Eroica

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Not to worry, Anna. Some folk just can't take Beethoven without the patina of Wagner accreted to it.

Hmm. Wagner or Norrington? I know which I'd prefer.

However, this was JEG, and truly excellent.

[aeolium]

the absence of a "conductor" was accurate historically !

I thought Beethoven was conducting (at least some of the time). In fact he conducted the first public performance in Vienna in 1805 and had conducted the first public performance of his earlier 2nd symphony. Wouldn't he also have conducted at this private performance?

[MrGongGong]

depends on what you mean by "conduct"
in this film he did "conduct" at times but didn't stand there beating time

[aeolium]

No, and that was not very plausible, but it allowed LvB to go and have conversations with various characters - if he had been "conducting" all the time (which he surely would have for a new and complex work) it would have lacked some dramatic interest.

[EdgeleyRob]

That was indeed the disbelief that one had to suspend to get anywhere with the film. I happily went with it.

Me too. I found the film quite gripping and a little shiver went down my spine as 'Haydn' was leaving and saying from that moment everything had changed!
This is my favourite Beethoven symphony although I much prefer his music in chamber and piano sonata form.

[MrGongGong]

I think one thing to remember about watching anything on TV that is about a subject you know about is that you will spend the time going "NO it's not like that !".
That's the nature of films and TV shows , one sees and hears nonsense presented as fact......... realising this one can see how ALL TV is like that.
I'm sure the Beethoven scholars would sit watching this with their heads in their hands....... the important thing is not to let these things spoil ones enjoyment.
I'm sick of certain myths about music being perpetrated (the "Theremin" on "Good Vibrations" NO NO NO it's not a Theremin it's a Tannerin , similar but different etc etc ) , were the hand positions of the horn players in this Beethoven orchestra accurate ? i'm sure the players of the OAE would have something to say about that ............

[Ventilhorn]

.... were the hand positions of the horn players in this Beethoven orchestra accurate ? i'm sure the players of the OAE would have something to say about that ............

Good morning Mr GG,

I'm sure that as a former horn player you will know that the requirements of the Eroica are almost entirely of the harmonic series of a horn in Eb, so the hand positions looked correct to me. The occasion slight adjustment for the 11th harmonic would be hardly noticable and I don't recall the slow movement big unison tune showing the horns from behind.

VH

[MrGongGong]

indeed Ventil
they seemed to be able to play the difficult bits with remarkable ease !

[salymap]

I go to bed very early because of back pain and thought I would catch the film today. It's not available.

That will teach me. I have seen so many really dreadful films on composers but this sounded rather good.

[aeolium]

the important thing is not to let these things spoil ones enjoyment.

I quite agree, MrGG, and it didn't spoil mine. I thought it was much better for instance than the Simon Russell Beale programme in the Symphony series. I should think the real first performance might have been quite difficult to watch and listen to with not a few hiccups!

[PatrickOD]

From the point of view of grabbing the interest of the less knowledgable or new listener, I thought this was an excellent programme, and an example of the kind of thing that can and should be done in the cause of accessibility. Judging from the comments above, it also had appeal for the more seasoned listener, and opened the way for further study of the Eroica. I saw it last night for the first time, and it struck me forcibly that my old drama lecturer was right when he encouraged us to use improvised drama to unlock ideas in literature, social studies, history, or other subjects in the school curriculum. Here the drama element explored some important aspects of music and complemented the actual performance by the orchestra, which was the main point I thought. I also vey much enjoyed the sound of the orchestra, being more familiar with HvK and the Berlin Phil, and which I listened to again with, I believe, a heightened sensitivity.

[Nick Armstrong]

From the point of view of grabbing the interest of the less knowledgable or new listener, I thought this was an excellent programme, and an example of the kind of thing that can and should be done in the cause of accessibility. Judging from the comments above, it also had appeal for the more seasoned listener, and opened the way for further study of the Eroica. I saw it last night for the first time, and it struck me forcibly that my old drama lecturer was right when he encouraged us to use improvised drama to unlock ideas in literature, social studies, history, or other subjects in the school curriculum. Here the drama element explored some important aspects of music and complemented the actual performance by the orchestra, which was the main point I thought. I also vey much enjoyed the sound of the orchestra, being more familiar with HvK and the Berlin Phil, and which I listened to again with, I believe, a heightened sensitivity.

[Anna]

I was thinking about this earlier and Patrick has put it perfectly in relation to the programme being accessible and grabbing the interest of less knowledgeable or new listeners. I think the BBC missed a trick and should have scheduled Eroica first, got people curious and excited and then led them into The Symphony programme the following day. I suppose there must be a copyright issue which prevents it from being on iplayer, a shame for those like saly who missed it.