind ensemble; Budapest Wind Ensemble, Kalman Berkes (leader)
02:49 Georg Philipp Telemann; Trio No 2 from Essercizii Musici, for Viola da gamba, Harpsichord obligato & bc; Camerata Koln, Rainer Zipperling (viola da gamba), Ghislaine Wauters (viola da gamba), Harald Hoeren (harpsichord)
Info from https://www.ebu.ch/files/live/sites/...ust%202021.pdf

[Jonathan]

The Madetoja is a super work! Must give my recording a spin.

[AuntDaisy]

Here's what we missed today. Available to our European friends via EBU Notturno, e.g. Swedish radio.

https://sverigesradio.se/avsnitt/1748883

01:01 Uuno Klami; Kalevala Suite, Op 23; Finnish Radio Symphony Orchestra, Mikko Franck (conductor)
01:39 Jan Dismas Zelenka; Missa Nativitatis Domini, ZWV.8; Barbora Sojkova (soprano), Stanislava Mihalcova (soprano), Marta Fadljevicova (mezzo soprano), Marketa Cukrova (contralto), Sylva Cmugrova (contralto), Daniela Cermakova (contralto), Jarosla Brezina (tenor), Cenek Svoboda (tenor), Tomas Kral (baritone), Jaromir Nosek (bass), Musica Florea, Marek Stryncl (director)
02:13 Luka Sorkocevic, Frano Matusic (arranger); Symphony no 3 in D major; Dubrovnik Guitar Trio
02:21 Jan Pieterszoon Sweelinck; Variations on 'Mein junges Leben hat ein End'; Academic Wind Quintet
02:29 Henry Purcell; Sonata No.6 for 2 violins and continuo in G minor (Z.807); Il Tempo Ensemble
02:36 Christoph Gluck; Dance of the Blessed Spirits - dance music from 'Orphée et Euridice'; Australian Brandenburg Orchestra, Paul Dyer (conductor)
02:43 Bernat Vivancos; A Child is born; Latvian Radio Choir, Sigvards Klava (conductor)
02:51 Antonin Dvorak; Prague Waltzes B.99; Slovak Radio Symphony Orchestra, Stefan Robl (conductor)

Info from https://www.ebu.ch/files/live/sites/...ust%202021.pdf

Uuno Klami is completely new to me; I enjoyed the Zelenka, Sweelinck & Purcell.

[AuntDaisy]

Here's what we missed this morning. Available to our European friends, e.g on Swedish radio

https://sverigesradio.se/avsnitt/1771245

The loss of the Zelenka is particularly cutting as "Downtime Drivel" is a REPEAT* from March!!!

01:01 Jan Dismas Zelenka; Missa Dei filii (Missa ultimarum secundat) ZWV.20; Martina Jankova (soprano), Wiebke Lehmkuhl (contralto), Krystian Adam Krzeszowiak (tenor), Felix Rumpf (bass), Dresden Chamber Choir, Wrocław Baroque Orchestra, Vaclav Luks (conductor)
01:42 Johannes Brahms; Violin Sonata No 3 in D minor, Op 108; Marianne Thorsen (violin), Havard Gimse (piano)
02:05 Toivo Kuula; Festive March Op 13; Finnish Radio Symphony Orchestra, George de Godzinsky (conductor)
02:14 Petronio Franceschini; Sonata for 2 trumpets, strings & basso continuo in D major; Yordan Kojuharov (trumpet), Petar Ivanov (trumpet), Teodor Moussev (organ), Sofia Philharmonic Orchestra, Yordan Dafov (conductor)
02:22 Gabriel Faure; Nocturne for piano in E flat minor, Op 33 no 1; Livia Rev (piano)
02:30 Engelbert Humperdinck; Overture from Hansel and Gretel; Symphony Nova Scotia, Georg Tintner (conductor)
02:39 Imant Raminsh; Ave Verum Corpus; Vancouver Chamber Choir, Jon Washburn (conductor)
02:45 Dinu Lipatti; Chorale for String Orchestra; Romanian National Radio Orchestra, Horia Andreescu (conductor)
02:50 Sebastian Bodinus; Trio for oboe and 2 bassoons in G major; Hildebrand'sche Hoboisten Compagnie
Info from https://www.ebu.ch/files/live/sites/...ust%202021.pdf

I'm really enjoying the glorious Zelenka (Possibly a scheduler / John Shea favourite - it was on TTN 5th August and 12th May).
Interestingly, the Swedes replaced the JDZ intro with birdsong. I'd happily swap certain R3 presenters with even the cronk-cronk of a raven.

* I'm tempted to add "O fat white controller whom nobody loves, why do you repeat so much and so much?" but that would be unfair to Mrs. Cornford and rather rude.

[french frank]

but that would be unfair to Cornford and rather rude.

Perhaps 'to Mrs Cornford' would be more polite? Or have we moved from there in the 21st century?

[AuntDaisy]

Perhaps 'to Mrs Cornford' would be more polite? Or have we moved from there in the 21st century?

Yes, you're right. I'll correct it.

[AuntDaisy]

This "Happy Harmonies" trailer annoyed me on Twitter today - what a great example* for the youth of today. Two hours of TTN for this!

https://twitter.com/BBCRadio3/status/1432659453938176004

...
Of what I think
It's only when I drink, I open up
...

* Unless it's Icelandic spring water.