Radio 3 spinoff station

[kindofblue]

There is little more stressful for me than being told what I am about to hear will de-stress me. It's what some Buddhists call 'McMindfulness'.

[Pulcinella]

There is little more stressful for me than being told what I am about to hear will de-stress me. It's what some Buddhists call 'McMindfulness'.

A bit like being told 'Just a little scratch' (No, it's a little prick! ) before being jabbed for a blood test.

[Serial_Apologist]

There is little more stressful for me than being told what I am about to hear will de-stress me. It's what some Buddhists call 'McMindfulness'.

One assumption behind much of such simplified music would appear to be the less detail and content, the more relaxing/de-stressing. But present-centred attention, or Mindfulness, is also advocated for open-air all-inclusiveness, implying a "maximalist" stimulation environment, one in which through relaxation the attention wandereth where it willl and takes in more at a time than spoonfed minimalism advocates. The mistake seems to be in separating off the intellectual perception, dealing with detail of undefined complexity, from the, presumably, emotional or sensual. As I pointed out earlier on another thread, Buddhists - especially Zen Buddhists, with whom the concept of Mindfulness has heretofore been associated, do not hive intellect off from emotion; on the contrary they see the former as naturally evolved from the latter, and any perceived or practised split between them to be primordially problematic and a cause of so much of what is wrong about "western civilisation".

[Serial_Apologist]

A bit like being told 'Just a little scratch' (No, it's a little prick! ) before being jabbed for a blood test.

A better analogy (well, one I like more) is the "bugged" idea, namely being told not to think of x when taking a medicine, otherwise it will not be effective. So one is thinking about not thinking about x, and thinking about thinking about not thinking, etc - a self-defeating strategy for cybernetic fouling up which comes ultimately from lack of inner faith, born of culturally ingrained self-mistrust and ultimately deriving from our religious inheritance.

[richardfinegold]

There are 2 notable issues in this thread. The first is the obvious issue of the deterioration of what had been a leading cultural light, the flagship of the BBC. Why is Radio 3 being saddled with the ‘relaxation’ shows. My wife is a recently retired Chemotherapy Nurse. Her area is high stress, with understandably nervous patients having to endure long delays and wait times. Several years ago they switched to Classical Music for the waiting room and she opined that it had a calming impact. Fast food and convenience stores here have long used classical music as a way of discouraging teenage hooligans from loitering.
So our music has had a niche in modern society for this perceived calming effect. It is therefore not a surprise that the station is more actively courting that audience with the sonic wall paper that formerly had been reserved for spas. After all you needn’t worry about music such as the Rite of Spring ruining a good buzz.
The second issue is, Why do people need to be calmed so much? Is Life in our times more stressful than previous decades or centuries? I think it is. Between the news outlets that assault people 24/7 with the next catastrophe designed to generate clicks, and the multitasking that probably leads to decreased attention spans, the younger generations in particular are a bundle of nerves.

[smittims]

Yes, I think you've summed this up very well. Without wanting to get into politics, I believe the government restrictions in 2020 and after seem to have had a terrible effect on young people's future mental health. I suppose broadcasting smoochy classical is cheaper than spending more on the NHS. The labelling of classical music as 'calming' or whatever suggests to me that those ordering this move don't really know, or care what classical music is. To them it's an available glue to shove into a hole in the dyke. And I suppose Radio 3 managers are grateful that classical music is being seen as having a social use, when they are fearing that the government sees increasingly as having no value in their vision of Britain.

[french frank]

The labelling of classical music as 'calming' or whatever suggests to me that those ordering this move don't really know, or care what classical music is. To them it's an available glue to shove into a hole in the dyke. And I suppose Radio 3 managers are grateful that classical music is being seen as having a social use, when they are fearing that the government sees increasingly as having no value in their vision of Britain.

And maybe those who should - and do - know better opt to extract the slow movements (Elvira Madigan, anyone?) from longer works. But how many listeners are now coming to appreciate R3 as musical easy listening?

That said, a week ago FoR3 was copied into a listener email to Radio 3 which expressed deep enjoyment of Night Tracks - ideal late night listening to replace the lamented John Peel's programme. So we get R3 as a replacement for R1 (John Peel, Andy Kershaw), R2 (Friday Night Is Music Night, Jools Holland) and 6 Music (Elizabeth Alker's Unclassified) and so on.

[LMcD]

And maybe those who should - and do - know better opt to extract the slow movements (Elvira Madigan, anyone?) from longer works. But how many listeners are now coming to appreciate R3 as musical easy listening?

That said, a week ago FoR3 was copied into a listener email to Radio 3 which expressed deep enjoyment of Night Tracks - ideal late night listening to replace the lamented John Peel's programme. So we get R3 as a replacement for R1 (John Peel, Andy Kershaw), R2 (Friday Night Is Music Night, Jools Holland) and 6 Music (Elizabeth Alker's Unclassified) and so on.

Perhaps it might also become the new home of the now dreadfully dumbed-down 'Counterpoint' quiz from Radio 4, in which I once participated (in Ned Sherrin's day) and to which I used to listen.

