Late-evening pleasures on Radio 3

[Ein Heldenleben]

Or because I use the search facility to see who uses particular words more than anyone else

You should do a list of words and let us guess the highest user allowing for number of posts !
Mine must be piano , opera , trail , irritating

[oddoneout]

I think it speaks to people today because it's been presented cleverly as the work of a feisty, empowered modern woman transplanted into the Middle Ages, in the same waythat Marain Marais' music , after being ignored for centuries, suddenly spoke to people today when it was featured in a popular film: it's the musical Girl with Pearl Earring.

I was listening this morning on TTN to Maciej Radziwill's Divertimento in D. Like the other composers mentioned above, he's an example of hundreds, perhaps thousands of intelligent people who learnt to write an acceptable and pleasant piece of music, but he's not so highly praised as Jaquet and Strozzi because there was no extra-musical reason for promoting him to 'great composer' status'.


By contrast, I also listened to what is perhaps Beethoven's least work ,the Music for a Ritterballett, WoO 1. Even here what is clear is the ability to write vital memorable music . That's the difference for me.

I think there are several reasons for HB's wider recognition, of which the fact she was a woman is but one. Her work on medical matters was of interest to those looking at alternative approaches to the treatment of health, and the rise in popular interest in plainchant/monastic music would have helped bring her name to wider attention on the music front.
Her achievements as a woman have inevitably drawn attention from what might be loosely called feminist groups, and some of that attention is arguably less than helpful. However that happens in all such cases of minority or focus groups being subjected to modern approaches to equality, diversity etc. For all those who welcome such highlighting and feel it brings positive benefits, there will be others who feel it can work against their cause, not least by arousing negativity. If a particular group is seen to be promoted uncritically simply because of its particular definition(eg gender) then questions such as have been raised in recent posts arise - is it objectively good, or is it good because/considering.
It's a difficult line to tread - ensuring that individuals, in this case composers, are presented to the wider world, but without going to the other extreme of conferring worth simply because of membership of some group currently of political/media/commercial interest.
I wish that R3 didn't have to be part of these tiresome and often counter-productive games, but so long as there are others pulling strings labelled equality, diversity, wimmin etc and demanding that boxes are ticked then that's what we're stuck with.
Marin Marais was becoming much more widely known, thanks to those in the Early Music field involved in the renaissance of viol playing, long before the popular film appeared. When I was learning viola in the 60s several of the pieces I played were from Marais's output. The film may have brought his work to a wider and different audience, but that has also happened with music by other, mainstream(proper?) composers.

[cloughie]

Actually Hildegard has been somewhat criticised by feminists for her meek acceptance of the inferiority of women. She was not feisty - just formidably intelligent , diligent and devout in a way we cannot begin to comprehend . She should however be a hero to those feminists - devoting her life to the patient study of the curative properties of plants and healing as well a cataloguer, An absolutely remarkable woman - she also is believed to have introduced hops into brewing - extending the shelf life of beer . So a hero to men as well I guess.
I forgot…she’s also a Saint. Something even Beethoven never managed.

I’ve always thought of Beethoven as an excellent composer but do many of us think he was a saint? - probably too grumpy to attain that!

[oddoneout]

I’ve always thought of Beethoven as an excellent composer but do many of us think he was a saint? - probably too grumpy to attain that!

I suspect that there were more than a few saints who weren't the easiest people to be around...

[antongould]

I’ve always thought of Beethoven as an excellent composer but do many of us think he was a saint? - probably too grumpy to attain that!

I never knew LVB was an Owls supporter …

[Ein Heldenleben]

I suspect that there were more than a few saints who weren't the easiest people to be around...

The list of Saints who were also composers is very short. It does include St Thomas Aquinas but I don’t think I’ve ever heard any of his music.

[vinteuil]

The list of Saints who were also composers is very short. It does include St Thomas Aquinas but I don’t think I’ve ever heard any of his music.

https://www.exhibit.xavier.edu/cgi/v...%20methodology.

[Kernow Malc]

Night tracks. Music pretty decent- presentation repetitive. I never want to hear the phrase 'and you can get full details of all the tracks on our website' ever again! I listen to the Swiss station mostly now or Ancient FM.

[smittims]

Yes, I find it tiresome when , in the middle of a programme such as 'Classical Live'or 'This week's composer' we keep being reminded that we can hear it on our mobile phone or smart speaker. I expect they've all been told to keep saying these things repeatedly. The BBC seems to fear a losing battle with the internet. On Radio 4 they keep telling us the number to text if we want to get in touch. I don't go for this 'joining-in' thing. I regard the radio as something to listen to .

[oddoneout]

Yes, I find it tiresome when , in the middle of a programme such as 'Classical Live'or 'This week's composer' we keep being reminded that we can hear it on our mobile phone or smart speaker. I expect they've all been told to keep saying these things repeatedly. The BBC seems to fear a losing battle with the internet. On Radio 4 they keep telling us the number to text if we want to get in touch. I don't go for this 'joining-in' thing. I regard the radio as something to listen to .

So do I, not least as it's the only way I can access the content. However, I get the feeling that increasingly radio(as in switch on and listen - is the term linear radio?) is regarded by the BBC as a tiresome imposition that it would be quite happy to shed. As such, the irritation factor of the inserted junk doesn't signify because "everyone" can listen on Sounds with the implication that such material can be edited out if it's that much of an issue.

