The Eternal Breakfast Debate in a New Place

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  • french frank
    Administrator/Moderator
    • Feb 2007
    • 30235

    Originally posted by cloughie View Post
    For starters BCs did not feature in the 7am to 9am slot or anywhere else in the schedules until the 1990s when it became commonplace on CFM.
    And Essential Classics was the first programme to extend for 3 hours over the entire morning. Look at 1979:
    9.00 News
    9.05 This Week's Composer (M de Falla)
    10 Talking About Music - Antony Hopkins
    10.30 Vaughan Williams and Schumann
    11 Paul Crossley
    11.30 -12 Midday Concert (RLPO Mendelssohn, Symph No 4)

    Compare with now:
    9-12 Essential Classics with SK or GM

    I fail to see the similarity. Also 7-9 contained a complete Moxzart piano concerto and a complete Walton symphony.

    It isn't given us to know those rare moments when people are wide open and the lightest touch can wither or heal. A moment too late and we can never reach them any more in this world.

    Comment

    • Old Grumpy
      Full Member
      • Jan 2011
      • 3596

      Hands, Face, Space...

      ...Good to hear EST's From Gagarin's Point of View on EC* this morning.

      *Yes, yes, I know it's the wrong thread - but everyone else discusses EC on here too...

      Comment

      • cloughie
        Full Member
        • Dec 2011
        • 22114

        Originally posted by french frank View Post
        And Essential Classics was the first programme to extend for 3 hours over the entire morning. Look at 1979:
        9.00 News
        9.05 This Week's Composer (M de Falla)
        10 Talking About Music - Antony Hopkins
        10.30 Vaughan Williams and Schumann
        11 Paul Crossley
        11.30 -12 Midday Concert (RLPO Mendelssohn, Symph No 4)

        Compare with now:
        9-12 Essential Classics with SK or GM

        I fail to see the similarity. Also 7-9 contained a complete Moxzart piano concerto and a complete Walton symphony.

        https://genome.ch.bbc.co.uk/schedules/radio3/1979-04-02
        No doubt the genome would confirm or otherwise but I’m almost certain that the complete Daphnis was played one morning in the 70s starting at 7.05 after the News!

        Comment

        • LMcD
          Full Member
          • Sep 2017
          • 8402

          Originally posted by cloughie View Post
          No doubt the genome would confirm or otherwise but I’m almost certain that the complete Daphnis was played one morning in the 70s starting at 7.05 after the News!
          I'm not sure whether this was the occasion in question - 0905, 21/6/1972: Suites 1 and 2, BSO Munch - Ravel was the Composer Of the Week.

          Comment

          • kernelbogey
            Full Member
            • Nov 2010
            • 5735

            I assume that Martin Handley, and his producer, are under instructions to include items like Be My Little Baby Bumble Bee, sung by Doris Day, as part of today's 'Sounds of the earth feature'.

            It diminshes the programme in my view. And I'm a regular on Sundays (since Saturday Breakfast has deteriorated)!

            It's not offensive - it just doesn't belong in a Radio Three broadcast.

            Comment

            • oddoneout
              Full Member
              • Nov 2015
              • 9141

              Originally posted by kernelbogey View Post
              I assume that Martin Handley, and his producer, are under instructions to include items like Be My Little Baby Bumble Bee, sung by Doris Day, as part of today's 'Sounds of the earth feature'.

              It diminshes the programme in my view. And I'm a regular on Sundays (since Saturday Breakfast has deteriorated)!

              It's not offensive - it just doesn't belong in a Radio Three broadcast.
              If it was random padding with no context I might agree, but as part of the whole Sounds of the Earth(which itself isn't R3 material - it isn't music let alone 'suitable' music) slot, why not? What is so unacceptable about it used that way? Doris Day was a fine singer, admired by many in the "classical" world. The song comes from a musical - but does that automatically make it unsuitable; perhaps so unless it's Bernstein?

              Comment

              • kernelbogey
                Full Member
                • Nov 2010
                • 5735

                Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                If it was random padding with no context I might agree, but as part of the whole Sounds of the Earth(which itself isn't R3 material - it isn't music let alone 'suitable' music) slot, why not? What is so unacceptable about it used that way? Doris Day was a fine singer, admired by many in the "classical" world. The song comes from a musical - but does that automatically make it unsuitable; perhaps so unless it's Bernstein?
                On the basis of rather casual listening this morning, the Doris Day (whose voice I did not recognise) jumped out from the other pieces of music in the feature. Generally speaking, the music items used in this feature refer in some way to the natural sounds being broadcast. I fail to see the logic of your argument that it doesn't matter what music is included in that feature, since it doesn't belong on Radio Three at all....

