FNiMN

[vinteuil]

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I've come to the conclusion that Sam Jackson isn't doing that bad a job..

You accused .me of posting a wind-up! [Edit No it was ooo - but I admit it rankled! ] ...

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I'm intrigued - I didn't set out to wind you up, so am now wondering what I wrote that has done so!

it was LMcD in # 355 who accused FrFr of a wind-up -

As wind-ups go, I must admit that this one really is pretty impressive.

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[mopsus]

The only pub I’ve ever heard Nietzsche quoted in.

May I gently suggest to EH that if they want a more erudite line in overheard conversation they've been frequenting the wrong pubs? I can think of plenty (most of those in central Oxford, for example, but not just there) where that could easily happen.

On the subject of 'light' music, it's had homes in various places on Radio 3 over the years. There used to be an hour-long slot one weekday afternoon, and going further back much of 'Mainly for Pleasure' and before it 'Homeward Bound' in the early evening was like that. And of course the morning of January 1st.

[Ein Heldenleben]

May I gently suggest to EH that if they want a more erudite line in overheard conversation they've been frequenting the wrong pubs? I can think of plenty (most of those in central Oxford, for example, but not just there) where that could easily happen.

On the subject of 'light' music, it's had homes in various places on Radio 3 over the years. There used to be an hour-long slot one weekday afternoon, and going further back much of 'Mainly for Pleasure' and before it 'Homeward Bound' in the early evening was like that. And of course the morning of January 1st.

Suffice to say that I have only too much knowledge of conversation in Oxford Pubs (albeit from forty five years ago ) and Nietzsche never once came up. Mainly beer , heavy metal , audio gear, football, tittle -tattle and the odd reference to a book vaguely being read for some obscure and footling academic purpose.

[Ein Heldenleben]

It doesn't say so but isn't this night's offering a repeat?

Good point it should and I’m pretty sure it is !

[Ein Heldenleben]

......."and Wittgenstein was a beery swine, 'I drink therefore I am.'"

Is it pushing things to assert that the song encapsulates everything that is essentially “knowable “ of 2,000 years of Western Philosophy?

PS isn’t it “ Rene Descartes was a drunken fart , I drink therefore I am”

which is comic genius …

[Roger Webb]

Is it pushing things to assert that the song encapsulates everything that is essentially “knowable “ of 2,000 years of Western Philosophy?

Just about......and the rest can be had here...

https://youtu.be/i21OJ8SkBMQ?feature=shared

[french frank]

I'm intrigued - I didn't set out to wind you up, so am now wondering what I wrote that has done so!

vinteuil has put me right that I was right first time when I attributed the comment to LMcD, but I then amended it to be wrong

[gurnemanz]

it seems an increasing number of ex-Radio 3 listeners, are exploring alternatives in the shape of YLE, Cesky Rozhlas, etc. for morning listening

The reason why people listen to them is because they're there and very useful if a random playlist is what you seek or have the required foreign language fluency. There is an abundance of alternative sources nowadays. When I first started listening to Radio Three nearly 60 years ago you had no alternative classical radio listening, if you didn't like its style. I'm not a proponent of 'vocal vapidity' or playing extracted bits of longer whole works, so I tend not to listen when that occurs, but I don't take a hard line on that stuff and try not to be negative. I know some people who do like that style, whom I respect and who are not stupid.

I relish longer works and am happy to sit for five hours (or stand, as in the 1972 Boulez Prom) for Parsifal, even though my namesake, like me, does go on a bit, but I don't need to be culturally or artistically challenged from dawn till dusk. Musical items obviously don't need to be long to be worth listening to: eg rock, jazz, folk, madrigal, early music, most of eg Chopin, Johann Strauss, Satie, Scarlatti, Mompou. Much of my favourite classical listening is 'pop-length' pieces - piano solo, Lieder, mélodies, Russian and Czech song. I have even been known to listen to individual opera arias without feeling intellectually obliged to play the whole work. I don't necessarily need a coherently constructed programme. Juxtaposition of diverse pieces can also offer pleasure, contrast, stimulation, surprise, discovery and useful insights. My personal listening pattern could not most of the time be described as planned or coherent and I sometimes just close my eyes and pick any CD off the shelf. As an oldie at home all day, I listen to Radio 3 more than I ever did when working or pre-occuped with children. Radio 3 is an essential and valued part of my listening. There are many programmes I enjoy which I do not find anywhere else, eg live Wigmore song recitals, which may be a turn-off for others - now available 24/7 with good reception and with listen again availability. One thing I won't be tuning into is Friday Night is Music Night.

