Baroque Spring

[Nick Armstrong]

I agree. It's being done more discretely. No monopolising with wall-to-wall baroque.

.... indeed, 'discretely' and 'discreetly'

[amateur51]

I realise now that I am so disenchanted with much of R3's output that I'm unable to comment from any sort of current knowledge base. I listen to TtN and Lunchtime concert/Ao3 most days but that's about it til the evening concert but by then there's food to get sorted etc. Oh dear :woe:

[JFLL]

It's been a welcome change from the usual 19th century domination of the schedules.

Hardly 'domination', except in the sense that many major composers were nineteenth-century and deserve to be played frequently. But minor composers of the nineteenth-century (let alone the twentieth century) don't get nearly enough airspace as I should like. The difference is, that they're not fashionable, as pre-19th century music has been for quite a time now, whatever its worth..

[ardcarp]

the extensive trailers

There was a truly gruesome one this morning where snippets from the beginning, middle and end of the final chorus of the St Matthew Passion were spliced to fit under about 30 seconds talk. There was no sense of keeping any sort of harmonic progression...it was an act of vandalism.

[Anna]

I appear to be in the minority. Apart from the dreadful (and best quickly forgotten) Baroque Bites and RN Day, I've really enjoyed it. This is because, apart from mainly Purcell and Rameau, I've always said baroque isn't my thing. My opinion has now changed and it certainly hasn't been an overloaded total immersion as they have done in the past.

[ardcarp]

I think I'm largely with you Anna, because as you say, it hasn't been total. On the one hand there has been some R3 silliness (making one want to throw crockery at the Baroquerie), but on the other we have heard a lot of really good stuff from fine composers whom history and the unsurpassable JSB and Handel had confined to the sidelines. Today's EMS was a good example. Glad you're converted!

[jean]

There was a truly gruesome one this morning where snippets from the beginning, middle and end of the final chorus of the St Matthew Passion were spliced to fit under about 30 seconds talk. There was no sense of keeping any sort of harmonic progression...it was an act of vandalism.

That was truly dreadful - like the use of bits of things in ads because they wouldn't be allowed to play the piece straight, and with less excuse.

But that sort of thing could have happened outside of any sort of 'season' - and probably will.

[Flosshilde]

Hardly 'domination', except in the sense that many major composers were nineteenth-century

I think that there are/were more major composers from other centuries. The 19th century dominates not because composers are any 'better' than composers from other centuries, but because the 19th century orchestra dominates. (& I think there is a view that only the symphony orchestra 'matters' or is serious)

deserve to be played frequently.

Does any composer 'deserve' to be played frequently?

[JFLL]

Does any composer 'deserve' to be played frequently?

Yes - Bach, Haydn, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, .... I do think the best should be played more frequently than the second-best, yes. Most listeners aren't musicologists, after all, and would find it odd to have some other order of priorities.

[Flosshilde]

Hmm. There's a lot of argument on here about R3 'dumming down' - part of that is surely a concentration on 'the best' - & a few of 'the best' at that. One of the benefits of something like 'Baroque Spring' is that 'the best' can be heard in context - that is, along with composers who aren't as well known now (& who, in fact, could very well have produced music every bit as good).

[french frank]

The whole thing seems to be a bit of an illusion. If you look at the playlists, there don't seem to be many more baroque pieces than you would expect in a programme lasting two or three hours. Take out the Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and perhaps some Purcell, much of which is fairly standard fare, and the rest seems to be a standard mix of of classical/19th. c., plus the overture from Candide and a short ride in a fast machine.

The main element of the 'season' seems to be the regular repetition of the marketing label 'Baroque Spring' throughout the schedule.

[Thropplenoggin]

The whole thing seems to be a bit of an illusion. If you look at the playlists, there don't seem to be many more baroque pieces than you would expect in a programme lasting two or three hours. Take out the Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and perhaps some Purcell, much of which is fairly standard fare, and the rest seems to be a standard mix of of classical/19th. c., plus the overture from Candide and a short ride in a fast machine.

The main element of the 'season' seems to be the regular repetition of the marketing label 'Baroque Spring' throughout the schedule.

Another totally missed opportunity to foreground generally lesser known but important Baroque composers: Rameau, Buxtehude, etc., etc. How many pièces de clavecin or trio sonatas have they played during 'BS'? (Oh, just look at that acronym! )

[aeolium]

The whole thing seems to be a bit of an illusion. If you look at the playlists, there don't seem to be many more baroque pieces than you would expect in a programme lasting two or three hours. Take out the Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and perhaps some Purcell, much of which is fairly standard fare, and the rest seems to be a standard mix of of classical/19th. c., plus the overture from Candide and a short ride in a fast machine.

The main element of the 'season' seems to be the regular repetition of the marketing label 'Baroque Spring' throughout the schedule.

I don't think that's accurate, at least if you look at the whole schedule rather than one programme like Breakfast or Essential Classics. There has been music by a wide variety of baroque composers as well as the 'usual suspects': French baroque music including Marais, Rameau, Leclair and others, a Scarlatti oratorio, Corelli, Pergolesi, Zelenka, Porpora, Telemann etc. I don't recall hearing those in your average couple of weeks. Even when composers like Bach and Handel were featured there were quite a few works that were off the beaten track such as the Handel dramatic cantata Aci, Galatea e Polifermo and today's BaL featuring some of the keyboard suites. Yes, there were some ghastly gimmicks, but there are ghastly gimmicks pretty well every week and are certainly not unique to the Baroque Spring.

Still, the enterprise certainly seems to have united those critics who think R3 has been swamped by baroque music and others who think there's nothing that's all that different

[french frank]

I don't think that's accurate, at least if you look at the whole schedule rather than one programme like Breakfast or Essential Classics.

But those two programmes take up most of the morning, every day, and they've had at most three or four baroque works - which, as I said, seems about right for programmes of that length.

JEG's Saturday Classics was billed as part of the season , and it had two pieces by Bach. CotW helped by choosing baroque composers (the aforementioned Bach, Handel, Vivaldi and Purcell). So that has been the entire morning, all progs billed as being part of the season.

I suppose the point I was making was that usually there has been a distinct shortage of such works in those programmes, so even a quite small number allows them to claim that this was something special. Count out TEMS (because baroque is part of its ordinary remit). This was the 'bit of an illusion' that I referred to.

Marais, Rameau, Leclair and others, a Scarlatti oratorio, Corelli, Pergolesi, Zelenka, Porpora, Telemann etc. I don't recall hearing those in your average couple of weeks.

The other side of my point - the paucity of such works usually. Why?

[BBMmk2]

Baroque Spring, hmm, another cheap ploy by Radio3?