[kindofblue]

One assumption behind much of such simplified music would appear to be the less detail and content, the more relaxing/de-stressing. But present-centred attention, or Mindfulness, is also advocated for open-air all-inclusiveness, implying a "maximalist" stimulation environment, one in which through relaxation the attention wandereth where it willl and takes in more at a time than spoonfed minimalism advocates. The mistake seems to be in separating off the intellectual perception, dealing with detail of undefined complexity, from the, presumably, emotional or sensual. As I pointed out earlier on another thread, Buddhists - especially Zen Buddhists, with whom the concept of Mindfulness has heretofore been associated, do not hive intellect off from emotion; on the contrary they see the former as naturally evolved from the latter, and any perceived or practised split between them to be primordially problematic and a cause of so much of what is wrong about "western civilisation".

Your reference to Zen Buddhism, in which I have a particular interest, is well made Serial Apologist. We are once again dealing with the appropriation of a practice dating back many hundreds of years by another culture, which then commodifies it in the most banal manner. The idea of turning on a radio show, and somehow, and in some way, becoming more 'mindful', is both hilarious and sad. It is the audio equivalent of popping a pill. One would, in all seriousness, be much better off doing some gardening; to focus solely on doing that one thing fully, to take in all of the sounds and smells and textures would lead one to be completely mindful. It could equally be cycling, drawing, any number of things. The idea that you tune into something that plays you a selection of 'carefully curated' tunes and then possibly birdsong or crashing waves, which will then lead you to some inner calm, is frankly risible. It may be interesting or entertaining, and those are in themselves desirable, but let us not pretend that there is anything 'mindful' about it.

[Serial_Apologist]

Your reference to Zen Buddhism, in which I have a particular interest, is well made Serial Apologist. We are once again dealing with the appropriation of a practice dating back many hundreds of years by another culture, which then commodifies it in the most banal manner. The idea of turning on a radio show, and somehow, and in some way, becoming more 'mindful', is both hilarious and sad. It is the audio equivalent of popping a pill. One would, in all seriousness, be much better off doing some gardening; to focus solely on doing that one thing fully, to take in all of the sounds and smells and textures would lead one to be completely mindful. It could equally be cycling, drawing, any number of things. The idea that you tune into something that plays you a selection of 'carefully curated' tunes and then possibly birdsong or crashing waves, which will then lead you to some inner calm, is frankly risible. It may be interesting or entertaining, and those are in themselves desirable, but let us not pretend that there is anything 'mindful' about it.

Exactly, kindofblue - I couldn't agree more.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

The real problem if that the BBC refuses to listen for most of the time. It’s sycophancy is probably at its highest on its Facebook page - and, for the record, I’ve been blocked by them for saying what they don’t want to hear.

[french frank]

It’s sycophancy is probably at its highest on its Facebook page - and, for the record, I’ve been blocked by them for saying what they don’t want to hear.

I gave up posting when they stopped allowing people to start their own discussions and deleted their own threads about the programmes that were getting very negative comments. That said, I wasn't very keen on the members who only joined this forum in order to put the boot into FoR3. But the public does pay for R3; it didn't contribute to FoR3 .

Also, when the BBC messageboards were discontinued R3's Facebook and Twitter were supposed to replace them. It was obvious from the start that they were just intended to be marketing tools. Although there have been sporadic criticisms of the 'moderation' here, we have allowed people to express views with which FoR3 didn't agree - and then got the subsequent flak from those who acted on the assumption (genuinely or maliciously) that posters were all expressing FoR3's views.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Your reference to Zen Buddhism, in which I have a particular interest, is well made Serial Apologist. We are once again dealing with the appropriation of a practice dating back many hundreds of years by another culture, which then commodifies it in the most banal manner. The idea of turning on a radio show, and somehow, and in some way, becoming more 'mindful', is both hilarious and sad. It is the audio equivalent of popping a pill. One would, in all seriousness, be much better off doing some gardening; to focus solely on doing that one thing fully, to take in all of the sounds and smells and textures would lead one to be completely mindful. It could equally be cycling, drawing, any number of things. The idea that you tune into something that plays you a selection of 'carefully curated' tunes and then possibly birdsong or crashing waves, which will then lead you to some inner calm, is frankly risible. It may be interesting or entertaining, and those are in themselves desirable, but let us not pretend that there is anything 'mindful' about it.

Absolutely right . I did a lot of mindfulness exercises during lockdown. I found them very useful. The one thing the book / cd stressed is it’s not about relaxation or “chillaxing “ though lower anxiety levels may be a welcome consequence. It’s really about reducing the way anxious thoughts feed on each other and reinforce themselves - a kind Of letting go which is not negligent but acknowledges that a thought is just that - a thought, Must start doing them again.

[french frank]

The R3 website has a panel: 'Music to help you focus - Discover the best classical music for study, inspiration and relaxation.' You might even focus on the music itself, I suppose, just in order to listen to it.