The colour of 'presenter beige'

[vinteuil]

No, Euda - one doesn't need to be able to make something in order to be able to criticize someone else's making of something. Dr Johnson, as so often, gets it right:

'[Mr Dempster said]: "We have hardly a right to abuse this tragedy; for bad as it is, how vain should either of us be to write one not near so good." JOHNSON "Why no, Sir; this is not just reasoning. You may abuse a tragedy, though you cannot write one. You may scold a carpenter who has made you a bad table, though you cannot make a table. It is not your trade to make tables." ' Boswell Life, Saturday 25 June 1763

[Eudaimonia]

Well, that may be, but I still think everyone who whinges about presenters ought to give it a try, if for no other reason than as a lesson in humility. It's far harder than it seems, and would certainly sharpen your thoughts on what it takes for a host to avoid coming across as "beige"! (Which is a rather weird thing to complain about if you believe presenters should be unobtrusive and get on with the music, but oh well.)

Oh, and if anyone here does want to give it a whack, I'm sure I'll be so in awe of the fact that you actually have the guts to "put up or shut up", I won't have the heart to rubbish it. Come on, V, what do you say? I'll bet your show would be drier than Death Valley in August, but definitely worth tuning in for thanks to its superior educational value.

[MickyD]

Knowing how similar Vinteuil's tastes are to my own, I'd love to hear his show and it wouldn't, I'm sure, be in the least bit dry for me. Incidentally, V, I very much like the Boswell quote!

[amateur51]

Well, that may be, but I still think everyone who whinges about presenters ought to give it a try, if for no other reason than as a lesson in humility. It's far harder than it seems, and would certainly sharpen your thoughts on what it takes for a host to avoid coming across as "beige"! (Which is a rather weird thing to complain about if you believe presenters should be unobtrusive and get on with the music, but oh well.)

Oh, and if anyone here does want to give it a whack, I'm sure I'll be so in awe of the fact that you actually have the guts to "put up or shut up", I won't have the heart to rubbish it. Come on, V, what do you say? I'll bet your show would be drier than Death Valley in August, but definitely worth tuning in for thanks to its superior educational value.

Responding to your challenge Euda, I hold the honour of being the first non-professional to broadcast 'through the night' on BBC Radio One many, many, many, many, many years ago

I'm too modest to say whether or not it was 'a good table', vinteuil

[Nick Armstrong]

No, Euda - one doesn't need to be able to make something in order to be able to criticize someone else's making of something. Dr Johnson, as so often, gets it right:

'[Mr Dempster said]: "We have hardly a right to abuse this tragedy; for bad as it is, how vain should either of us be to write one not near so good." JOHNSON "Why no, Sir; this is not just reasoning. You may abuse a tragedy, though you cannot write one. You may scold a carpenter who has made you a bad table, though you cannot make a table. It is not your trade to make tables." ' Boswell Life, Saturday 25 June 1763

Vints How many times in the past have I needed to bring that quote into an argument, but not been aware of it!! Thank you!

[doversoul1]

Knowing how similar Vinteuil's tastes are to my own, I'd love to hear his show and it wouldn't, I'm sure, be in the least bit dry for me. Incidentally, V, I very much like the Boswell quote!

How about The Specialist Early Music Chart? And the drier, the better.

So do I (re: the quote)

[Stillhomewardbound]

Eudamonia ... thank you for your DIY-Radio invitation but my production days are behind me (1988-2002). These days my creative juices flow via my photographic studio and my journalism.

My proudest radio acheivement, albeit at 35,000ft rather than 4800khz, was an opera magazine show I devised for Swissair with Andrew McGregor. Actually it led to a bit of falling out between me and the airline. I was determined that they should make it their entry for Best Original Programme in the airline industry's Avion awards and though at first they were convinced, at the last moment they had a change of heart and substituted a Swiss folk music programme instead.

Their argument was that a classical music programme had never won in that category. My response to them was that the opera show was a genuine contender with a chance, unlike the Swiss folk show which was never going to get anybody's vote in any category.

Eventually they relented and were delighted with themselves when the opera magazine won!

But back now to the Sunday programme. Ms Klein is rather everywhere at the moment, isn't she? She was fronting Broadcasting House the other week and hosting the arts review on BBC2 at the weekend, so she is very much a flavour of the moment. However, I suspect that her greater appeal is more telegenic than radiophonic, so to speak.

Certainly, this show is very unlike it's previous and rather short lived incarnation with Ian Burnside. Another Radio 3 contributor to have suddenly disappeared without trace.

His was an intriguingly quirky and eclectic rummage through the gramophone library. Perhaps too much so for it's own good
and I suspect that's what has got us to where we are now.

Strange analogy perhaps, but the way it strikes me is that before we had tonic water, now these days we get lemonade.

