Live from St David's Hall, Cardiff Friday 15th June at 1930

[Ariosto]

one princ. conductor who could not even conduct a straight three beats in the bar (and he was in fact from somewhere else, Romania I think 

Erik Bergel?

I can't remember the geezers name. Could have been that, not sure though. I do remember the horns one day (when I'd only come accross this bloke for the first time, suddenly having a stand up shouting match with him!) Great stuff, he was such a usless pile of flesh, someone should have got the local vet in to have him put down.

[Ariosto]

A very sweeping statement Ari, and I suggest that you listen on Friday night to see whether you can justify such arbitary condemnation.

True, at one time it did seem that the BBC seemed to be using the Welsh Orchestra as "an old player's safe haven" for contracted members of the BBC Symphony Orchestra, where they could see out their time until they could collect their pensions, but this did have the effect of improving the standard of performance over the years. The current BBCNOW is an entirely different generation of players - no longer enduring the nepotistic array of conductors who were thrust upon them and capable, as I hope you will agree, if you listen on Friday, of holding their own in even the major works with the BBC Scottish, BBC Philharmonic or that sacred cow, the BBC Symphony Orchestra.

HS

I feel suitably chastised HS - but I'm sticking to what I have said. Third rate. (Friday I have several better offers I'm afraid ...) (And one of 'em is a blonde ...)

[Flosshilde]

[Btw the interval talk is Stephen Johnson on Eine Alpendinfonie].

Is this the version for an extra-large orchestra?

[arundodo]

There was a certain Maris Jansons who was their Chief Guest Conductor for 3 years, and recorded all the Tchaikovsky Symphonies plus many other works including the Alpine Symphony. It remained his UK orchestra of choice for another 10 years. Wonder what became of him?

Probably another "useless pile of flesh."

[Richard Tarleton]

The current BBCNOW is an entirely different generation of players - no longer enduring the nepotistic array of conductors who were thrust upon them and capable, as I hope you will agree, if you listen on Friday, of holding their own in even the major works with the BBC Scottish, BBC Philharmonic or that sacred cow, the BBC Symphony Orchestra.

HS

Thank you HS. In the last couple of years I've heard them give fine performances of Bartok Concerto for Orchestra, Shostakovich 5, Britten Sinfonia da Requiem, Strauss Don Quixote and Alassio, and a very creditable Bruckner 7, among other things. A third rate provincial band they ain't.

But what can on say, the general public will accept any old rubbish.

does not, I can assure Ariosto, apply to me.

If I could venture one word of criticism about them, there does seem to be a tendency when they're on their own turf for a handful of orchestra members with difficult parts coming up to be on stage during the interval practising them. It looks and sounds untidy, and doesn't inspire confidence, and I don't notice it with other orchestras.

But I'm very excited about the concert, preceded by an Italian meal just down The Hayes and followed by a long drive home afterwards.

[BBMmk2]

I am surprised that EA hasn't commented on hnere about this!! :)

I will not bother with the first half though!!

[Hornspieler]

If I could venture one word of criticism about them, there does seem to be a tendency when they're on their own turf for a handful of orchestra members with difficult parts coming up to be on stage during the interval practising them. It looks and sounds untidy, and doesn't inspire confidence, and I don't notice it with other orchestras.

Not ideal, I agree, but maybe it's the only place to get a bit of peace and quiet and at least it displays a conscience about "...getting it right for the customers".

However it prompts me to relate an amusing anecdote about a similar situation:

The orchestra was assembled on the platform, waiting to play the second part of the concert. Some sort of a delay and members could be heard twiddling away quietly at snatches of what was to come, to keep their instruments warmed up.
All except the second horn, that is, who was screaming away high up trying to reach top Z!

The 1st horn leaned across to him "Please don't play up there, old chap. People might think it's me!"

No names, no pack drill, as they say.

HS

[Ariosto]

There was a certain Maris Jansons who was their Chief Guest Conductor for 3 years, and recorded all the Tchaikovsky Symphonies plus many other works including the Alpine Symphony. It remained his UK orchestra of choice for another 10 years. Wonder what became of him?

Probably another "useless pile of flesh."

He was the exception, and I worked with him many times. I never heard it was his choice orchestra and I would question that. Probably just good PR if he did say that. Under him they did sound a bit better. (Like many Russians he is very fine in certain repertoir, but I'm not so fond of him in the Viennese classics like Mahler etc). He is still around, but I think mainly works abroad now.

I'm sorry you think he is a "useless pile of flesh" because I would not agree.

[amateur51]

There was a certain Maris Jansons who was their Chief Guest Conductor for 3 years, and recorded all the Tchaikovsky Symphonies plus many other works including the Alpine Symphony. It remained his UK orchestra of choice for another 10 years. Wonder what became of him?

Probably another "useless pile of flesh."

exactly. Methinks certain musicians are not necessarily good judges of conductor flesh, being too close to the action to hear the results, perhaps?

[amateur51]

He was the exception, and I worked with him many times. I never heard it was his choice orchestra and I would question that. Probably just good PR if he did say that. Under him they did sound a bit better. (Like many Russians he is very fine in certain repertoir, but I'm not so fond of him in the Viennese classics like Mahler etc). He is still around, but I think mainly works abroad now.

I'm sorry you think he is a "useless pile of flesh" because I would not agree.

He is Chief Conductor of the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra of Amsterdam and the Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra

[french frank]

Is this the version for an extra-large orchestra?

I can make secret changes and make you look Very Foolish, you know, Floss

[Hornspieler]

I'm sorry you think he is a "useless pile of flesh" because I would not agree.

But it was you who first used the term "useless pile of flesh" when speaking of another guest conductor. Arundodo merely asked your opinion - he did not offer his own.

However, I'm sure that Maestro Jansons would be delighted to learn that his conducting meets with your approval.

HS

[french frank]

He is still around, but I think mainly works abroad now.

(And there was me thinking Ariosto didn't appreciate irony!)

[Hornspieler]

My favourite horn writing in the piano concerto. E flat is the natural key for horn players - as Mozart showed with his horn concertos, the Sinfonia Concertante for wind instruments, the same for the Violin and Viola concertante and, of course, the horn quintet and the piano and wind quintet. Angela Hewitt played musically and her ensemble sections with the woodwind choir were a joy to one's ears.

The Alpine symphony was one of the first pieces I ever took part in (1951, LPO )but I remember little about that performance, being one of the twelve offstage horns, closeted in a side room in the RFH, so I found Stephen Johnson's interval talk very enlightening.

Now I'm enjoying the symphony itself and I must say, Ariosto, that this "third rate provincial orchestra" is doing ever so well!

Please, please, if you've missed this live broadcast, do listen to it on iPlayer. I promise you that you will be thrilled by this performance.

Hornspieler

[Flosshilde]

I can make secret changes and make you look Very Foolish, you know, Floss

Don't worry, Frenchie, I can do that very well myself