ROH: Ring 2018

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

No, he isn't; people forget about his self-serving character because of the 'nobility' of the music Wagner gives him.

Hans Hotter portrayed a very 'noble' Wotan but couldn't quite get to grips with the character's nasty side - or so I've always felt.

The finest Wotan on record that I know of is George London on the Leinsdorf Walkure - whereas Hotter sounds scared of Brunhilde (and who can blame him?!) London terrifies her, and she sounds terrified.

(For another Thread, perhaps: great Ring Cycles that were never made. )

[underthecountertenor]

Back on thread last night's Siegfried was magnificent . Vinke indefatigable in the title role - an absolutely thrilling sword -forging scene - real ringing tones. And still giving his all by the End of the Act 3 duet. Not a weak link in the cast - one of the great nights at Covent Garden.

Very encouraging to hear this. I hope they’re all still firing on all cylinders by the second half of October when I’m seeing cycle 3.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Slightly worried that Vinke only has a day off before Gotterdamerung on Monday...that strikes me as very testing....

[underthecountertenor]

Slightly worried that Vinke only has a day off before Gotterdamerung on Monday...that strikes me as very testing....

The spread is kinder to him for cycle 3, I think: two days off. Hopefully he has the technique and stamina to see him through tomorrow.

[ostuni]

Thanks, fhg, for a reminder of the Leinsdorf recording: I absolutely agree! I shall dig it out and have a listen, before going to the cinema relay of the ROH Walküre next month.

[Conchis]

In fact grading last night on the moral ambiguity noble to nasty axis ( and with some sharply characterised performances ) I would go Fafner - Alberich - Wotan - Mime. Mind you the unwarranted spearing of Erda by Wotan in Act 3 unfairly weighed the scales ....

Erm....how's he going to beget nine children of her when he's just run through a rather vital part of her anatomy?

[Darkbloom]

I wonder if anyone heard (years ago now) a programme on R3 where David Mellor and John Tomlinson discussed the great Wotans on record. Mellor's contribution aside, it was very interesting to hear JT weigh up (respectfully but not uncritically) their various merits. He felt that George London had a great voice (unquestionably, of course) but he didn't really get inside the character.

[Conchis]

I wonder if anyone heard (years ago now) a programme on R3 where David Mellor and John Tomlinson discussed the great Wotans on record. Mellor's contribution aside, it was very interesting to hear JT weigh up (respectfully but not uncritically) their various merits. He felt that George London had a great voice (unquestionably, of course) but he didn't really get inside the character.

Must have missed that. Would love to have heard it.

[Darkbloom]

I first heard him sing Wotan at the famous 2005 Prom. At the time, I remember thinking it was a 'Wotan as Crooner' kind of performance; then at the second interval I got talking to a fellow Prommer, who had been a long-time member of the Covent Garden Chorus (and was also Welsh!). Her view was that Terfel was hopelessly over-parted and she laughed at the idea that he was 'better than Hans Hotter' (whom she'd shared a stage with many times, though obviously not in the Ring).

In the documentary I alluded to earlier, I also sensed that he was being 'motioned' toward Wagner without any great willingness on his own part. To go from singing Figaro, Leporello, etc to the Wagnerian heavies is a bit like a week-end climber suddenly attempting an ascent of K2. This makes me wonder: does he actually still sing Wagner? His recent schedule has been full of 'party roles' in Puccini and Sondheim.

In a recent Guardian Q and A he said he's not taking on any new Wagner roles, so no Amfortas or Kurwenal. Whether that's through arrogance (not being the 'star' part) I can't say.

I think he acquired a lot of bad vocal habits in his youth, but his rapid rise to fame meant he wasn't able to iron them out. He was extraordinary in his twenties but he was blowing through his vocal capital, rather than living on the interest, which has left him sounding rather depleted now.

I recall John Tom saying a Wagner singer needs a resilient core to their voice. Terfel doesn't have that, it's much less focused than it ought to be. And the alarming way he approaches anything above the stave (stretching his neck so you can see the tendons bulging) is frankly alarming and looks painful.

I can't recall a singer who elicits such defensive reactions from some people. Hotter, D F-D, Callas, Vickers, Sutherland, Christoff - the list is endless, they have all been criticised at some point. Maybe it's just that Terfel seems such a decent fellow and people want too much for him to succeed. Whatever the reason, it's a curious phenomenon.

[Richard Tarleton]

I wonder if anyone heard (years ago now) a programme on R3 where David Mellor and John Tomlinson discussed the great Wotans on record. Mellor's contribution aside, it was very interesting to hear JT weigh up (respectfully but not uncritically) their various merits. He felt that George London had a great voice (unquestionably, of course) but he didn't really get inside the character.