[Old Grumpy]

So do I, not least as it's the only way I can access the content. However, I get the feeling that increasingly radio(as in switch on and listen - is the term linear radio?) is regarded by the BBC as a tiresome imposition that it would be quite happy to shed. As such, the irritation factor of the inserted junk doesn't signify because "everyone" can listen on Sounds with the implication that such material can be edited out if it's that much of an issue.

I asked my Google AI friend "Why is the BBC no longer interested in linear radio stations?". The first answer was that music stations must cater more for younger and C2DE listeners (which certainly excludes me and possibly many other boardees).

Ofcom seem to be behind this move:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv-radio-and-on-demand/bbc/bbc-must-do-more-to-serve-audiences-on-lower-incomes/

[french frank]

I asked my Google AI friend "Why is the BBC no longer interested in linear radio stations?". The first answer was that music stations must cater more for younger and C2DE listeners (which certainly excludes me and possibly many other boardees).

Ofcom seem to be behind this move:

The questionable premise is that listening preferences can be deduced by age and social grade. So classical music is less important because it only appeals to older ABC1s who already have scads of stuff catering for their tastes. It also follows unarguably that younger, C2DEs should be fed junk food because 'that's what they like'.

[Serial_Apologist]

I asked my Google AI friend "Why is the BBC no longer interested in linear radio stations?". The first answer was that music stations must cater more for younger and C2DE listeners (which certainly excludes me and possibly many other boardees).

Ofcom seem to be behind this move:

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv-radio-an...lower-incomes/

The OFCOM report - which is interesting btw - gives no indication that lower income groups are turning (resorting) to Sounds and the iPlayer in greater numbers than higher earners. Also, while BBC bias is given mention, the definition, namely in which direction(s), is not stated. This morning Carole Malone alleged, unchallenged, on The Jeremy Vine Show (CH5) that the BBC was becoming more and more left wing-biased by the day. This should be demanded to be substantiated with at least three examples from the past month's broadcasting. However I digress. Substituting listening or viewing on Sounds and iPlayer for what they call linear, with the idea that to the broadcasting powers that be it no longer matters when one sees or listens to any programme, both de-contextualises events along with their reportage and downgrades temporal experiential commonality: in other words no longer is it informing the kind of communitarian experience broadcasting contributed in the past towards "spreading the word" - this now being left to the unaccountable arbitrariness of "social media". Meanwhile programmes are being pulled or re-scheduled to satisfy current gatekeepers on what conveniently constitutes the right kind of political correctness or to protect over-salaried reputations. It seems pretty obvious what is going on: costs are being disingenuously cited by Ofcom as a camouflage for decimated information dissemination, with the BBC chiefs as usual finding news ways for doing their political masters' bidding.

[Ein Heldenleben]

The questionable premise is that listening preferences can be deduced by age and social grade. So classical music is less important because it only appeals to older ABC1s who already have scads of stuff catering for their tastes. It also follows unarguably that younger, C2DEs should be fed junk food because 'that's what they like'.

There’s quite of lot of well grounded research that Radio 3’s audience is skewed male, over 55 and ABC1. It’s not just Rajar figures but other surveys the BBC does. Radio 5 and local Radio tend to be more C2DE. The conundrum the BBC has is that the ABC1 audience reaction tend to be supporters of the licence fee - something that’s not largely true of C2DE’s.
The other problem is that the core audience - the one that drives support the BBC One audience is in long term slow decline. People should be under no illusion if support for the licence fee keeps declining subscription won’t go any where near replacing the cost of its current service provision . It might raise a billion tops. Radio 3 and 4 and 5 would be amongst the first services to go leaving little more than BBC One and a few national radio services. Maybe 1, 2 ,and a Radio 3/ 4 . Something uncannily similar to broadcasting in 1937.
The other problem is that the BBC faces a huge range of implacable enemies ranging from Vladimir Putin to Rupert Murdoch and when you look at the comments in most right wing newspapers they seem to have convinced many of their readers that defunding the BBC is the road to take. All I can say is try listening to the news in the 45
percent of the world that has neither a truly free press or broadcasting System .

[Ein Heldenleben]

The OFCOM report - which is interesting btw - gives no indication that lower income groups are turning (resorting) to Sounds and the iPlayer in greater numbers than higher earners. Also, while BBC bias is given mention, the definition, namely in which direction(s), is not stated. This morning Carole Malone alleged, unchallenged, on The Jeremy Vine Show (CH5) that the BBC was becoming more and more left wing-biased by the day. This should be demanded to be substantiated with at least three examples from the past month's broadcasting. However I digress. Substituting listening or viewing on Sounds and iPlayer for what they call linear, with the idea that to the broadcasting powers that be it no longer matters when one sees or listens to any programme, both de-contextualises events along with their reportage and downgrades temporal experiential commonality: in other words no longer is it informing the kind of communitarian experience broadcasting contributed in the past towards "spreading the word" - this now being left to the unaccountable arbitrariness of "social media". Meanwhile programmes are being pulled or re-scheduled to satisfy current gatekeepers on what conveniently constitutes the right kind of political correctness or to protect over-salaried reputations. It seems pretty obvious what is going on: costs are being disingenuously cited by Ofcom as a camouflage for decimated information dissemination, with the BBC chiefs as usual finding news ways for doing their political masters' bidding.

You can fit what OFCOM has done to protect and encourage programme production in the UK for audiences in the UK into a very small thimble. They’ve sat back , produced reports and watched it fall to pieces. ITV will soon be owned by the Americans like C5 , C4 is facing oblivion and the BBC shrinking to a pale shadow,