C P E Bach St John Passion (1784)

[Hornspieler]

CPE Bach's St John Passion
Duration: 2 hours, 30 minutes
First broadcast:Wednesday 16 April 2014 Live from Cadogan Hall in London
Kirill Karabits conducts the BBC Singers and the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra in the UK premiere of CPE Bach's St John Passion.

The BSO's principal conductor, Kirill Karabits, came across the manuscript for CPE Bach's St John Passion in the National State Archive of the Ukraine in Kiev. Using Karabits's own new edition of this work, and as part of the 300th anniversary celebrations of the birth of CPE Bach, The BBC Singers and Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra collaborate to create a UK premiere performance, in London's Cadogan Hall, of the St John Passion, which probably has not been heard since 1784 when it was last performed in Hamburg.

"One of the most fascinating feelings for a conductor or a musician of our time is to rediscover great music which was considered lost or has simply been forgotten. ... CPE Bach was one of the most important composers in the history of German music and I feel highly privileged to be part of the rediscovery of his vocal legacy, especially during his 300th anniversary year." (Kirill Karabits)

Telemann: Missa super 'Christ lag in Todesbanden'
CPE Bach: Sinfonia No.2 in B flat
CPE Bach: Morgengesang am Schöpfungsfeste

Interval Music: Keyboard sonatas by CPE Bach.

CPE Bach: St John Passion (1784)

Robin Tritschler (tenor)
BBC Singers
Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra
Kirill Karabits (condctor).

Should be interesting

HS

[MickyD]

Indeed it should...thanks for flagging this one up, hornspieler. I know the Morgengesan very well, but that unheard St John is very tempting.

[doversoul1]

The performers are not those whom I usually associate with CPE Bach’s music but why not? I look forward to hearing the concert.

[doversoul1]

7.30 tonight.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b040hyqb

[Hornspieler]

The performers are not those whom I usually associate with CPE Bach’s music but why not? I look forward to hearing the concert.

A five star performance

I don't think that I have ever heard better choral singing. Congratulations to the BBC Singers (two of whom took solo parts)

For me, this broadcast has been the highlight of R3s live performances this year.

Maestro Karabits has produced a winner and well supported by the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra.

I urge all who've missed tonight's concert to listen on iPlayer - particularly to hear the first performance in this country of C P E Bach's St John Passion.

HS

[edashtav]

J C or C P E, HS?

I shall try to catch up - I know that Karabits understands choral music from the18th century - I heard him perform a sprightly Creation in Poole

[Hornspieler]

J C or C P E, HS?

I shall try to catch up - I know that Karabits understands choral music from the18th century - I heard him perform a sprightly Creation in Poole

Quite right, Ed. I must try harder
Hs

[doversoul1]

I’m afraid I can’t say I enjoyed the first half. The orchestra didn’t sound quite right for the music of CPE Bach and the two sopranos were hard work to listen to. All this may be because I tend to expect CPE Bach to sound still belong at least partly to Baroque music.

As for St John Passion, it had far too much recitative and not enough music to my simple taste, and here, CPE sounded very much like JS’s son. The orchestra sounded much more focused than it did in the first half but I didn’t think the singing was anything particularly special.

Having said all this, I thought Robin Tritschler was terrific. I very much looking forward to hearing him as the Evangelist in St Matthew Passion one day soon.

[ed.] It is always good to hear a newly discovered work but I don’t think I’ll look for another performance of this work in a hurry.

[Serial_Apologist]

I’m afraid I can’t say I enjoyed the first half. The orchestra didn’t sound quite right for the music of CPE Bach and the two sopranos were hard work to listen to. All this may be because I tend to expect CPE Bach to sounds still belong at least partly to Baroque music.

Like Monteverdi 150 years before him, CPE was a transitional figure. and this for me is what makes this piece, and others by him so fascinating! I am getting a similar vibe listening to Arne this week. Is one allowed to prefer the son's to the father's, which I was made to sing in at school?

[Pegleg]

A fascinating programme, but the "BBC Singers" never fail to disappoint me as I always wonder if they are up to the task. This is a purely personal opinion from a total layman, but one of the sopranos featured in "Morgengesang am Schöpfungsfeste" was, at least to my ears, struggling. A great pity as this is a beautiful and potentially emotional piece, as this performance shows:

http://youtu.be/GJMdp0vTKAw

As to the Passion, many of these works are full of lengthy recitative due to their pedagogical nature. That's just the way it was. I'm not sure about the claims being made or the exact nature of this piece in terms of C P E Bach's actual input. I agree, Robin Tritschler was very good and held the whole performance together, which was just as well as the "BBC singers" are nothing special.

Personally, I feel C P E Bach's work deserves better, and why did we have his keyboard sonatas played on modern piano?

[ardcarp]

As for St John Passion, it had far too much recitative and not enough music to my simple taste

I haven't heard the broadcast yet, but the JS Bach Passions were unusual in their musical richness. The passions of Schutz, for instance, are based mainly around telling the biblical narrative in recit-like monody, and before that there was a long tradition of plainsong passions. In its true form, the 'passion' was a long-ish penitential experience, probably deliberately without much to ravish the musical ear. Thank heaven for the glorious exceptions of JSB. (Off to try CPEB on i-plauer now.)

[Il Grande Inquisitor]

I’m afraid I can’t say I enjoyed the first half. The orchestra didn’t sound quite right for the music of CPE Bach and the two sopranos were hard work to listen to. All this may be because I tend to expect CPE Bach to sound still belong at least partly to Baroque music.

As for St John Passion, it had far too much recitative and not enough music to my simple taste, and here, CPE sounded very much like JS’s son. The orchestra sounded much more focused than it did in the first half but I didn’t think the singing was anything particularly special.

Having said all this, I thought Robin Tritschler was terrific. I very much looking forward to hearing him as the Evangelist in St Matthew Passion one day soon.

[ed.] It is always good to hear a newly discovered work but I don’t think I’ll look for another performance of this work in a hurry.

I felt very much the same, doversoul... and I ended up reviewing it too:

http://bachtrack.com/review-cpe-bach-karabits-bournemouth-apr-2014

It certainly made me want to explore more CPE Bach though. Here's what that B flat symphony could have sounded like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8ie3_ZExQ4

[MickyD]

I only had time to listen to the first part last night, but I'm very much with IGI and doversoul...the sharp attack required for CPE Bach's orchestral writing just didn't sound right to me on modern instruments, too mushy for me. As you say, IGI, the Pinnock performance illustrates it so much better. I remember hearing the AAM's recording of the string symphonies for the first time, it was a revelation.

Still, I'll continue and listen to the Passion tonight .

[ardcarp]

The BSO is not a specialist EM group, of course, and given that fact I think Karabits did a good job with their reduced forces. In fact, I wonder if he 'did a Norrington' and discouraged vibrato? Likewise the BBCS...not my favourite group for EM...but he got them as well disciplined as they could be, i.e. no overblown singing.

The St John Passion itself is pretty much the sort of piece expected of a kappelmeister, so comparisons with JSB's is pointless. There was one vg bass aria (was it Jimmy singing?) which was a cut above the rest, and obviously one of the genuine CPEB bits.

I really enjoyed Karabits' interval talk about the 'discovery' of the piece, especially his finding a 90-year-old German woman in a home who knew how to read the now defunct calligraphic [probably the wrong word] text.

[Tony Halstead]

why did we have his keyboard sonatas played on modern piano?

You know.. the usual whitewash as follows:
" if CPE Bach had heard a Steinway/ Bechstein/ Yamaha/ Fazioli / Chickering / Broadwood etc he would have been delighted"