BBC Young Musician 2014

[Mr Pee]

Mr Pee often used to go into 'phnurr-phnurr'-mode when certain young female musicians were mentioned and Ms Balsom was one of his favourites

And she still is. Phnurr-Phnurr.

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

we found the presentation ok just; the music making excellent and liked William Dutton best closely followed by the Korean youngster ...

interesting that there was just a hint of difficulty in Dutton's playing by the judges but nothing to suggest the intensity of criticism from Ariosto ... string players of tender years all have pitch issues ... as the great Red Mitchell said you have to play millions of wrong notes first ..

[Oldcrofter]

I'm still interested to know if professional musicians judge players differently from interested amateurs. I don't know the scores of the Bloch or Britten and consequently cannot say with any certainty if the player is either slapdash or scuffing through some passages. The adjudicators are professionals and have the score in front of them.
Is the suggestion that even though they (the adjudicators) know perfectly well that there are errors in performance, they still prefer visual showmanship to musical substance and accuracy ? And do so because it will be televised at a later date ?

Interested and engaged amateurs make up the bulk of audiences, whether in major concert halls or in local music societies - and in my opinion, they enjoy a degree of "showmanship". That's not necessarily the main reason for attending the concert, but in local and regional competitions for young people, adjudicators almost always point out the importance of a confident entry onto the stage, acknowledging the audience and accompanist and bringing the audience into the performance. It doesn't outweigh the musicianship, of course - but audiences remember you and will come back to hear you next time they see your name.

[french frank]

There are no words...

I haven't seen the programme yet, but what they're obviously trying is a slightly different method of persuading younger viewers/audiences that all this Old Stuff isn't just for the Oldies, rather than just appealing to their parents.

I've never heard any of MK's recordings, so I don't know how his playing compares with the generation Bream-Yepes-Segovia or John Williams. But the spiky hair, jeans and casual look seem to have been picked up as the CSP (Common Selling Point) in this case. To be a crossover star, you have to look the part anyway.

[Mary Chambers]

'Showmanship' is a rather insulting word, at least for a classical performer, but presentation is part of communicating, and very important in a soloist.

I imagine we've all come across very competent, correct players and singers who in the end are just dull - not that I think that applied to anyone in last night's programme. I don't think any of them exhibited 'showmanship' in the way I understand the term, either.

[Ariosto]

'Showmanship' is a rather insulting word, at least for a classical performer, but presentation is part of communicating, and very important in a soloist.

I imagine we've all come across very competent, correct players and singers who in the end are just dull - not that I think that applied to anyone in last night's programme. I don't think any of them exhibited 'showmanship' in the way I understand the term, either.

Mary is going to get me one way or another!

I felt that the whole way it was presented for TV was a bit showmanlike - ritzy and all that - somewhat detracting from the music. So young players are going to be influenced by all of that.

Where we differ, Mary, is that I accept that some of the greatest players can have a small element of showmanship, and that's fine. (The great Misha Elman comes to mind). However, the sort of over playing showy effect that was displayed by the two male contestants was to my mind unnecessary and in fact detracted from their ability to produce good sound and accurate playing. I certainly do not use that phrase as an insult. For example, I find Josh Bell a bit showy these days, and I can see it having a negative effect on his performances. Bear in mind that he was a child prodigy at 12 years old, and played the Tchaikovsky violin concerto even better than he does now, in my opinion. No it's definitely not an insult, but a criticism. Some players can get away with it more than others. A certain cellist does it with a change from one flowery shirt to another between pieces (that's if he still does) - but that did not aversely effect his performances.

Regarding communication, then it has to be achieved through the music. I don't want to get onto conductors, but the greatest ones are usually the least showy, and concentrate on getting to the core of the music. Entertaining antics on the podium often excite the audience, but do little for the music.

Maybe I should go for another walk and find sanity in the hills and the odd dog fight. That's enough for any man or woman to achieve in one day. The rest is all hot air, and most of it coming from me.

[Thropplenoggin]

Mary is going to get me one way or another!

I felt that the whole way it was presented for TV was a bit showmanlike - ritzy and all that - somewhat detracting from the music. So young players are going to be influenced by all of that.

Where we differ, Mary, is that I accept that some of the greatest players can have a small element of showmanship, and that's fine. (The great Misha Elman comes to mind). However, the sort of over playing showy effect that was displayed by the two male contestants was to my mind unnecessary and in fact detracted from their ability to produce good sound and accurate playing. I certainly do not use that phrase as an insult. For example, I find Josh Bell a bit showy these days, and I can see it having a negative effect on his performances. Bear in mind that he was a child prodigy at 12 years old, and played the Tchaikovsky violin concerto even better than he does now, in my opinion. No it's definitely not an insult, but a criticism. Some players can get away with it more than others. A certain cellist does it with a change from one flowery shirt to another between pieces (that's if he still does) - but that did not aversely effect his performances.

Regarding communication, then it has to be achieved through the music. I don't want to get onto conductors, but the greatest ones are usually the least showy, and concentrate on getting to the core of the music. Entertaining antics on the podium often excite the audience, but do little for the music.

Maybe I should go for another walk and find sanity in the hills and the odd dog fight. That's enough for any man or woman to achieve in one day. The rest is all hot air, and most of it coming from me.

Zounds! Verily, sir, we must be cut from the same cloth (Harris tweed?) as I concur with what you have written and find in it none of the aforementioned 'hot air'!

[Mary Chambers]

Mary is going to get me one way or another!

I assure you that's not my intention, Ariosto

[Ariosto]

Only joking Mary. My skin is as tough as a crocodile's anyway, so don't worry. Has to be after all those arm wavers ...

