Live in concert 7/5/14 - 7:30pm BSO/Karabits - Brahms

[mercia]

Kirill Karabits conducts the complete Brahms Symphonies with the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra
In the first of two concerts on consecutive evenings, the dynamic Ukrainian conductor leads his players in the dramatic, brooding First Symphony and the more lyrical Second.
Presented by Martin Handley

Brahms
Symphony No 1 in C minor, op 68

c. 8.20pm
Interval

c. 8.40pm
Brahms
Symphony No 2 in D major, op 73
Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra
Kirill Karabits (conductor).

[Flay]

Excellent! But would it not be preferable to have the 2nd in the first half and the 1st in the second?

[Hornspieler]

Excellent! But would it not be preferable to have the 2nd in the first half and the 1st in the second?

No, I'm with Karabits on this one.

Those menacing drum beats at the beginning of Nº 1 are a far more effective opening to a concert than the sweet lyricism of Nº 2.

(You can, of course make your own choice with iPlayer)

Without really straying too far off post, let me tell you the tale of Horenstein and the Timpanist

It was the first ever visit to the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra of the great, but much feared Jascha Horenstein.

His reputation had gone before him and everyone was a little nervous - except one, that is. Our rather militant timpanist.

This forbidding looking figure stood in front of us and announced "We start with Brahms First Symphony"

He stopped after the first few bars. "No no no! This is crescendo"

We played again. "NO! NO! Timpani. Crescendo. Do you not see this?"

The militant drummer went on the attack: "I'm sorry, mister conductor but I didn't bring my volume meter with me this morning."

The stare which greeted this stupid remark froze the rebel and he realised that he had overstepped the mark.

"What did you say?

"Er, I mean, well, it's difficult to measure the exact volume of every note."

But Horenstein smiled. "So. We do this together. Play for me beats one and two - and number two must be louder than number one."

"Good. Now you play me number one two and three, and number two must be louder than number one and number three must be louder than number two. Excellent! Now you play me number one, two, three and four and number two must be louder than ..." etc

He took his victim right up like that to number twelve - number by number.

"So! Now we have crescendo. We can all start to work. Beginning, gentlemen!"

The revolution had been crushed. The performance that night was magnificent.

HS

[edashtav]

Good point,hs, made with increasing emphasis.

What a great story about Jascha - so true of the man- How to discipline a whole orchestra in 2 minutes. Wonderful!!

[amateur51]

Good point,hs, made with increasing emphasis.

What a great story about Jascha - so true of the man- How to discipline a whole orchestra in 2 minutes. Wonderful!!

Quite chilling initially but clearly necessary

I wonder, did the would-be revolitionary ever tried to wind a conductor up again?

[Petrushka]

I usually play the Brahms cycle as 3 & 2 and 4 & 1 as Karajan preferred to do but Alison ticked me off for playing anything after Brahms 4. It's a fair point but it's the order that feels right to me.

[Sir Monty Golfear]

No, I'm with Karabits on this one.

Those menacing drum beats at the beginning of Nº 1 are a far more effective opening to a concert than the sweet lyricism of Nº 2.

(You can, of course make your own choice with iPlayer)

Without really straying too far off post, let me tell you the tale of Horenstein and the Timpanist

It was the first ever visit to the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra of the great, but much feared Jascha Horenstein.

His reputation had gone before him and everyone was a little nervous - except one, that is. Our rather militant timpanist.

This forbidding looking figure stood in front of us and announced "We start with Brahms First Symphony"

He stopped after the first few bars. "No no no! This is crescendo"

We played again. "NO! NO! Timpani. Crescendo. Do you not see this?"

The militant drummer went on the attack: "I'm sorry, mister conductor but I didn't bring my volume meter with me this morning."

The stare which greeted this stupid remark froze the rebel and he realised that he had overstepped the mark.

"What did you say?

"Er, I mean, well, it's difficult to measure the exact volume of every note."

But Horenstein smiled. "So. We do this together. Play for me beats one and two - and number two must be louder than number one."

"Good. Now you play me number one two and three, and number two must be louder than number one and number three must be louder than number two. Excellent! Now you play me number one, two, three and four and number two must be louder than ..." etc

He took his victim right up like that to number twelve - number by number.

"So! Now we have crescendo. We can all start to work. Beginning, gentlemen!"

The revolution had been crushed. The performance that night was magnificent.

HS

Great story!....I have a recording of Horenstein conducting the Baden Baden SO ...those tympani beats are truly menacing and the the violins are so intense....I love it!....is anyone else familiar with this recording?

[richardfinegold]

Great story!....I have a recording of Horenstein conducting the Baden Baden SO ...those tympani beats are truly menacing and the the violins are so intense....I love it!....is anyone else familiar with this recording?

It was released here on the Vox label. I haven't played it for a bit. After reading HS story, i know what I'lll be listening to tonight.

[richardfinegold]

No, I'm with Karabits on this one.

Those menacing drum beats at the beginning of Nº 1 are a far more effective opening to a concert than the sweet lyricism of Nº 2.

(You can, of course make your own choice with iPlayer)

Without really straying too far off post, let me tell you the tale of Horenstein and the Timpanist

It was the first ever visit to the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra of the great, but much feared Jascha Horenstein.

His reputation had gone before him and everyone was a little nervous - except one, that is. Our rather militant timpanist.

