Originally posted by amateur51
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Elgar: the 2nd Symphony
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Northender
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Originally posted by Hornspieler View PostI can't help feeling that Elgar Nº 2 was written for commercial (bread and butter) reasons, whereas Symphony Nº 1 is an expression of Elgar himself, (I feel the same about Walton's two symphonies, but there, it is more evident) but I still enjoy Nº 2 for its craftsmanship and its exuberance.
As far as Elgar's "3rd symphony" is concerned, he didn't write one - and I'm content to leave it at that.
HS
As for the 3rd Symphony, he didn't finish it. Or, rather, he didn't write it all down - he played the whole thing to Billy Reed and Fred Gaisberg, apparently. Anthony Payne's version is most definitely not the symphony - Payne was clear about that. It's called "Edward Elgar: the sketches for Symphony No 3 elaborated by Anthony Payne" (I have a score before me as I write). Of course, no-one calls it that, though, more's the pity.
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Roehre
Originally posted by Pabmusic View Post....As for the 3rd Symphony, he didn't finish it. Or, rather, he didn't write it all down - he played the whole thing to Billy Reed and Fred Gaisberg, apparently. Anthony Payne's version is most definitely not the symphony - Payne was clear about that. It's called "Edward Elgar: the sketches for Symphony No 3 elaborated by Anthony Payne" (I have a score before me as I write). Of course, no-one calls it that, though, more's the pity.
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Originally posted by amateur51 View PostI know this is a personal idiosyncrasy but while they are both undoubtedly English I always regard Elgar & RVW as being influenced by Wales too
Walton does not strike me like that - he Anglo-Italian
What a loss to musicology I am
Not sure I agree about Wales, Ams - I'm probably missing the point here - but, knowing Walton's penchant for hob-nobbing with the 'arry stockracy, had he settled in Italy instead of hanging out with the Sitwells in the '20s I could well see him enjoying the company of Respighi, Malipiero and Casella, and them all together toasting Mussolini down the local trattoria. He could easily have composed a pastiche "Crown Imperial alla Feste Romana" to top Respy's.
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Originally posted by Roehre View PostPabmusic, you know this, or this CD "A companion CD (number NMC D052) contains a recording of Elgar's complete sketches, performed by David Owen Norris on piano, Robert Gibbs playing W H Reed's own violin, and Andrew Davis conducting the BBC Symphony Orchestra, with Anthony Payne providing a detailed commentary on the reconstruction process" ? Revelatory I must say.
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Roehre
Originally posted by Pabmusic View PostI've got the 'companion CD' and it's fascinating. There's a booklet by Payne as well, which goes into even greater detail:
http://www.faber.co.uk/work/elgars-t...9780571195381/
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Originally posted by Flay View PostOi!!! What's wrong with RVW 2?
I also should have added RVW #7, which I think is a vastly under-appreciated and misrepresented masterpiece! (But I still prefer Elgar #2).[FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]
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Originally posted by Hornspieler View PostI can't help feeling that Elgar Nº 2 was written for commercial (bread and butter) reasons, whereas Symphony Nº 1 is an expression of Elgar himself, but I still enjoy Nº 2 for its craftsmanship and its exuberance.[FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]
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This symphony I think, is one of the best bya British composer. To say it's the greatest, by a British composer, is so,methimng quite contreversial.It's certtainly 'up there' in the top 5, but number one,who knows?
It seems to me like a requiem, for an end of an era.Don’t cry for me
I go where music was born
J S Bach 1685-1750
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Requiem for the end of an era. Well put BBM.
It's so easy to feel one knew Elgar, He died when I was four years old, but the Worcester Three Choirs festivals in the 1950s, the Birthplace, when the elderly lady in charge knew him and Carice visited her while I was there........ I'm glad I saw and heard that when I could travel about a bit.
I think I love his two symphonies equally, although they are quite different.
While my friend and I were visiting the Birthplace an American visitor claimed the lady's attention and she left us, saying we could look at anything. In the Study we found a fascinating box of letters to Elgar from various well-known musicians. When she came back we were told they were for Diana McVegh, not for us to read. Ah well.Last edited by salymap; 11-07-12, 15:11.
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Originally posted by Brassbandmaestro View PostIt seems to me like a requiem, for an end of an era.
But there's also a more personal loss, too: the way the breezy scherzo turns into a Dies Irae - Brrrrr![FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]
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I have heard it said that Elgar had bipolar disorder. I suspect this is relevant to this discussion about the 2nd, which I am about to listen to for the first time, while walking the dogs, encouraged by the above. It has been on my ipod for 4 years without an airing
As Northy has said, we stand to gain much from this MB.Pacta sunt servanda !!!
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Mandryka
I'm wondering whether a convincing explanation has ever been given for its underwhelming reception at its premiere (in front of the famous 'stuffed pigs' audience)?
It's not like it's a 'difficult' work, or without hummable tunes.....and it's recognisably by the same man who wrote the all-conquering 1st.
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