Didn't hear that - but interesting interview on the "extras" with the DVD of the Barenboim Ring, in which Tomlinson says how when Barenboim first approached him he said no, you want a bass baritone like James Morris, I'm more of a Hagen (as he ended up being, in the first revival of the Warner.).... Barenboim had to persuade him.

Didn't Hans Hotter's widow present Terfel with Hans's scores? It may have been in that Alan Botney interview with Terfel. She may have wanted them back, in 2007....

[Darkbloom]

Didn't hear that - but interesting interview on the "extras" with the DVD of the Barenboim Ring, in which Tomlinson says how when Barenboim first approached him he said no, you want a bass baritone like James Morris, I'm more of a Hagen (as he ended up being, in the first revival of the Warner.).... Barenboim had to persuade him.

Didn't Hans Hotter's widow present Terfel with Hans's scores? It may have been in that Alan Botney interview with Terfel. She may have wanted them back, in 2007....

I would guess that Barenboim was heavily influenced by the Furtwangler recordings and wanted a high bass like Ferdinand Frantz. Morris was the go-to Wotan for a number of years but he doesn't often get mentioned these days. He was technically very accomplished but didn't live the role in the way Tomlinson did.

[Conchis]

Didn't hear that - but interesting interview on the "extras" with the DVD of the Barenboim Ring, in which Tomlinson says how when Barenboim first approached him he said no, you want a bass baritone like James Morris, I'm more of a Hagen (as he ended up being, in the first revival of the Warner.).... Barenboim had to persuade him.

Didn't Hans Hotter's widow present Terfel with Hans's scores? It may have been in that Alan Botney interview with Terfel. She may have wanted them back, in 2007....

Apparently, she did. The 2007 incident is strange and has never been satisfactorily explained. Maybe it's a case of truth being stranger than fiction? I can imagine the former Mrs. Terfel being a forceful woman, laying down the law to her husband and telling him where his real loyalties lay regardless of what contracts he might have signed. If he was any kind of decent actor, he'd have incorporated his feelings into the Wotan-Fricka confrontation in Walkure Act 2! :)

[Conchis]

I would guess that Barenboim was heavily influenced by the Furtwangler recordings and wanted a high bass like Ferdinand Frantz. Morris was the go-to Wotan for a number of years but he doesn't often get mentioned these days. He was technically very accomplished but didn't live the role in the way Tomlinson did.

Morris was the second Wotan I saw (on television, after Robert Hale in the rather dodgy Muncih production that was shown on BBC2 in the autumn of 1990). I was impressed by Morris' underplaying of the role but then the Met's Otto Schenk production was much more to my taste as a Wagner newbie.

Morris has never been well-received in Britain, for some reason.

[Conchis]

In a recent Guardian Q and A he said he's not taking on any new Wagner roles, so no Amfortas or Kurwenal. Whether that's through arrogance (not being the 'star' part) I can't say.

I think he acquired a lot of bad vocal habits in his youth, but his rapid rise to fame meant he wasn't able to iron them out. He was extraordinary in his twenties but he was blowing through his vocal capital, rather than living on the interest, which has left him sounding rather depleted now.

I recall John Tom saying a Wagner singer needs a resilient core to their voice. Terfel doesn't have that, it's much less focused than it ought to be. And the alarming way he approaches anything above the stave (stretching his neck so you can see the tendons bulging) is frankly alarming and looks painful.

I can't recall a singer who elicits such defensive reactions from some people. Hotter, D F-D, Callas, Vickers, Sutherland, Christoff - the list is endless, they have all been criticised at some point. Maybe it's just that Terfel seems such a decent fellow and people want too much for him to succeed. Whatever the reason, it's a curious phenomenon.

I think he'd be more suited to Kurwenal and (especially) Konig Marke than some of the roles that he HAS sung.

A complete recording of Meistersinger was mooted at one point for DG, but that'll never happen now.

[Darkbloom]

Apparently, she did. The 2007 incident is strange and has never been satisfactorily explained. Maybe it's a case of truth being stranger than fiction? I can imagine the former Mrs. Terfel being a forceful woman, laying down the law to her husband and telling him where his real loyalties lay regardless of what contracts he might have signed. If he was any kind of decent actor, he'd have incorporated his feelings into the Wotan-Fricka confrontation in Walkure Act 2! :)

I'm surprised he wasn't sued for breach of contract over that, but I suppose they preferred to play the long game and have him back at a future date. The excuse he came up with was so feeble, though, (an operation on his son's finger) that it seemed a calculated insult. It was probably a combination of marital woes and struggles with the role..