[oddoneout]

The reason why people listen to them is because they're there and very useful if a random playlist is what you seek or have the required foreign language fluency. There is an abundance of alternative sources nowadays. When I first started listening to Radio Three nearly 60 years ago you had no alternative classical radio listening, if you didn't like its style. I'm not a proponent of 'vocal vapidity' or playing extracted bits of longer whole works, so I tend not to listen when that occurs, but I don't take a hard line on that stuff and try not to be negative. I know some people who do like that style, whom I respect and who are not stupid.

I relish longer works and am happy to sit for five hours (or stand, as in the 1972 Boulez Prom) for Parsifal, even though my namesake, like me, does go on a bit, but I don't need to be culturally or artistically challenged from dawn till dusk. Musical items obviously don't need to be long to be worth listening to: eg rock, jazz, folk, madrigal, early music, most of eg Chopin, Johann Strauss, Satie, Scarlatti, Mompou. Much of my favourite classical listening is 'pop-length' pieces - piano solo, Lieder, mélodies, Russian and Czech song. I have even been known to listen to individual opera arias without feeling intellectually obliged to play the whole work. I don't necessarily need a coherently constructed programme. Juxtaposition of diverse pieces can also offer pleasure, contrast, stimulation, surprise, discovery and useful insights. My personal listening pattern could not most of the time be described as planned or coherent and I sometimes just close my eyes and pick any CD off the shelf. As an oldie at home all day, I listen to Radio 3 more than I ever did when working or pre-occuped with children. Radio 3 is an essential and valued part of my listening. There are many programmes I enjoy which I do not find anywhere else, eg live Wigmore song recitals, which may be a turn-off for others - now available 24/7 with good reception and with listen again availability. One thing I won't be tuning into is Friday Night is Music Night.

Regarding the online alternatives it isn't so much that I want random playlists(or to have to fire up the PC when I otherwise have no need to) as that, in the case of YLE which is most of my listening, the playlist is complete and timed so I can choose what and when - and no linguistic skills needed especially if the English translation option is chosen, although the time difference 'translations' needed sometimes catch me out. What should be a R3 equivalent, ie the weekday afternoon programme, doesn't have a complete playlist, rarely has more than a couple of timings, if that, and never complete ones - presumably because the pre-broadcast playlist is itself always incomplete. That rules it out for linear listening for me, unless the approximately 3 pm 'big work' slot is of particular interest and warrants the effort. Sounds doesn't work on my PC which at least removes the question of whether I could be bothered to reconstruct recorded concerts that the BBC seems to think should be deconstructed and scattered through the 2 or 3 hour slot.
The R3 direction of travel was increasingly pushing me away from daytime listening but post April 1st that process accelerated, through a combination of ubiquitous style formats and changes to programme times, to the current situation where my total weekly listening hours are not that different from what used to be my daily hours - and are nearly all Sunday daytime. The evening concert offer may or may not increase that.
It's not the music content that has pushed me away(although repetition and lack of variety seemed to be increasing) but the waffle foam padding it now comes in.

[oddoneout]

Good point it should and I’m pretty sure it is !

I seem to remember listening and not thinking much of the arrangements of items from the shows that I have sung in various versions in choir summer concerts . Given the general level of inaccuracy in the online information it could be just another instance, but it also, if inadvertently, disguises the fact that they are having to recycle episodes at rather short intervals.