[kernelbogey]

It's far harder than it seems [...] for a host to avoid coming across as "beige"! (Which is a rather weird thing to complain about if you believe presenters should be unobtrusive and get on with the music

Unobtrusive presenters:

Jonathan Swain - electric blue
John Shea - indigo
Susan Sharp - burnt sienna
Louise Fryer - eggyolk yellow

The first three are the TTN hosts - impeccably obeying that guideline of good radio presentation that you talk to one person. Rob C and Sarah M-P frequently refer to 'some of you', 'you seemed to enjoy' and similar phrases that reduce me to one ingredient in the soup which they apparently perceive as their audience. Similarly, addressing an email/text from Ms Blogs destroys my happy illusion that the presenter is talking to me. Crucially, the four above (merely the first names that came to my mind) focus on the music, the composer and performers without drawing undue attention to themselves.

[barber olly]

Unobtrusive presenters:

Jonathan Swain - electric blue
John Shea - indigo
Susan Sharp - burnt sienna
Louise Fryer - eggyolk yellow

The first three are the TTN hosts - impeccably obeying that guideline of good radio presentation that you talk to one person. Rob C and Sarah M-P frequently refer to 'some of you', 'you seemed to enjoy' and similar phrases that reduce me to one ingredient in the soup which they apparently perceive as their audience. Similarly, addressing an email/text from Ms Blogs destroys my happy illusion that the presenter is talking to me. Crucially, the four above (merely the first names that came to my mind) focus on the music, the composer and performers without drawing undue attention to themselves.

Makes me nostalgic about the days when Radio 3 majored in unobtrusive presenters presenting full works. Now we seem to have personalities presenting CFM2 for large swathes of air-time. Sunday mornings used to include @Music Magazine' presented by Julian Herbage - the radio equivalent of what Gramophone was in print. What was that Mary Hopkin song?

[Martin]

I can't see that there's anything wrong with criticising a presenter, as long as it is done with reasoned argument. Indeed, the presenter is there to serve the listener, not the other way round, so if the listener is displeased with the presenter's manner, they have every right to say so. I don't have to be a doctor to comment intelligently on whether my GP has a manner which I find reassuring.

It's clear that many of the recently appointed presenters have been placed for their chatty manner and TV-like persona, rather for their musical acuity, even if they do have music degrees. So if they don't deliver a suitable presentation, we should speak up.

I like the TTN presenters, and I quite dislike the new Sunday morning and weekday breakfast styles of presentation, enough to make me turn off. I don't harbour any malevolence to the persons themselves, but I don't think they are the right people for the job. That's no different from saying that a certain conductor's capabilities seem to sit better with some repertoire than with others.

Beige seems quite polite to me. I would have chosen something else, far less gaudy!

[Norfolk Born]

What was that Mary Hopkin song?

From memory:
'Those were the days, my friend
We'd thought they'd never end
We'd laugh and sing for ever and a day'

[vinteuil]

THOSE WERE THE DAYS - 25/09/1968

Once upon a time there was a tavern
Where we used to raise a glass or two
Remember how we laughed away the hours
And dreamed of all the great things we would do

Those were the days my friend
We thought they'd never end
We'd sing and dance forever and a day
We'd live the life we choose
We'd fight and never lose
For we were young and sure to have our way

La la la la la la
La la la la la la
La la la la, la la la la la la la

[kernelbogey]

'Oh my friend we’re older but no wiser
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same'!

[Eudaimonia]

Responding to your challenge Euda, I hold the honour of being the first non-professional to broadcast 'through the night' on BBC Radio One many, many, many, many, many years ago

So how did you like your time with Auntie? Did you have people working with you, or did they leave you to wing it? Did you play what you wanted, or was an agenda shoved down your throat? Were you nervous? Any mishaps or memorable moments? Let’s have it! Don't be afraid to spill the beans, now...

Knowing how similar Vinteuil's tastes are to my own, I'd love to hear his show and it wouldn't, I'm sure, be in the least bit dry for me.
How about The Specialist Early Music Chart? And the drier, the better.

Well then, why don’t the three of you put your enormously-oversized egg heads together and collaborate on something? Put the music in a historical context; intersperse great works with literature and poetry from the time...Come on! You know you want to Third-Programme it up a little. Seriously, I’ll bet it would be a lot of fun, and we’d all love to hear it. You’d have a listenership of...er...dozens.

[Eudaimonia]

- impeccably obeying that guideline of good radio presentation that you talk to one person. Rob C and Sarah M-P frequently refer to 'some of you', 'you seemed to enjoy' and similar phrases that reduce me to one ingredient in the soup which they apparently perceive as their audience. Similarly, addressing an email/text from Ms Blogs destroys my happy illusion that the presenter is talking to me.

That's interesting, but is being part of an "audience soup" always such a bad thing? Might it sometimes make sense to create the illusion of a community of listeners? People really seemed to respond to that sappy late-night Mozart requests programme...lots of lonely people out there, and if radio can help fill a need, it might be an approach worth considering. Just a thought.