Strauss, Haydn and Beethoven

[Hornspieler]

Furthermore, it occurs to me, and perhaps HS has said something on the lines before, that in these orchestras full of young players, essentially training orchestras, in which there are a lot of youngsters desperate to be noticed, it's difficult to subjugate oneself to the whole when that whole is unstable and subject to personnel churn and when the conductor, as in this case, is engrossed in the moment. "Look at Me" rules to the detriment of long term musical values and coherence,

In this particular case, we are not discussing a youth orchestra, but a fully professional group of players who are scattered far and wide and may, at one time, have been members of that European Youth orchestra.

And herein lies the potential problem. They are gathered together, like an old school reunion but their styles of playing, choice of pitch and many other considerations are now under the influence of different conductors and in some cases, the size and repertoire of their current employment.

They are not part of an established team, as they would be in their own orchestras and this is almost bound to lead to certain discrepancies; as has been noticeable to various extents by those two Edinburgh Festival performances.

But they are no longer young and inexperienced players and are therefore more likely to hold their own opinions as to how a piece should be played.

A bigger task in some ways for a conductor to achieve unanimity of ensemble.

Hornspieler

[amateur51]

In this particular case, we are not discussing a youth orchestra, but a fully professional group of players who are scattered far and wide and may, at one time, have been members of that European Youth orchestra.

And herein lies the potential problem. They are gathered together, like an old school reunion but their styles of playing, choice of pitch and many other considerations are now under the influence of different conductors and in some cases, the size and repertoire of their current employment.

They are not a team, as they would be in their own orchestras and this is almost bound to lead to certain discrepancies; as has been noticeable to various extents by those two Edinburgh Festival performances.

But they are no longer young and inexperienced players and are therefore more likely to hold their own opinions as to how a piece should be played.

A bigger task in some ways for a conductor to achieve unanimity of ensemble.

Hornspieler

A very interesting comment from within (as it were), HS

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

The best music comes from a heart under orders from the brain.

... and the better the brain, the better the Music.

[amateur51]

... and the better the brain, the better the Music.

Isn't there the brain of the listener to take into account too?

That's not a flip as I fear it may sound. For example, some posters are very exercised by the concept of pitch variation in performance. Clearly my brain doesn't detect those differences as markedly - I'm not saying they're not there, I'm saying my brain doesn't register them and so it isn't an issue for me.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Isn't there the brain of the listener to take into account too?

Absolutely - shtav's comment works there, too, I think.

[edashtav]

This is very odd, have you been using invisible ink, edashtav?
There is a gap at the start of your last sentence where the words 'look at me' are only visible when highlighted as if preparing to copy. This happens on all 3 browsers, IE, Chrome and Mozilla.

Thanks for pointing that out - how I achieved that magic remains a mystery!

Solved by brute force of retyping.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

That's not a flip as I fear it may sound. For example, some posters are very exercised by the concept of pitch variation in performance. Clearly my brain doesn't detect those differences as markedly - I'm not saying they're not there, I'm saying my brain doesn't register them and so it isn't an issue for me.

Ah! This isn't quite what I had in mind when I responded to edashtav's comment - you introduce more a literal, neurological matter (as opposed to the interpretive, structuralizing aspects in and between composer, performer and listener) which is beyond my competency to make any legitimate comment on. (People with cardiomyopathy weren't included in my agreement with ed's comment, either )

[edashtav]

In this particular case, we are not discussing a youth orchestra, but a fully professional group of players who are scattered far and wide and may, at one time, have been members of that European Youth orchestra.

And herein lies the potential problem. They are gathered together, like an old school reunion but their styles of playing, choice of pitch and many other considerations are now under the influence of different conductors and in some cases, the size and repertoire of their current employment.

They are not a team, as they would be in their own orchestras and this is almost bound to lead to certain discrepancies; as has been noticeable to various extents by those two Edinburgh Festival performances.

But they are no longer young and inexperienced players and are therefore more likely to hold their own opinions as to how a piece should be played.

A bigger task in some ways for a conductor to achieve unanimity of ensemble.

Hornspieler

I stand corrected,HS, over the status and age of this orchestra's players. My worries about "ensemble" in ad hoc ensembles remain valid, I feel.