Artistry of the Middle East: the musical legacy EMS 25 January

[doversoul1]

“East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet." So wrote Rudyard Kipling, but in the world of early music at least, the artistry of the Middle East exerted a huge influence on the instruments and compositions of Europe. From Greek music theory to wandering minstrels, and poetic song-forms to filigree melodies, Lucie Skeaping surveys the musical legacy of this lively contact, visiting medieval dance-music, Sephardic song and plainchant along the way. (Repeat)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b050bjs1

[eighthobstruction]

....looking forward to this....

[aeolium]

Yes, it should be fascinating. What are the main instruments from the Middle East that influenced the development of instruments in the West? Perhaps the oud (lute), santoor (dulcimer), the tanboor/setar? I hope we get to hear some of these older instruments in Middle Eastern music.

[doversoul1]

I’ve hunted down the webpage of the original broadcast but there is no playlist. What’s the point? Have they (whoever the they is) never heard of an archive?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b050bjs1

Well, that’s odd. The date 29 Oct 2007 is now today’s date. Nevertheless, if you click Previous and Nest, you’ll get to the 2007 programmes. Absurd

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

woeful innit the great prebroadcast information famine

looking forward to EMS and many thanks for the pointer doversoul

[Serial_Apologist]

Yes, it should be fascinating. What are the main instruments from the Middle East that influenced the development of instruments in the West? Perhaps the oud (lute), santoor (dulcimer), the tanboor/setar? I hope we get to hear some of these older instruments in Middle Eastern music.

The rebec on our stringed instruments, and the shawm on the woodwind family, especially the oboe, etc?

Influenced from the East on western musical forms and their evolution is of even greater interest, to me.

[MrGongGong]

'How anyone can expect to understand the development of Western Classical music without knowing what happened in 8th Century Mongolia is a mystery to me' : Frank Denyer (quoted from remembering a conversation so not exact words)

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

'How anyone can expect to understand the development of Western Classical music without knowing what happened in 8th Century Mongolia is a mystery to me' : Frank Denyer (quoted from remembering a conversation so not exact words)

Never mind that modern stuff - considering that the plainchant that is the foundation of the Western Classical traditions has its roots in the Music of the earliest Christian (ie Jewish) sects in Palestine, all Western Classical Music originates in the Middle East. (I always thought Kipling was a twerp - lousy, over-sugared cakes, too.)

[MrGongGong]

Never mind that modern stuff - considering that the plainchant that is the foundation of the Western Classical traditions has its roots in the Music of the earliest Christian (ie Jewish) sects in Palestine, all Western Classical Music originates in the Middle East. (I always thought Kipling was a twerp - lousy, over-sugared cakes, too.)

Of course our string instruments came from the horse cultures of Mongolia and neighbouring countries.
There's a climb called Kipling Groove, on Gimmer Crag in Great Langdale. It's called that because it's 'ruddy 'ard'

[Serial_Apologist]

Of course our string instruments came from the horse cultures of Mongolia and neighbouring countries.

Mebbe some of our electroacoustic music too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CnH5Nnm32w

[french frank]

And, of course, magically, the playlist is there.

[doversoul1]

Never mind Kipling, it was a fascinating programme. I can’t remember when I was last glued to the radio (the PC, as I listened to it on iPlayer) like this. The selection of music was wide and well researched (so it sounded to me). The talk about the 15th century Ottoman music treaties housed in Manchester University’s library (?) was most interesting and very well presented, yet there is no information about the speaker or the subject on the website. Still, this is not the fault of the programme which was excellent.

This programme was mainly about vocal music. I would love to hear about instrumental music produced by the same team.

[Serial_Apologist]

Never mind Kipling, it was a fascinating programme. I can’t remember when I was last glued to the radio (the PC, as I listened to it on iPlayer) like this. The selection of music was wide and well researched (so it sounded to me). The talk about the 15th century Ottoman music treaties housed in Manchester University’s library (?) was most interesting and very well presented, yet there is no information about the speaker or the subject on the website. Still, this is not the fault of the programme which was excellent.

This programme was mainly about vocal music. I would love to hear about instrumental music produced by the same team.

Instrumental music "per se" doesn't really come into the "western canon" until the 16th century.

[ardcarp]

SA. I assume that you mean Mss sources specific to instruments are rare until that point. Western art and iconography OTOH is full of identifiable instruments....e.g.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=depiction+of+musical+instruments+in+western+art&biw=1280&bih=587&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=OHfFVJC9FcysU_r9gPgM&ved=0CCAQsAQ#tbm=isch&q=depiction+of+musical+instruments+in+medieval+art&imgdii=_&imgrc=9DohglYz0OhSYM%253A%3BxRk5iKu0dqsgjM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fupload.wikimedia.org%252Fwikipedia%252Fcommons%252Fa%252Faa%252FVielle.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fen.wikipedia.org%252Fwiki%252FMedieval_music%3B156%3B215

[doversoul1]

Instrumental music "per se" doesn't really come into the "western canon" until the 16th century.

Oh, sorry, I didn’t make it clear. , I meant musical instruments. We had a programme on ancient musical instruments but it wasn’t very much about their historical backgrounds.