                Comment

                • LMcD
                  Full Member
                  • Sep 2017
                  • 8402

                  Originally posted by kernelbogey View Post
                  On the basis of rather casual listening this morning, the Doris Day (whose voice I did not recognise) jumped out from the other pieces of music in the feature. Generally speaking, the music items used in this feature refer in some way to the natural sounds being broadcast. I fail to see the logic of your argument that it doesn't matter what music is included in that feature, since it doesn't belong on Radio Three at all....
                  Should one be grateful that one didn't get to hear Arthur Askey's bee song? As for Doris Day - I can't be bothered to calculate precisely what percentage of the day's listening her contribution amounted to but I'm guessing it was not that significant, and I found it so forgettable that - well, I've forgotten it. Unfortunately, I've now got the Arthur Askey buzzing in my head.

                  Comment

                  • french frank
                    Administrator/Moderator
                    • Feb 2007
                    • 30235

                    Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                    as part of the whole Sounds of the Earth(which itself isn't R3 material - it isn't music let alone 'suitable' music) slot, why not? What is so unacceptable about it used that way?
                    Haven't you answered your own question?

                    Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                    Doris Day was a fine singer, admired by many in the "classical" world. The song comes from a musical - but does that automatically make it unsuitable; perhaps so unless it's Bernstein?
                    DD was my brother's favourite singer when he was c. 16. I heard a lot of her records. I don't dispute that she was a 'fine singer' but qualitatively she was not a classical singer and, as far as I know, didn't sing anything from the classical repertoire. So a non-classical singer singing non-classical repertoire: what on earth is wrong with including the item on 'Radio 3's classical breakfast show'?

                    'Qualitatively' here doesn't refer to a degree of excellence but of style. Latin qualis = of what kind? what sort of?; quality = characteristic or attribute.
                    It isn't given us to know those rare moments when people are wide open and the lightest touch can wither or heal. A moment too late and we can never reach them any more in this world.

                    Comment

                    • oddoneout
                      Full Member
                      • Nov 2015
                      • 9141

                      Originally posted by kernelbogey View Post
                      On the basis of rather casual listening this morning, the Doris Day (whose voice I did not recognise) jumped out from the other pieces of music in the feature. Generally speaking, the music items used in this feature refer in some way to the natural sounds being broadcast. I fail to see the logic of your argument that it doesn't matter what music is included in that feature, since it doesn't belong on Radio Three at all....
                      I didn't hear the slot this morning so I don't know how closely the song might be considered to have a connection to the natural sounds recording, but I just think that if the presence of the Sounds of the Earth slot, with its non-music/R3 element, is accepted then I don't see the problem with there being some non R3 fare(however one defines that) in the resulting "mixtape" choices.
                      It's the wider picture that concerns me more with R3, rather than occasional intrusions of "non R3" material.

                      Comment

                      • LMcD
                        Full Member
                        • Sep 2017
                        • 8402

                        Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                        I didn't hear the slot this morning so I don't know how closely the song might be considered to have a connection to the natural sounds recording, but I just think that if the presence of the Sounds of the Earth slot, with its non-music/R3 element, is accepted then I don't see the problem with there being some non R3 fare(however one defines that) in the resulting "mixtape" choices.
                        It's the wider picture that concerns me more with R3, rather than occasional intrusions of "non R3" material.
                        You never know - Doris may have made somebody's day!

                        Comment

                        • Cockney Sparrow
                          Full Member
                          • Jan 2014
                          • 2281

                          For years, when possible, Sunday has been waking up to Radio Four between 7.30 and 8, with the news until 8.10. Then switching over to Radio 3, as the offering of some Parish Church is usually not for us... Should it be Elizabeth Alker then silence whilst we get up and organise breakfast. Possibly a CD in the kitchen until Broadcasting House at 9.10. (In this, I intend no disrespect to EA, but as far as I'm concerned she needs to earn her living in a different time/context/channel).

                          The "sounds of....." slot on Radio 3 at 8.10 (or so) I have come to find trying - purely because I would prefer just music/presenter. Sometimes I put up with it, other times I find the programme on "Sounds" and play the programme from the start on the bedroom sound system (amplifier, dac, contained within the speaker cabinets).

