The Eternal Breakfast Debate in a New Place

[BBMmk2]

That work by Andors illborg, Liquid Marble, was rather good, I thought?

[Pulcinella]

That work by Anders Hillborg, Liquid Marble, was rather good, I thought?

Indeed, but it was on Essential Classics, not Breakfast, BBM!

[ahinton]

And St Ian of Skelly is himself not immune from being just plain darned wrong; during yesterday's Lunchtime concert broadcast he referred to Lachenmann as being "associated with Musique concrete" - which is rather akin to describing the late Tony Warren as a writer of operas.

!!!

But you do wonder, though, don't you (as has been discussed more times than I can recall), who writes the scripts in which these gaffes are allowed to proliferate? There's also the issue of not only risking being "plain darned wrong" but also that of being disproportionate, rather as in the cases of someone describing Mozart as being "associated with" the viola on the grounds of being a gifted player the instrument or Ferneyhough as being "associated with" the English brass band tradition on the grounds of having been raised in such a musical environment in the English Midlands...

[Richard Barrett]

during yesterday's Lunchtime concert broadcast he referred to Lachenmann as being "associated with Musique concrete"

Of course Lachenmann is indeed associated with a concept he called "musique concrète instrumentale", although I dare say the announcement in question was based less on knowledge of Lachenmann's aesthetic (let alone his actual music) and more on a five-second skim over his Wikipedia page having previously not known him from the proverbial hole in the ground.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Of course Lachenmann is indeed associated with a concept he called "musique concrète instrumentale"

Indeed - as Tony Warren was a writer of soap operas; rather a different animal. I don't want to make too much of a fuss, given that a piece by Lachenmann (even if one of his least Lachenmannesque) featured in the afternoon schedules, but to point out that even presenters (rightly) favoured on the Forum - and singled out for contrast with other less-favoured ones - aren't immune from relying on WIKI rather than popping a quick internal e-Mail to (for example) Robert Worby.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

But you do wonder, though, don't you (as has been discussed more times than I can recall), who writes the scripts in which these gaffes are allowed to proliferate?

Yes, I do - and have done ever since Nicholas Kenyon announced proudly to the world that all the announcers he used wrote their own scripts. Skelly is usually an excellent and very engaging presenter - but on this occasion, his standards would have been better maintained if someone else had written that particular introduction.

There's also the issue of not only risking being "plain darned wrong" but also that of being disproportionate, rather as in the cases of someone describing Mozart as being "associated with" the viola on the grounds of being a gifted player the instrument or Ferneyhough as being "associated with" the English brass band tradition on the grounds of having been raised in such a musical environment in the English Midlands...

[french frank]

Oh, yes - but there's a difference in degree between being "wrong" and being "just plain darned wrong". "The Eroica Symphony is by Neethoven" is a "slip" - "The Eroica Symphony is by Debussy" is "just plain darned wrong"!

There are degrees of difference, and I think to say "The Eroica Symphony is by Debussy" is indeed "just plain darned wrong", unless, hidden somewhere in an attic … in which case one would carp with the definite article 'The Eroica Symphony'. In somewhat similar vein, to refer to Stravinsky's Capriccio (though we can't be sure it had an upper case C) is not completely wrong since the 4th movement … um …

Here I concede the point: she referred to the 4th movement of the C/capriccio, when it was the 4th movement of the vc (which happened to be a capriccio). As you were.

However, I did once hear a certain presenter back announce Beethoven's Kreisler violin sonata instead of his Kreutzer sonata. Whereas this might have had the alert listener pouncing on something for being "just plain darned wrong", if one had heard the initial announcement which explained that the violinist (I think Maxim Vengerov?) was playing a Strad which had belonged to Fritz Kreisler, one might well have been generous enough to relegate it to a 'slip' in the excitement of the moment? Perhaps?

[oddoneout]

I suppose this could equally well have gone in the R3 presenter slot, .
Tom Service is for me an 'off-switch' character, but today I not only listened to, but enjoyed, a contribution from him this morning. He was reading a poem by Robert Service, a forbear, as part of the Canada 150 theme. It was a robust bit of writing and TS threw himself into it as if it really meant something to him and managed to avoid swallowing words so I could actually make out what the poet had written.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Sorry, oddy - Tom Service on Breakfast? When was this?

[vinteuil]

Sorry, oddy - Tom Service on Breakfast? When was this?

... he read the Friday pome, which wd've been just before the 8 o'clock news, I think. Yes, I agree with odd1out, a robust bit of writing wch he read well...


.

[BBMmk2]

Post Horn Galop. Goodness! That was a surprise!

[Serial_Apologist]

Post Horn Galop. Goodness! That was a surprise!

Round the Horn would have been an even bigger one!

[cloughie]

Round the Horn would have been an even bigger one!

Beyond our Ken even!

[DaisyDog]

I too was somewhat unbalanced by having Tom Service shouting at me early in the morning. He’s too loud and manic for me, not what I expect at that hour, especially after a week of the ever jolly and softly spoken Ian Skelly, the most acceptable of R3 presenters providing succour over the past week of Breakfast. Now it’s the weekend and we have another bout of music ‘live from Hool’ with Elizabeth Alker, one of the treacle toned northern presenters. The first hour was inexorable with hardly a sniff of classical music to be heard. Brian Eno and some heavy jazz drumming was a bit of a shock. But at least I kept awake. And I’m not sure that the history of the Humber bridge is of great interest to folks from the southern regions.

[Old Grumpy]

I too was somewhat unbalanced by having Tom Service shouting at me early in the morning. He’s too loud and manic for me, not what I expect at that hour, especially after a week of the ever jolly and softly spoken Ian Skelly, the most acceptable of R3 presenters providing succour over the past week of Breakfast. Now it’s the weekend and we have another bout of music ‘live from Hool’ with Elizabeth Alker, one of the treacle toned northern presenters. The first hour was inexorable with hardly a sniff of classical music to be heard. Brian Eno and some heavy jazz drumming was a bit of a shock. But at least I kept awake. And I’m not sure that the history of the Humber bridge is of great interest to folks from the southern regions.

But it is of interest to those in the North - and this is a national radio station!

OG