Mahler's 6th Symphony at the Barbican on Wednesday night.

[Guest]

What did any of you Mahler enthusiasts who listened to Mahler’s 6th on Wednesday night think of the performance?

This is my favourite Mahler symphony and I was so much looking forward to meeting ‘an old friend’ again. I remember the very good Volkov performance shortly after he joined the BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra.

I must say I was a tad disappointed. I felt that Jiri Belohavek made the first 3 movements sound a bit like a Dvorak symphony, losing some of the depth of the music at the expense of tempo.

However, Salymap, I did very much enjoy the Mozart K451 Piano concerto performance, one of the rarer performed Mozart piano concertos.

[salymap]

Apologies DT for not commenting on the Mahler 6. I suffer from tinnitus and by the evening the music is lost in a sea of noises, and I haven't caught up with iplayer yet.
I agree it seems hard to get back to concert reviews. Perhaps a special thread for it would help.

[Alf-Prufrock]

I would not call myself a great Mahlerian, as no doubt will appear from what I write here. Am I right in thinking Belohlavek's performance was faster than usual? I thought it thrilling, and so much more engrossing than the dreary drudges I have heard elsewhere. For the first time, I thought Mahler 6 pretty good.

[3rd Viennese School]

I like this symphony. However, it’s the first time ever I’ve heard the Slow mvt as mvt 2 and the scherzo as mvt 3 and it doesn’t work. You miss the relentless pounding as the scherzo opens after the triumph of mvt 1 You miss the A major end of mvt 1/ A minor start of mvt 2 , which is one of the motifs of this symphony. You miss the only relaxation, in E flat major, right before the 30 mins show down finale.. One can only imagine how many beers Mahler must had have to come up with the decision to reverse the middle 2 mvts around to whatt they played last night.

The scherzo was far too fast and missed the biting relentlessness. And in the finale the ending A minor chord was too quick. It’s supposed to fade away slower, IMO.

Other than that it was good! It’s still Mahler 6, after all. My fave one. The finale was probably the best mvt last night, except for that bit I pointed out.

Mahler must had been thinking about oiling his engine immediately after he composed this and when on ,without any break whatsoever, and composed the famous Castrol GTX advert which went on to become symphony no.7.

3VS


“We are all but cows looking over a gate for an hour and twenty five minutes”

[Tapiola]

... the Slow mvt as mvt 2 and the scherzo as mvt 3 and it doesn’t work. You miss the relentless pounding as the scherzo opens after the triumph of mvt 1 You miss the A major end of mvt 1/ A minor start of mvt 2 , which is one of the motifs of this symphony. You miss the only relaxation, in E flat major, right before the 30 mins show down finale.. One can only imagine how many beers Mahler must had have to come up with the decision to reverse the middle 2 mvts around to whatt they played last night.

I would tend to agree with this!

:cool2:

[HighlandDougie]

I was at the Barbican last night so find these comments very interesting indeed. I sat through the first movement wondering which of the two movements was going to come first. Like 3rd VS, I was a bit disconcerted by the order but recognise that the issue of their order is one which arouses much controversy (the much-derided Gramophone . For me, it works better the other way round. It seemed like a fastish performance but I'm pretty sure it went over 80 minutes. I wonder if some of the choices of tempi come from Belohlavek working with the acoustics of the Barbican rather than, in my view, ignoring them at their peril. Anyway, somewhat to my surprise ("Oh, Belohlavek - fine in Martinu or Dvorak but Mahler? Where's Claudio"?), it was a very fine performance - no-nonsense Mahler, well-played and, certainly, in the flesh delivered that visceral punch at the end. Great, also, to see a lot of young people in the audience, clearly moved by the music.

[Flosshilde]

I would not call myself a great Mahlerian, as no doubt will appear from what I write here. Am I right in thinking Belohlavek's performance was faster than usual? I thought it thrilling, and so much more engrossing than the dreary drudges I have heard elsewhere. For the first time, I thought Mahler 6 pretty good.

I only heard part, but thought it was exciting. Probably won't get to hear the whole thing, ubfrotunbately.