                          For me "Sounds of....." has become pervasive enough on BBC radio generally (I'm listening on R4 to water slapping in Felixstowe harbour as I write). Its my problem about the timing on Sunday morning, just as I have to arrange avoiding EA on Saturdays. If I am listening, the likes of Doris Day wouldn't be the worst of it for a few moments. Like others here I've given up on Monday-Friday mornings and at least on Sunday a large element of trivialisation is absent and personally, otherwise I very much appreciate Martin Handley's style and contribution.

                          Comment

                          • kernelbogey
                            Full Member
                            • Nov 2010
                            • 5735

                            Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                            I don't know how closely the song might be considered to have a connection to the natural sounds recording
                            There were bee sounds in between the musical items (or vice versa)
                            Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                            ...if the presence of the Sounds of the Earth slot, with its non-music/R3 element, is accepted
                            I can tolerate it in a two hour programme if the music interleaved is classical, or close to it.
                            Originally posted by oddoneout View Post
                            It's the wider picture that concerns me more with R3
                            Yes me too.

                            Comment

                            • LMcD
                              Full Member
                              • Sep 2017
                              • 8402

                              Originally posted by Cockney Sparrow View Post
                              For years, when possible, Sunday has been waking up to Radio Four between 7.30 and 8, with the news until 8.10. Then switching over to Radio 3, as the offering of some Parish Church is usually not for us... Should it be Elizabeth Alker then silence whilst we get up and organise breakfast. Possibly a CD in the kitchen until Broadcasting House at 9.10. (In this, I intend no disrespect to EA, but as far as I'm concerned she needs to earn her living in a different time/context/channel).

                              The "sounds of....." slot on Radio 3 at 8.10 (or so) I have come to find trying - purely because I would prefer just music/presenter. Sometimes I put up with it, other times I find the programme on "Sounds" and play the programme from the start on the bedroom sound system (amplifier, dac, contained within the speaker cabinets).

                              For me "Sounds of....." has become pervasive enough on BBC radio generally (I'm listening on R4 to water slapping in Felixstowe harbour as I write). Its my problem about the timing on Sunday morning, just as I have to arrange avoiding EA on Saturdays. If I am listening, the likes of Doris Day wouldn't be the worst of it for a few moments. Like others here I've given up on Monday-Friday mornings and at least on Sunday a large element of trivialisation is absent and personally, otherwise I very much appreciate Martin Handley's style and contribution.
                              I can pop down the road any time to hear the water slapping in Felixstowe harbour, but I much prefer the sound of the interplay between sea and shingle - so brilliantly portrayed in Britten's Sea Pictures - at the other end of town. The tinkling sound caused by the wind blowing through yacht rigging down at the Ferry is also most pleasant. I hope that the use of 'harbour' doesn't give the wrong impression of Britain's still-expanding biggest container port!

                              Comment

                              • antongould
                                Full Member
                                • Nov 2010
                                • 8778

                                Originally posted by Cockney Sparrow View Post
                                For years, when possible, Sunday has been waking up to Radio Four between 7.30 and 8, with the news until 8.10. Then switching over to Radio 3, as the offering of some Parish Church is usually not for us... Should it be Elizabeth Alker then silence whilst we get up and organise breakfast. Possibly a CD in the kitchen until Broadcasting House at 9.10. (In this, I intend no disrespect to EA, but as far as I'm concerned she needs to earn her living in a different time/context/channel).

                                The "sounds of....." slot on Radio 3 at 8.10 (or so) I have come to find trying - purely because I would prefer just music/presenter. Sometimes I put up with it, other times I find the programme on "Sounds" and play the programme from the start on the bedroom sound system (amplifier, dac, contained within the speaker cabinets).

                                For me "Sounds of....." has become pervasive enough on BBC radio generally (I'm listening on R4 to water slapping in Felixstowe harbour as I write). Its my problem about the timing on Sunday morning, just as I have to arrange avoiding EA on Saturdays. If I am listening, the likes of Doris Day wouldn't be the worst of it for a few moments. Like others here I've given up on Monday-Friday mornings and at least on Sunday a large element of trivialisation is absent and personally, otherwise I very much appreciate Martin Handley's style and contribution.
                                CS unless I missed his application form EA is not a member of the Alkers Fan Club ... probably quite a few million miles away ...... if by some chance you were referring to me then feel free to be as disrespectful as you like .....

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