Missa Solemnis - Live in Concert 6.6.15

[Historian]

I agree that the choir sounded a little tired in places towards the end, at least on the radio. As an amateur choral singer this is not at all surprising as most amateur singers will struggle with the demands of Beethoven's writing. A big enough amateur choir, together with a conductor who is aware of the need not to let his players overwhelm the singers, can ameliorate some of the difficulties. However, by no means all conductors are aware of the need for such sensitivity. I haven't worked with Elder much, but he was good for the choir to work with. Having said all that, I have seen some orchestras resent being reminded that they are, effectively, accompanying the choir on occasion. For example, Claus-Peter Flor often made this point to his players, but I'm not sure they liked it.

However, that doesn't help those like Jayne who can't countenance 'big choir' performances. I suppose we just have to be grateful for the Monteverdi Choir and similar ensembles.

It's still a great sing and I always find myself singing it to myself for days afterwards.

[ardcarp]

Having said all that, I have seen some orchestras resent being reminded that they are, effectively, accompanying the choir on occasion.

It needs a constant nag to get string-players in particular to back off a bit. Yes they almost always resent it! A modern violin is a very loud instrument and when there's between 20 and 30 they can make a very big sound indeed. Ironically, if you're doing something like the VW Tallis Fantasia which needs a husky pianissimo at times, they all do it 'cos it's their piece and their moment. But if you suggest a ff moment in a choral piece only needs an mf from the strings, they soon 'forget' ...and constant reminders do get on their nerves.

[makropulos]

The booklets go into some detail: the 1989 All Saints' recording on DG Archiv has a choir of 36 (12-8-8-8); the 2012 Barbican one on SDG, 45 (13-12-9-11).

I adore both JEG's recordings, even though, like fhg, I often have more than a few reservations about his classical orchestral albums. The earlier Missa tends towards beauty and intimacy, balanced and controlled; the later live one, warmth intensity and impact...

"From the heart" indeed, and this work is very close to my heart; always playing somewhere in the back of my mind. - it's an iconic piece for me. But after JEG, I find it impossible to listen to larger-scale performances now. An alternative quick-and-dramatic approach, but with a larger chorus (23-22-20-21) is David Zinman with the Zurich Tonhalle forces, very well recorded on Arte Nova (Gramophone, JS, 7/2002). At 65'57, even quicker than JEG!

Here's a longer comparison of the two JEG readings...
http://www.for3.org/forums/showthrea...Missa+Solemnis

Another that I greatly enjoy is Herreweghe's second recording, notable for the unforced choral singing and some superb period-instrument orchestral playing:

http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/PHI/LPH007

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Another that I greatly enjoy is Herreweghe's second recording, notable for the unforced choral singing and some superb period-instrument orchestral playing:
http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/PHI/LPH007

I'd forgotten that Herreweghe had recorded the work again, so many thanks for the "nudge", makro

I have his earlier recording, which is very beautiful - a smidgen too beautiful for my idea of how the work should go; a little more aggression at times - the grit to create the pearl - I think is needed.

[Cockney Sparrow]

Another that I greatly enjoy is Herreweghe's second recording,

If you can stream, to computer etc
The 2nd Herreweghe recording is available on Naxos Music Library - streaming, via many a public library (in UK at least)- -with, oh joy, PDF booklets available.
Label: PHI
Catalogue No.: LPH007

As is the 2nd JEG/ Monteverdi - SDG label
(took a bit of finding - use Advanced search, Catalogue Tab "SDG718" as the search term

As I have the 1st Herreweghe recording, and the 1st JEG/ Monteverdi (and the Klemperer and the Nimbus/Oslo) I think I should listen first, and re-appraise the others, before I buy another (but as the CD is on offer at Presto, perhaps soon…..).

POSTSCRIPT - Still need to compare, but I'm listening to the 2nd Herreweghe now, and its a joy - I do like his recordings....(I must make sure I see him live.....). (Which is no disrespect to JEG - often, of recordings available to me, in his repertoire - his is the best)

[gurnemanz]

I got to know this stupendous work years ago via a Heliodor double LP in glorious mono with Böhm, which got played to death. (Available still, I'm half tempted to get it for old times' sake). I then went for the white hot Toscanini which really grabbed me. I had an Athena poster of Beethoven in Byronic pose on the wall of my student hutch, to which I had added the quote: "Vom Herzen, möge es zu Herzen gehen". I saw it two years on the trot at the Proms in those years - 1970 Jochum and 1971 Colin Davis in Westminster Cathedral. It was also First Night in 72 with Boulez. Other favourite recordings are Gardiner and Bernstein/Concertgebouw.

I have sung it once in an amateur show and will admit that some bits were beyond my limited ability.

[BassOne83]

So sorry you were disappointed. The choir (which has several Gramophone Awards) worked very hard for months with possibly the greatest choral director and I'll go with her and Sir Mark Elder's responses to the performance, the reaction of the audience in the hall, and the 5* reviews in the Telegraph and Manchester Evening News. I would be interested in your experience as a singer, and hope you are not just a member of the self-opinionated green ink brigade.

[teamsaint]

Tonight.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b072hztf

[BBMmk2]

JLW, I have the DG version of JEGGER's, he's recorded one on his own label?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

JLW, I have the DG version of JEGGER's, he's recorded one on his own label?

Yup - a couple of years ago, Bbm:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00FEMGC60

[jayne lee wilson]

JLW, I have the DG version of JEGGER's, he's recorded one on his own label?

Right here, right now....
(but my love is real)

http://www.for3.org/forums/showthread.php?9998-JEG-s-new-Missa-Solemnis-Barbican-live-on-SDG&highlight=Missa+Solemnis

[light_calibre_baritone]

His (JEG's) later recording (on Sol Deo Gloria) is taken from a Live concert and, if anything, is even more astonishing. The Monteverdi Choir is a professional ensemble of about seventy voices.

That live recording of Missa Solemnis has just over 40 of us singing - the choir is never any bigger than that (usually about 24 in number).

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

That live recording of Missa Solemnis has just over 40 of us singing - the choir is never any bigger than that (usually about 24 in number).

- not entirely sure where I got my "about seventy voices" from - and it's probably charitable not to inquire!