Implications of Radio 2 changes

[zola]

Among much else, I see that Radio 2 is axing The Organist Entertains and Listen To The Band. Specifically saying that "brass band music will continue to be played elsewhere." Hmm, I wonder where "elsewhere" would be ? ( as Radio 3 continues its metamorphosis into the Light Programme )

[LMcD]

Among much else, I see that Radio 2 is axing The Organist Entertains and Listen To The Band. Specifically saying that "brass band music will continue to be played elsewhere." Hmm, I wonder where "elsewhere" would be ? ( as Radio 3 continues its metamorphosis into the Light Programme )

Up North, happen? It looks as if we're heading towards Radio 1.5 and Radio 3 Lite.

[french frank]

Among much else, I see that Radio 2 is axing The Organist Entertains and Listen To The Band. Specifically saying that "brass band music will continue to be played elsewhere." Hmm, I wonder where "elsewhere" would be ? ( as Radio 3 continues its metamorphosis into the Light Programme )

I noted that too. A further move by the BBC Director of Music, aka Controller Radio 2, to remove non pop from Radio 2 and promote ex-Radio 1 presenters. My take would be that it is to reduce the average age of the Radio 2 audience and bundle all Music for Oldies on to Radio 3, no matter what - film, musicals, smooth jazz &c to 'boost' Radio 3's audience. It has happened once before.

[Stanfordian]

Among much else, I see that Radio 2 is axing The Organist Entertains and Listen To The Band. Specifically saying that "brass band music will continue to be played elsewhere." Hmm, I wonder where "elsewhere" would be ? ( as Radio 3 continues its metamorphosis into the Light Programme )

Hiya zola,

I think you are dead right with your assertion that "Radio 3 continues its metamorphosis into the Light Programme."

'The Organist Entertains' is probably partly recorded by the presenter at a house near me but although I listen to it only occasionally it will be sad if it was made redundant.

[hmvman]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/latestnews/2018/radio-2-spring-schedule

I love the euphemism 'rested'

There's no mention of light organ music being incorporated into other programmes so does this mean that the genre has now completely disappeared from the airwaves?

[subcontrabass]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/lat...pring-schedule
I love the euphemism 'rested'

There's no mention of light organ music being incorporated into other programmes so does this mean that the genre has now completely disappeared from the airwaves?

Next paragraph:

"The yearly Young Brass Award will remain as a Friday Night Is Music Night special in April; whilst brass and organ music will be included in Friday Night is Music Night weekly programmes throughout the year. Brass will continue to be heavily featured on a weekly basis in Clare Teal’s Sunday night show, which celebrates big band music."

[french frank]

There's no mention of light organ music being incorporated into other programmes so does this mean that the genre has now completely disappeared from the airwaves?

I now recall three separate occasions when programmes were axed and the BBC reassurance for the fans was always that the music would still be played, but in other parts of the schedule:

1) BBC Legends (BBC classic recordings)

2) Choirworks (major full-length choral works)

and

3) Brian Kay's Light Programmes - which provoked the memorable response from the secretary of the Robert Farnon Society: "Personally I think that very few of us will want to endure the majority of Radio 3’s usual output in the hope of occasionally hearing a piece of light music." And if that was the response of the 'light music fans' it surely indicates that the music was always out of place on Radio 3?

[cloughie]

Up North, happen? It looks as if we're heading towards Radio 1.5 and Radio 3 Lite.

What do you mean heading towards we've been there for years. The writing was on the wall when they were shifted to late night graveyard slots! Radio Cornwall does have an hour of Brass from 7.00pm on Sundays - presumably available on Radio iPlayer!

[hmvman]

I now recall three separate occasions when programmes were axed and the BBC reassurance for the fans was always that the music would still be played, but in other parts of the schedule:

1) BBC Legends (BBC classic recordings)

2) Choirworks (major full-length choral works)

and

3) Brian Kay's Light Programmes - which provoked the memorable response from the secretary of the Robert Farnon Society: "Personally I think that very few of us will want to endure the majority of Radio 3’s usual output in the hope of occasionally hearing a piece of light music." And if that was the response of the 'light music fans' it surely indicates that the music was always out of place on Radio 3?

Yes, it's a depressingly familiar empty promise. I enjoy 'light' music and used to enjoy Brian Kay's programme, although I accept that its place on R3 was debatable. When R3 ran the 'Light Fantastic' series a few years ago there was a lot of handwringing and cries of, "why don't we hear more of this music." Since then there's been hardly any of it played on R3 or elsewhere as far as I can tell. Is there really any chance that light organ music will appear on FNIMN?

[hmvman]

Interesting that we're having this discussion about R3 becoming the 'Light Programme' as I was thinking this morning that R4 is becoming the place to go for more informative music programmes. There's been the excellent 'Tales from the Stave' series. This morning there was an edition of the 'Soul Music' series on Bach's Ich Habe Genug. Although the programme was more about people's reactions to the music it was still a very interesting and compelling listen.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b09l07ly

I know some would say that this is the kind of programme R3 should be doing but there aren't many R3 programmes now that would feature a contributor telling us, "If one's thinking of the symbolism of it all it is the very end of the third aria. It's again in C minor this fast, last movement. Bach uses the most amazing device…..and as you come to the end he remains in C minor and intends to end in C minor but right at the very end he uses the fantastic so-called 'Tierce de Picardie' where the E flat, which is the minor third of the C minor chord, becomes a natural and you end in C major…"

I can imagine the suits at R3 going ashen-faced with horror at the thought of information like that being broadcast!

