I think we may be getting confused (or maybe just I am) about the meaning of HIPP. Dolmetch, Munrow and others were performing early music (and I mean Medieval and Renaissance music) which had hardly been played before and were using reproductions...or very occasionally real examples....of crumhorns, dulzians, racketts and so on. This is not in my book what HIPP refers to. To me, HIPP is when music which has been performed by modern ensembles (e.g. Messiah with the Huddersfield Choral Society and full symphony orchestra) is now performed by ensembles which are thought to match in size and instruments the original...and is played (and sung) in a style which is thought to be contemporaneous too. Bach is the bloke who has come in for the heaviest HIPP treatment, to the extent that it is almost a challenge to see who can be HIPPer. HIPP is gradually extending forward in time to include Beethoven, Brahms, even Elgar. Or am I just being picky?
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No, not Elgar. That was a big mistake (not by you, Ardcarp
) It wasn't "HIPP", but "HRPP" - Historically reinvented performance practice, based on falsehood.
But to return to what is HIPP, surely any attempt to move towards returning to the way things were performed at the time can be called HIPP. It's simply a matter of degree.Comment
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Its going to be a real challenge for performers of Cages prepared piano music to get hold of Rubber Rubbers when almost all of them are now made of plasticComment
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Stunsworth, believe it or not, I have a recording of one of those Granada programmes with Munrow. They enjoyed a repeat showing during the 1980s when I had a VCR, and I taped one of them about keyboard instruments. I have since transferred the video cassette to DVD. Of course the quality of the transmission is pretty ropey, but it is fun to see the likes of Christopher Hogwood with 70s hairstyles!Originally posted by Stunsworth View PostComment
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I think you are being picky. Arnold Dolmetsch showed that clavichords and harpsichords, long thought to be museum pieces, could be taken seriously. That was surely an important foundation in the historically informed performance of Bach and other Baroque music. Evolution was slow, however, and it was not until the early 1950s that we had a recording of the Brandenburgs on period instruments, by Schola Cantorum Basiliensis (founded 1933) under the viol-player August Wenzinger (anybody here heard that one?), another important pioneer.Originally posted by ardcarp View PostComment
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I have a recording of a HIPP performance of Messiaen's Theme and Variations for Violin and Pinao, and a couple of Ravel's Tzigane for Violin and Lutheal. THere is also a HIPP Planets to be had, with the New Queen's Hall Orchestra under Roy Goodman's baton.Originally posted by ardcarp View PostComment
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Not really, Roehre. The don't thnk the Stuttgarters used instrument setup to standards contemporary with the composition, though it remains my favourite recorded performnance of the work. I have to ration its spinning, however. It leaves me too emotionally drained.Originally posted by Roehre View PostMahler 9 Norrington (
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Yes, I have that Planets recording, and rather like it. The St Paul's Suite is also thrown in.Originally posted by Bryn View Post
There was also a DHM recording of Richard Strauss' Metamorphosen done on gut strings by the Smithsonian Players.Comment
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Yes, the Stuttgarters do use "present day" instruments, which especially in the winds might make a difference and consequently it isn't a proper HIPP. But in terms of interpretation.... (and yes: for me this performance is more emotionally draining than most of its competitors as well).Originally posted by Bryn View PostComment
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Ah, but my point is that, yes, Dplmetsch and more importantly all the German crowd ARE part of the HIPP movement in getting Bach back to [what is thought or imagined to be] the way it was done. BUT to call Munrow and others performing EARLY music...maybe for the first time... on original-style instruments, is not what I think of as HIPP.I think you are being picky. Arnold Dolmetsch showed that clavichords and harpsichords, long thought to be museum pieces, could be taken seriously. That was surely an important foundation in the historically informed performance of Bach and other Baroque music. Evolution was slow, however, and it was not until the early 1950s that we had a recording of the Brandenburgs on period instruments, by Schola Cantorum Basiliensis (founded 1933) under the viol-player August Wenzinger (anybody here heard that one?), another important pioneer.
PS Mc Gong Gong...:cool2:....and we ought to give Cage's 4'33" in a pre-atomic-clock version.Comment
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And I don't think of Elgar played without vibrato as HIPP. But I do think the composer's own recordings of most of his major works can be called HIPP. But Sir R knows better, of course.Comment
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Indeed he does, though HIPP relating to the era of the First's premier, rather than that of 23 years later, some time after French orchestras in particular, but also some British ones, had adopted string vibrato as their standard mode of 'expression'.Sir R knows better, of course.Comment
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I found this article, and its video evidence, interesting: http://www.fugue.us/Vibrato_History_E.htmlOriginally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post"...the isle is full of noises,
Sounds and sweet airs, that give delight and hurt not.
Sometimes a thousand twangling instruments
Will hum about mine ears, and sometime voices..."
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