[Roger Webb]

The reason why people listen to them is because they're there and very useful if a random playlist is what you seek or have the required foreign language fluency. There is an abundance of alternative sources nowadays. When I first started listening to Radio Three nearly 60 years ago you had no alternative classical radio listening, if you didn't like its style. I'm not a proponent of 'vocal vapidity' or playing extracted bits of longer whole works, so I tend not to listen when that occurs, but I don't take a hard line on that stuff and try not to be negative. I know some people who do like that style, whom I respect and who are not stupid.

I relish longer works and am happy to sit for five hours (or stand, as in the 1972 Boulez Prom) for Parsifal, even though my namesake, like me, does go on a bit, but I don't need to be culturally or artistically challenged from dawn till dusk. Musical items obviously don't need to be long to be worth listening to: eg rock, jazz, folk, madrigal, early music, most of eg Chopin, Johann Strauss, Satie, Scarlatti, Mompou. Much of my favourite classical listening is 'pop-length' pieces - piano solo, Lieder, mélodies, Russian and Czech song. I have even been known to listen to individual opera arias without feeling intellectually obliged to play the whole work. I don't necessarily need a coherently constructed programme. Juxtaposition of diverse pieces can also offer pleasure, contrast, stimulation, surprise, discovery and useful insights. My personal listening pattern could not most of the time be described as planned or coherent and I sometimes just close my eyes and pick any CD off the shelf. As an oldie at home all day, I listen to Radio 3 more than I ever did when working or pre-occuped with children. Radio 3 is an essential and valued part of my listening. There are many programmes I enjoy which I do not find anywhere else, eg live Wigmore song recitals, which may be a turn-off for others - now available 24/7 with good reception and with listen again availability. One thing I won't be tuning into is Friday Night is Music Night.

I didn't really mean to be as dismissive of all output on Radio 3...after all it has been my constant companion for nearly as long as you (55 years in my case) - I'm retired too, but was lucky enough to run a classical music shop so was able to choose Radio 3 as well as a limitless choice of CDs whilst 'at work'. I often chose to have Radio 3 playing, and encouraged customers who weren't familiar with it to give it a go - this was the early days of Classic FM and boom-time for CD sales.

I think that now Radio 3 has gone too far down the CFM route, but there are other programmes I listen too...you mentioned Wigmore Hall concerts, and I usually get lunch out of the way so as to be in my music room by One o'clock on Mondays - of course this may feature shorter pieces...you mentioned song recitals, and this is fine of course, as, usually, the whole hour is, or should be, planned as a complete entity. I mentioned WDR3's chamber concert last night, this was perfect programming - just like being at a chamber concert. But I simply don't like a 'DJ' playing odd bits of things strung together with inane chatter....but à chacun le sien!

[Roger Webb]

PS isn’t it “ Rene Descartes was a drunken fart , I drink therefore I am”

which is comic genius …

Yes of course! And wasn't it two Australians discussing it? University of Woolloomaloo?

I actually saw a Monty Python show live in 1972....I can't remember whether they did this sketch - if they did I didn't remember it very well!

[french frank]

...you mentioned Wigmore Hall concerts, and I usually get lunch out of the way so as to be in my music room by One o'clock on Mondays - of course this may feature shorter pieces...you mentioned song recitals, and this is fine of course, as, usually, the whole hour is, or should be, planned as a complete entity.

This, for me, is the critical argument, rather than the length of individual pieces in an hour-long sequence. So not a random "and now for something completely different" ragbag, with "Nehmt meinen Dank" followed by the theme from Star Wars and Tiger Rag. But only one weekly recital left and one evening concert axed.

[hmvman]

Yes of course! And wasn't it two Australians discussing it? University of Woolloomaloo?

I actually saw a Monty Python show live in 1972....I can't remember whether they did this sketch - if they did I didn't remember it very well!

Yes, it was two Australians. It's on the 'Live at Drury Lane' LP, which I have in my collection and not played for about forty years.....but.....

[Nick Armstrong]

Yes of course!

I think what you were partially remembering is:

“…. and Wittgenstein was a beery swine, who was just as schloshed as Schlegel”