[DracoM]

I noted that too. A further move by the BBC Director of Music, aka Controller Radio 2, to remove non pop from Radio 2 and promote ex-Radio 1 presenters. My take would be that it is to reduce the average age of the Radio 2 audience and bundle all Music for Oldies on to Radio 3, no matter what - film, musicals, smooth jazz &c to 'boost' Radio 3's audience. It has happened once before.

Ominously correct, I fear.

[Lat-Literal]

Very sad to see these programmes disappear. Brass bands in particular speak of British heritage. There is also a thriving youth aspect. Each implies hobbyism which itself is a part of the cultural lifeblood of this country beyond shopping and other forms of corporatism. See also vehicle owners' clubs and very much more. At BBC HQ, both brass bands and organ music will no doubt be seen as old people's stuff. Not for families, probably ostensibly male, and linked to a generation that is slowly dying out. To the extent that is true, we have an irony here. This considerable section of the population is the least internet savvy and yet the net is where they are now expected to go for their entertainment. Good luck to them on that one.

For those of us who are a decade or two younger, there is an additional area of abandonment. People who are only interested in classical music need to be aware that BBC Radio 2 is increasingly becoming out of bounds for many over 50. That is to say that the buyers of Q magazine and the like from the 1990s onwards were encouraged by those publications to build on their natural instincts to separate the substantial in rock and pop music from the unquestionably disposable. It was a development from - and a broadening out - of the genre-based tastes of youthful clans and for many an education. But the accent on new pop in the last 20 years which even in its teenage fans and their mothers is regarded as here today and gone tomorrow has made not only the purely adolescent R1 unlistenable but also R2 as it seeks to incorporate that content in order that it suits families. That position worsens annually.

And this doesn't simply alienate the more discerning in middle age. As the UKRD Group which operates a number of slightly acceptable commercial stations has identified, it has also alienated many who once just enjoyed the mainstream and even a lot of young people who regard most recent pop output as tripe. Consequently, stations such as Eagle Radio in Surrey and Hants and Pirate Radio in Cornwall have very recently provided separate services playing 70s music "and more". They are preferable to many folk if too mainstream for the discriminating and are now there in the knowledge that they are catering for the people who the BBC has dumped. Of course, people like me are not daft enough not to see that what is purported to be local radio along those lines is in fact one station, in effect part national, being pumped out under the various local banners and with all those blessed commercials about hospices etc. The blandest of presenters too so not as in our time although that point also applies to BBC national radio today. Best to steer clear so that memories aren't trashed and to feel even part way alive. One can, of course, trawl R4, 6M, BBC local radio, Late Junction etc but YT and Spotify are easier and enable the explorer to chart his or her own journey.

Anyhow, R3 hasn't a lot to fear here. No one is looking for an alternative place for the shows mentioned. What doesn't sell like chocolate bars is just placed in the bin. They might say that you will find organ music and brass band music in other programmes but there are few of a certain age who will have the energy or will to find a needle in a haystack. When the folk programmes on BBC local radio were removed, it was said that the folk music would be found in general programming but that never happened just as many of us predicted. R4E could be redesigned so that it is a comedy, drama and hobbyist channel but the BBC is scared stiff of catering for the non-youth fringes. Given we hear each day accusations about bias on the grounds of gender, race, religion and sexual orientation, perhaps it is time to have a go at them on age. But then life is too short. I think we'll all eventually ditch the BBC and, in fact, radio altogether. The point that they are all forgetting - and it will be to the detriment of both sectors - is that the current 50-70 year olds can, in the main, operate a computer.

[eighthobstruction]

....and then when the Radar figures and other figures say that all the listeners are dead dead dead....then they will turn off the FM signal....very soon they will be trying again....

[DracoM]

.........or R3 becomes a series if interlocked mixtapes linked by Ian Skelly and Katie Derham.

[Lat-Literal]

.........or R3 becomes a series if interlocked mixtapes linked by Ian Skelly and Katie Derham.

The entire mixtape thing is a cop out. It's non radio on the radio. Lorry drivers used to tune into R2 in the night to hear a voice. It was a link between missing loved ones at home and having some sense of connection with other people in the blinking half-light beyond the motorway network. As such, it enabled the BBC to perform one of its most vital informal roles of national cohesion. At least TTN does provide a voice. That it is Europe-wide and funded on that basis isn't counter-intuitive at that time of the day given the international dimension of many on the move. Quite how many of them are natural R3 listeners is another matter. Then there is the content. I'm not a fan of Robert Simpson myself but given Beefo's comments here over a long period of time, the fact that this British composer wasn't played at all in 2017 on R3 is a clear indication to me that there is complete indifference to public viewpoints.