To be serious though (when am I not?) - a friend (violinist who has played everywhere, just about) phoned me this morning to find out what I thought. He pressed me, and I told him. He was even more indignant about the winner than me and thought it was between the Russian and the S Korean, and favoured (just) the Russian. He also liked the harpist a lot.

The fiddler on the jury (Jack L) did not comment on the last person (who won) or the harpist, and I wondered at the time why. Maybe he had connections with the Menuhin School or taught there perhaps.

I think personally that it won't be a string overall winner this time but we shall have to wait for the final and see what happens.

[Richard Tarleton]

I've never heard any of MK's recordings, so I don't know how his playing compares with the generation Bream-Yepes-Segovia or John Williams.

His debut CD "Milos" was played endlessly when it came out in 2011, being responsible for 24 mispronunciations of the word "Tárrega" by R3 presenters when it was in the so-called classical charts . His looks and back-story make him a marketing dream for his record company - I recall Suzy Klein drooling revoltingly over his right-hand manicure on In Tune (to be fair he rebuffed her advances with a nonchalant "tools of trade, tools of trade"). There are a lot of technically highly proficient classical guitarists these days... The ones you name ff were all pioneers in their various ways...today's players stand on their shoulders. I'm not sure what the likes of Milos add to the core repertoire, and he seems to be following the money into crossover.

[Rolmill]

He was even more indignant about the winner than me and thought it was between the Russian and the S Korean, and favoured (just) the Russian. He also liked the harpist a lot.

I'm in Ariosto's camp on this one - I thought both male violinists tried to make up with (over-)confident presentation for technical struggles with their chosen repertoire. I was very surprised by the choice of winner. Personally I was most impressed by the S Korean violinist and the harpist, but had no idea how to decide between them!

[Ariosto]

I'm in Ariosto's camp on this one - I thought both male violinists tried to make up with (over-)confident presentation for technical struggles with their chosen repertoire. I was very surprised by the choice of winner. Personally I was most impressed by the S Korean violinist and the harpist, but had no idea how to decide between them!

Very difficult to decide, as you are comparing bananas with apples. (Harp/violin) But yes, in my opinion the S Korean and the Russian violinist and the Russian harpist were by far the best and it therefore made for a very difficult choice.

When my old friend phoned me (see earlier post) he did mention that he thought the chair of the panel, the guy from Cheltenham, was a disgrace, and should not have been on the jury. In retrospect and with further consideration I think I agree. The problem is that the BBC often bring in some non-descript average Joe Bloggs just to make it look OK. Big mistake, in my view. It's the kind of "appealing to the masses" attitude. "Let's get someone who is outside of the real musical circle, an admin type person, and all will be well." This is what puts the BBC into the "amateur broadcaster" category, I'm afraid to say. (Especially BBC TV).

But to hell with it, who cares, it's just a silly competition.

[Sir Velo]

"Let's get someone who is outside of the real musical circle, an admin type person, and all will be well." This is what puts the BBC into the "amateur broadcaster" category, I'm afraid to say.

I'm not one to defend the BBC normally but Meurig Bowen's biog has this to say:

"Meurig Bowen is Director of the Cheltenham Music Festival, one of the UK’s most celebrated classical music events, and 70 festivals old this year. The son of a Welsh tenor (hence the Welsh name), he was born and brought up in London and studied music at King’s College, Cambridge, where he was a choral scholar. Also a viola player in his teens, he was a member of the London Schools Symphony Orchestra – the highlight, being conducted by Witold Lutoslawski in his own Concerto for Orchestra; and, with no apparent facility, he doggedly practised his way through to Grade 8 piano too. He continues to sing a little now, deputising as a counter tenor in the choirs at Gloucester Cathedral and Tewkesbury Abbey.

Following graduation, and after a period managing The Hilliard Ensemble in London, he moved to Sydney, where he was Artistic Administrator of the Australian Chamber Orchestra from 1995-2001. Returning to the UK, he was Director of the Lichfield Festival in Staffordshire until 2004, and then Head of Programming at the Aldeburgh Festival / Snape Proms before moving west to Cheltenham in 2007.

He has programmed a huge variety of music in these various roles – 800 years of music featuring orchestras, choirs, chamber ensembles, early music groups, world, folk and jazz. He has commissioned and presented the premieres of several dozen works by a wide range of composers, from Arvo Pärt, John Tavener and Judith Weir to Brett Dean, Graham Fitkin and Mark Anthony Turnage.

As a freelance writer of features and reviews, he has contributed over the years to the BBC Music Magazine, The Guardian, The Independent and Sydney Morning Herald, as well as writing many concert programmes and CD liner notes, notably for the Hyperion label. He has written and presented a number of radio programmes for ABC Classic FM in Australia and BBC Radio 3, most recently a programme on Grainger and folk music for Radio 3’s The Essay.

He is a trustee of Birmingham’s elite choir Ex Cathedra and the Holst Birthplace Museum in Cheltenham, and a regular jury member for the Royal Philharmonic Society Awards.

Meurig has had the privilege of programming a number of BBC Young Musician finalists over the years; and at this year’s Cheltenham Music Festival, alongside performances by Guy Johnston and Benjamin Grosvenor, Nicola Benedetti is Artist in Residence."

So, some experience then?

[Ariosto]

Bully for him - a viola player! That says it all! He sounds just like the guy you need after a bad hangover to tell you how crap you are. Well done BBC and all those other institutions who know best.

It changes nothing, he's just an administrator. Knows not enough about muzak ... too many of these bods around.

[Oldcrofter]

Back in Message 18, I asked if you are a professional violinist. (It was a polite question, by the way - not cynical or antagonistic - just interested) So evidently you're not a viola player. So are you a professional violinist ? Just interested.

Do you work with young musicians ?