The Eternal Breakfast Debate in a New Place

[french frank]

(To be honest I cannot listen to radio news at all - all I hear are duff edits.)

I've just read an article by a New York Times copy editor about the mistakes that haunt them, especially the ones that they realise long after it's too late to amend them - I can confirm a sort of photographic memory of those mistakes which surge into your mind hours later. I was walking home from work at about 12.30am, almost home after a 35-minute walk. I'd spent ages on a new computer trying to work out how to put accents over letters and spent far too long over a restaurant review. Suddenly the image "crême brûlée" flashed into my mind. Having spent ages trying to discover how to type a circumflex … and having taught French for years …

So I have some sympathy. It's been said that the sad lot of the sub-editor is that if you miss someone else's mistake, you're pilloried, if you correct a mistake, no one ever knows you've done it.

[muzzer]

IIRC in my early days as a frequent listener SMP used to read the news - very well IMVVHO - as well as presenting Breakfast ..... but I don’t think Rob C did on his shifts .......

Seconded re SMP.

[oddoneout]

Radio Three bulletins used to be what is called straight reads i.e 2 to 3 minutes worth of news headlines read by one announcer usually drawn from a small pool of announcers who work largely for Radio 3 and Radio 4 . Because of COVID and the need to cut to the bare minimum the number of people travelling into central London and working in offices I guess the decision was made to pool all the radio network bulletins and create a sustaining service . I am just guessing that the Radio 2 news service was made the sustaining service - I don’t have any inside knowledge . Back in prehistory I worked in Radio News and I am pretty sure There are still separate writing styles for each of the four main networks , different stories are selected and different production techniques employed e.g the use of clips in Radio 2 bulletins. Whether this creates a more ‘aggressive’ feel is in the ear of the listener. Another difference will be that those audio clips will be compressed- creating arguably an “in your face “ feel. The writing style will also be more urgent and punchy than that of traditional Radio 3 bulletins.
I could be completely wrong but I have listened to thousands of hours of both R2 and R3 bulls over the years...

It does make sense but it didn't happen until very recently that R3 had the R2 version, so what has changed in the meantime? I don't know about the things you mention resulting in a more 'aggressive' feel, but what it does feel like to me is when people raise their voices to attract the attention of, or talk over, other people who aren't listening. As a R3 listener, who does listen rather than just let the sound slosh around as a backdrop, it is unpleasantly intrusive - and the content doesn't help.

[Ein Heldenleben]

It does make sense but it didn't happen until very recently that R3 had the R2 version, so what has changed in the meantime? I don't know about the things you mention resulting in a more 'aggressive' feel, but what it does feel like to me is when people raise their voices to attract the attention of, or talk over, other people who aren't listening. As a R3 listener, who does listen rather than just let the sound slosh around as a backdrop, it is unpleasantly intrusive - and the content doesn't help.

I think the pooled bulletins started in the March 2020 lockdown.

[oddoneout]

I think the pooled bulletins started in the March 2020 lockdown.

Must confess I can't remember clearly that far back but I'm pretty certain they weren't what we are getting now - that I would have remembered - and they did go back to the R3 standard version at some point during the year.

[Old Grumpy]

...they did go back to the R3 standard version at some point during the year.

When the first lockdown was eased and staff could return to BH?

[antongould]

I was amused by her protestation that she’s not into panto, given that a good number of the people pictured in that round are well-known outside that realm. She was lucky that Johnnie Walker came up with a completely off the wall 100 answer!

Still, fair play to her I say.
And for all the stick she gets here for her Breakfast role (not the happiest of fits, I agree), I think she deserves credit for the range of talent she showcases on Unclassified. There, I’ve said it.

Lady Gould has now allowed me to watch and I never doubted Alkers for a moment ..... a class (and tall) act indeed ......

[oddoneout]

When the first lockdown was eased and staff could return to BH?

Possibly although if the morning programmes can be presented from home why not the news updates?

[Ein Heldenleben]

Possibly although if the morning programmes can be presented from home why not the news updates?

It’s because newsreaders are an integral part of the news team and have to work very closely with them in the production of a bulletin.It’s more last minute than general radio presentation and the stakes are much higher if an error is made.

[underthecountertenor]

Must confess I can't remember clearly that far back but I'm pretty certain they weren't what we are getting now - that I would have remembered - and they did go back to the R3 standard version at some point during the year.

Whereas I distinctly remember that they were pretty much exactly what they are now (only the news is different - worse). They did indeed revert when lockdown was relaxed, as I think I’ve already mentioned.

[Leinster Lass]

I took the precaution of hiding behind the sofa while listening to the 0800 bulletin - to my admittedly untrained ears, it didn't sound particularly aggressive - but I'm probably further away from Broadcasting House than many of you, and the Irish Sea may have a mellowing effect.

[french frank]

I had a vague memory that stations sharing news bulletins was first mooted some years BCd-19 as a cost-cutting exercise, maybe c. 2015. Not sure that it actually happened and I'd need to go through dusty boxes in the cellar (now marked TO BE SHREDDED) to find the reference. Can't see it reported anywhere more accessible e.g. t'internet.

[Old Grumpy]

I took the precaution of hiding behind the sofa while listening to the 0800 bulletin - to my admittedly untrained ears, it didn't sound particularly aggressive - but I'm probably further away from Broadcasting House than many of you, and the Irish Sea may have a mellowing effect.

[hmvman]

I took the precaution of hiding behind the sofa while listening to the 0800 bulletin - to my admittedly untrained ears, it didn't sound particularly aggressive - but I'm probably further away from Broadcasting House than many of you, and the Irish Sea may have a mellowing effect.

I'm deaf in one ear at the moment due to wax and that helps too at news bulletin time...

[Cockney Sparrow]

I had a vague memory that stations sharing news bulletins was first mooted some years BCd-19 as a cost-cutting exercise, maybe c. 2015. Not sure that it actually happened and I'd need to go through dusty boxes in the cellar (now marked TO BE SHREDDED) to find the reference. Can't see it reported anywhere more accessible e.g. t'internet.

Private Eye has run regular stories about the integration of news gathering and output in the BBC to achieve the required cost savings. I now hear the same material in the daytime on radio and then see the interview in TV news - not for all subjects though. Its a plan masterminded by Kamal Ahmed Editorial Director of BBC News. My impression (reinforced by WIA) is that BBC News is a fiercely independent fiefdom within the BBC but Davey didn't put a stop to the "go button" which I think was a date in recent months (I'm behind with my Eye reading, apart from the health contributions by MD).

Insiders feel it will be a disaster, but who knows how it will pan out. A wave of departures - some enticed to Times Radio (never listened) as it was no secret what was coming. Today programme R4 lost its dedicated reporters so cannot generate its own stories - Sarah Sands editor decided it was time to "move on" - not that her successor has changed the style to allow interviewees time to give decent replies. Newsnight (BBC2 TV) seems to be hanging on to some reporter resources. Mark Mardell gave an interview on his retirement saying he was relieved to be going, given what was happening.

So generic news and random newscasters could prove to be the future, or it might be temporary because of the restrictions from the Pandemic. I'm glad they are still crediting the studio managers and staff who are turning out and running risks to work in BBC Facilities.