[Petrushka]

I heard this on the R3 HD relay. To generalise somewhat I thought that the performance got better as it went on. The opening trudge seemed a notch too slow for me (but it was only a notch) and the odd glitch aside was otherwise fine without exactly setting the world on fire. I have no problem with the order of the two middle movements - either work well. From the scherzo (placed third) onwards the performance gradually seemed to take wing and the finale was excellent with a fire that would have been welcome in the first movement.

I still have mixed feelings about JB and the BBCSO and sense again that the orchestra are not fully happy.

[Daring Tripod]

I understood from the talk by Catherine Bott before the Symphony that the order of the movements was as oringinally specified by Mahler when he wrote the Symphony. This order sounds so much more sensible to me.

I have since played some of the versions which I have and stick to my (amateur, agreed) opinion! The performance lacked 'depth'

[EnemyoftheStoat]

I'd have to wonder which Dvorak symphonies this sounded like - and I grew up on the Kertesz complete set. In any case, given that Mahler's birthplace is closer to Prague than to Vienna, a Czech viewpoint is arguably as valid, if not more so, than most of the jetsetters' who turn it into a concerto for orchestra nowadays.

On tempo, slightly faster than most in the middle movements, but the first movement tempo seemed ideal to me. On the order of movements, the list in the programme was a bit of a giveaway. I'm not convinced either way, but this is one of those pieces where it's not good enough to turn up and then gripe because you're not getting the edition you prefer. On the youngsters there for the Mahler, shame they couldn't get there for the Mozart (I had an empty row in front of me which became full of studenty types after the interval).

As for the BBCSO/JB rapport, suffice to say that the band's playing is streets ahead of where Slatkin left it.

[3rd Viennese School]

Mahler first wrote it as first mvt, scherzo, slow mvt., finale. He switched the middle mvts around after it's first performance. (And forgot to switch it back as it clearly didn’t work!)
He also removed the third hammer blow.

He then went out in his rowing boat and horn tune came into his head but that’s another story.
3VS

[Flosshilde]

On the youngsters there for the Mahler, shame they couldn't get there for the Mozart (I had an empty row in front of me which became full of studenty types after the interval).

Very sensible of them - I would have done the same. I don't think that anything other than the Mahler is needed, & Mozrt is probably the least appropriate accompaniament. If people are worried about not getting enough concert for their money, they should reflect that a Mahler symphony gives them far more players than a Mozart or Beethovcen symphony / concerto / + another piece would give them.

[Roehre]

Mahler first wrote it as first mvt, scherzo, slow mvt., finale. He switched the middle mvts around after it's first performance. (And forgot to switch it back as it clearly didn’t work!)
He also removed the third hammer blow.
3VS

Not quite 3VS: there is a large sketch/continuity draft of IIRC some 160 bars for a second scherzo, implying that Mahler originally intended to make 6 a 5 mvt symphony as well. Alban Berg discovered this as he assessed the sketches for 10 (asked to do so by Alma), and therefore this sketch has become a double autograph: it contains Mahler's as well as Berg's handwriting (in ink). Located in the collection of the Bayrische Staatsbibliothek in Munich (Moldenhauer Archiv Mus.ms 22741).

[gradus]

Having listened again to this performance I think it is remarkably fine and could more than hold its own issued as a cd. The BBC engineering is splendid and the playing is equally fine. This conductor clearly understands Mahler and has a great sense of the music's architecture and proportion. The performance is stirring and lacks nothing in passion and fire. To me and I hope others this is a great performance. Bravo to all concerned.

[Curalach]

Having listened again to this performance I think it is remarkably fine and could more than hold its own issued as a cd. The BBC engineering is splendid and the playing is equally fine. This conductor clearly understands Mahler and has a great sense of the music's architecture and proportion. The performance is stirring and lacks nothing in passion and fire. To me and I hope others this is a great performance. Bravo to all concerned.

I agree entirely. I was unable to listen on Wednesday but have caught up on i-Player. JB has the measure of the work without resorting to over-interpretation. I heard him conduct the 6th with the RSNO at the Edinburgh Festival shortly before he took up his BBC post. I was impressed then and I remain so today.