The Eternal Breakfast Debate in a New Place

[Sir Velo]

The other alternative is: that by not tuning in, as listener numbers fall, Radio 3's critics will all point the finger and claim that there is no longer an audience for classical music, unless one makes the point that it's the presentation and not the content which is the issue here.

[Pabmusic]

... you won't see me back here.

Shame. I rather enjoyed your outburst of vitriol. Wasn't Aristotle's view that it's good to purge such emotions?

The other alternative is: that by not tuning in, as listener numbers fall, Radio 3's critics will all point the finger and claim that there is no longer an audience for classical music, unless one makes the point that it's the presentation and not the content which is the issue here.

Do you see how easy it is to break my will?

[aeolium]

The point is, if one doesn't complain, it will absolutely never get better; and then you give R3 management the perfect opportunity to say "Look, we never get complaints! Our audience loves us!"

Maybe, although I've learnt with R3 (at least with Roger Wright) that the complaints rarely lead to changes except to make things worse, as if the management revel in the fact that what they see as a hidebound bunch of old fuddy-duddies aren't able to move with the times, so their strategy must be working. So the inane chatter, the oft-repeated set of familiar short pieces, the butchering of concerts to make new 'concerts' - all these things increase.

[Edit: Aargh! I'm doing it now!]

[Thropplenoggin]

Maybe, although I've learnt with R3 (at least with Roger Wright) that the complaints rarely lead to changes except to make things worse, as if the management revel in the fact that what they see as a hidebound bunch of old fuddy-duddies aren't able to move with the times, so their strategy must be working. So the inane chatter, the oft-repeated set of familiar short pieces, the butchering of concerts to make new 'concerts' - all these things increase.

[Edit: Aargh! I'm doing it now!]

Surely there's a Disorder for this. Obsessive-Compulsive Antagonism Disorder?

[cloughie]

The other alternative is: that by not tuning in, as listener numbers fall, Radio 3's critics will all point the finger and claim that there is no longer an audience for classical music, unless one makes the point that it's the presentation and not the content which is the issue here.

The content of Breakfast is very much an issue!

[Sir Velo]

The content of Breakfast is very much an issue!

By content I meant the music, although of course the standard Top 100 Tunes playlist, and bleeding chunk approach is a *&@"*! disgrace!

What I was trying, maladroitly to say, is that there is an audience for quality music at this time. Breakfast is in every sense a dog's dinner.

[Flosshilde]

The point is, if one doesn't complain, it will absolutely never get better; and then you give R3 management the perfect opportunity to say "Look, we never get complaints! Our audience loves us!"

But only if the complaints are directed at the right people, & they take notice of them. Unfortunately the BBC is impervious to any complaints (just listen to 'Feedback').

Complaining here does no good at all, & only serves, as noggin suggests, to make the poster feel a little better, for a little time (but, yes, the question has to be why keep listening to a programme that one detests? Perhaps the syndrome already has a name - Masochism)

[french frank]

The other alternative is: that by not tuning in, as listener numbers fall, Radio 3's critics will all point the finger and claim that there is no longer an audience for classical music, unless one makes the point that it's the presentation and not the content which is the issue here.

This is why it's important (in my view!) to keep plugging away at people higher up than Radio 3 management with a clear message. (And not to be put off by the few, but regular, hostile jibes that are made here). The BBC high-ups are strongly inclined to support their own until the message becomes undeniable. Like aeolium, I haven't listened to Breakfast (or Essential Classics) in the normal run of listening. But I listen from time to time - rather like Pabmusic did - just to check on details, so that people don't try their other trick: "If you don't listen, you can't criticise." (If you do listen you increase the reach)

I'm attempting an analysis of the BBC's quarterly 'Performance' statistics (such as they are). The headlines when the new figures are published usually report that the BBC is performing very well - in fact improving. One figure I haven't seen quoted is Radio 3's record on 'Distinctiveness' - a key measurement for a public service broadcaster. Last quarter it was Not Bad, but prior to that it showed the station sinking lower. Over the entire 3-year period for which we have statistics, it comes averagely 7th out of 10 of the the UK-wide station. But the strategy is quite deliberate: short bits of music, presenter-led, chat with listeners and guests, regular news headlines, much like Radio 2; and snippets of undemanding familiar music like Classic FM. Because these are the stations that have 'potential' listeners - those who don't listen to R3 at the moment but who might be persuaded to do so if it's given a 'familiar', less 'daunting' style.

Radio is now rated a 'low involvement', secondary activity; so you aren't likely to find a large percentage of the schedule devoted now to what has been called the 'cultural and intellectual' level. Not in the classical field anyway.

[cloughie]

.Because these are the stations that have 'potential' listeners - those who don't listen to R3 at the moment but who might be persuaded to do so if it's given a 'familiar', less 'daunting' style

...and in doing so is doing a great disservice to older listeners as Radio 2 and Radio 3 either cut or move the bits that appeal to times they do not want to hear them - the 'Beeching' trick!

[french frank]

the 'Beeching' trick!

Looking at the figures again, Radio 3 shows a gradual descent in appreciation too. I think it will be worth forwarding the results somewhere ... Given that the Trust, the Director-General and the Director of Radio have all been told of dissatisfaction - the Trust for a number of years - they will find it more difficult to write off the results. Especially with R3 management about to undergo a change

[aeolium]

What might have an impact would be if radio critics like Gillian Reynolds and music critics/musicologists like Richard Osborne spoke out, but I suppose those in the latter category don't want to put heads above the parapet because they might be denied reviewing work on R3 programmes.

[cloughie]

What might have an impact would be if radio critics like Gillian Reynolds and music critics/musicologists like Richard Osborne spoke out, but I suppose those in the latter category don't want to put heads above the parapet because they might be denied reviewing work on R3 programmes.

Biting the hand that feeds can lead to a job on CFM!

[Radio64]

<sigh>







oh,. don't mind me .... just happy and contented looking at CBH's new twitter profile page....

you chaps just carry on ...




<sigh>

[Richard Tarleton]

Back to calling herself Clemency? (lunchtime today)

[aeolium]

Perhaps we shall be in for the Clemency of Tweet-o...

Coat.