This forbidding looking figure stood in front of us and announced "We start with Brahms First Symphony"

He stopped after the first few bars. "No no no! This is crescendo"

We played again. "NO! NO! Timpani. Crescendo. Do you not see this?"

The militant drummer went on the attack: "I'm sorry, mister conductor but I didn't bring my volume meter with me this morning."

The stare which greeted this stupid remark froze the rebel and he realised that he had overstepped the mark.

"What did you say?

"Er, I mean, well, it's difficult to measure the exact volume of every note."

But Horenstein smiled. "So. We do this together. Play for me beats one and two - and number two must be louder than number one."

"Good. Now you play me number one two and three, and number two must be louder than number one and number three must be louder than number two. Excellent! Now you play me number one, two, three and four and number two must be louder than ..." etc

He took his victim right up like that to number twelve - number by number.

"So! Now we have crescendo. We can all start to work. Beginning, gentlemen!"

The revolution had been crushed. The performance that night was magnificent.

HS

Question, HS. I've often wondered why Horenstein never had a permenant job in the UK. Was that his decision, or in your opinion, was he judged to difficult to work with and therefore never offered anything but guest positions? I ask you because you had the opportunity to play for him, but of course you may not know.

[Hornspieler]

Question, HS. I've often wondered why Horenstein never had a permenant job in the UK. Was that his decision, or in your opinion, was he judged to difficult to work with and therefore never offered anything but guest positions? I ask you because you had the opportunity to play for him, but of course you may not know.

Horenstein did a lot of work with the London orchestras, but remember that they were all self governing at that time (except the BBC and Roal Opera house, of course) and the orchestras' members were disinclined to give too many engagements to someone who could be so fiercely condemnatory of individual's playing. I suspect that any offer of a musical directorship could quite likely have taken all the power (and security) from certain members, but I do have his recordings of the Bruckner 8th and 9th symphonies with the LSO* which are absolutely breathtaking.

I described him on another thread as "Musical Conductor and Terrorist"

"Ah well, I suppose we must go back into the Chamber of Horenstein" was a frequently heard remark at the end of a tea break, but for some reason, I got on with him very well and I was one of the few people in the orchestra who he addressed by name and not just by instrument.

One of my two favourite conductors, the other being the totally contrasting gentle Dr Bruno Walter.
(We'd better get back on post before we get our wrists smacked)
HS

* I seem to remember that our fellow message boarder, Tony, was playing in those performances.

[Tony Halstead]

'morning HS,

* I seem to remember that our fellow message boarder, Tony, was playing in those performances

In fact I was playing ( 1st Wagner tuba) only in the 8th, with the LSO.
On that 'BBC Legends' double CD, the 9th is played by the BBC SO, not the LSO.

[Hornspieler]

'morning HS,

In fact I was playing ( 1st Wagner tuba) only in the 8th, with the LSO.
On that 'BBC Legends' double CD, the 9th is played by the BBC SO, not the LSO.

Thanks for the correction Tony and a Happy Mayday to you and all message boarders.

I shall be going AWOL for the next three weeks, but I am recording the BSO Brahms cycle and will report my reactions on my return at the end of the month.

HS

[Hornspieler]

Kirill Karabits conducts the complete Brahms Symphonies with the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra
In the first of two concerts on consecutive evenings, the dynamic Ukrainian conductor leads his players in the dramatic, brooding First Symphony and the more lyrical Second.
Presented by Martin Handley

Brahms
Symphony No 1 in C minor, op 68

c. 8.20pm
Interval

c. 8.40pm
Brahms
Symphony No 2 in D major, op 73
Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra
Kirill Karabits (conductor).

7.30 tonight and tomorrow.

Try not to miss this Brahms Fest.

[edashtav]

7.30 tonight and tomorrow.

Try not to miss this Brahms Fest.

Seconded - Karabits is a fine young talent and much loved by his BSO pla yers. Two friends of mine attended an all-day "open" rehearsal last Saturday ( Symphonies 1 & 2) and commented on the collegiate nature of the effort. Kirill consults with his leader often, and with other principals. He doesn't hector but uses his time effectively. In the afternoon, Kirill (jnr) was romping in the Cafe through the tea interval. Both reporters suggest that these concerts will be worth hearing. Marin Alsopp played a deal of Brahms during her tenure in Bournemouth and brought out his lyricism beautifully, IMHO

Expect a full set of repeats including expositions.

[Hornspieler]

Seconded - Karabits is a fine young talent and much loved by his BSO pla yers. Two friends of mine attended an all-day "open" rehearsal last SAturday ( Symphonies 1 & 2) and commented on the collegiate nature of the effort. Kirill consults with his leader often, and with other principals. He doesn't hector but uses his time effectively. In the afternoon, Kirill(jnr) was romping in the Cafe during the tea interval. Both reporters suggest that these concerts will be worth hearing. Marin Alsopp played a deal of Brahms during her tenure in Bournemouth and brought out his lyricism beautifully, IMHO

Expect a full set of repeats including expositions.

Oh dear! Where was my crescendo in the opening bars? So far, I have found the performance feeble and lifeless - and that first movement repeat is one that never works for me. This movement needs to be full of bravado and (as my teacher Aubrey Brain would have said) more declamatory. Listening to that first movement, Hector Berlioz's "March to the Scaffold" came to mind.

The second movement sounds better, but I feel that the orchestra is treading carefully.

I've now abandoned this broadcast pro tem, but will pick it up again tomorrow or later - hoping for better than I've heard so far

HS