RTS Lecture by Owen Jones 24/11/13

[aeolium]

This RTS lecture on TV's changing portrayal of the working class was worth seeing, imo:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03jrw5l/Royal_Television_Society_Lecture_Totally_Shameless_How_TV_Portrays_the_Working_Class/

It was on yesterday at 10 pm, BBC Four and still available on iplayer for a few days.

[Serial_Apologist]

This RTS lecture on TV's changing portrayal of the working class was worth seeing, imo:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03jrw5l/Royal_Television_Society_Lecture_Totally_Shameless_How_TV_Portrays_the_Working_Class/

It was on yesterday at 10 pm, BBC Four and still available on iplayer for a few days.

Owen Jones is an excellent fellow who gives me one reason to carry on living. I would have him cloned millions of times over. I watched this, and was amazed at his ability either to memorise the entire speech, crammed with so much insight, or deliver it off the top of his head without a visible prompt, and so persuasively. I just hope those watching were able to take all on board, and might myself have another viewing. I can't remember when such ideas were last put over on any BBC programme, radio or TV. But it would have been nice to have had a q & a session in the Reith lectures tradition at the end, I'm wondering why there wasn't.

[Barbirollians]

He is a voice in the wilderness I am afraid . Millions out there agree with him but have no voice with which to be heard by the BBC and other Oxbridge , middle class dominated media outfits - whose only interest in the working classes is to give them the bread and circuses of the soaps, Strictly and X Factor- rather than tell the truth about their lives .

[aeolium]

As well as the marginalisation of those from the working-class in the broadcasting and publishing media, there is also reduced representation in Parliament (compare the number of MPs from working-class backgrounds in the 1960s with that now), and it is much harder for those from poorer backgrounds to get into Oxbridge and other prominent universities:

http://www.suttontrust.com/news/news/private-school-pupils-55-times/

[Gordon]

He is a voice in the wilderness I am afraid . Millions out there agree with him but have no voice with which to be heard by the BBC and other Oxbridge , middle class dominated media outfits - whose only interest in the working classes is to give them the bread and circuses of the soaps, Strictly and X Factor- rather than tell the truth about their lives .

Thought provoking stuff! Interesting though that the lecture was promoted by the Royal Television Society, surely a bastion of those self same middle class etc etc people [Ooh! aren't we radical putting this Northern bloke up for this!] and in the name of one of the BBC's best ever DGs.

He certainly has left wing credentials [parentage, Oxford precedent perhaps] - however there was that mis-nomer again: "working class" - those denigrated by the TV programmes he was bemoaning were ironically not "working" and were being picked out by programme makers as if they were. Whilst it would be fairer to show real working people getting on with their lives, as many of them do, it seems that audiences are given caricatures instead and just accept it. Ordinary people of any any class aren't sufficiently entertaining though are they?

Are these producers being too clever? Was Shameless [eg] completely over the heads of those people who were supposed to be shamed by their self reflection but were glorified by it instead? Mixed messages?

[Serial_Apologist]

I was reminded by a Channel 4 documentary from 2005 presented by Michael Collins, "The British Working Class", based on his book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Likes-Of-Us-Biography-Working/dp/1862077789

Unfortunately no one seems to have thought to put it on YouTube.

Are these producers being too clever? Was Shameless [eg] completely over the heads of those people who were supposed to be shamed by their self reflection but were glorified by it instead? Mixed messages?

I'm never too worried about who has created or sponsored a programme, just glad that truth and clarity are able to penetrate through the usual fog of mainstream presentations. I think you've answered your own question here, Gordon:

it seems that audiences are given caricatures instead and just accept it.

[aeolium]

He certainly has left wing credentials [parentage, Oxford precedent perhaps] - however there was that mis-nomer again: "working class" - those denigrated by the TV programmes he was bemoaning were ironically not "working" and were being picked out by programme makers as if they were. Whilst it would be fairer to show real working people getting on with their lives, as many of them do, it seems that audiences are given caricatures instead and just accept it. Ordinary people of any any class aren't sufficiently entertaining though are they?

I think Jones did clarify what he meant by "working-class" in the lecture and he included in the definition those who were unemployed. And when it comes to ordinary people of any class not being sufficiently entertaining, I think he presented enough extracts from compelling earlier dramas to show that they could be - or at least that stories of their lives could be presented in an entertaining or interesting way as with Boys from the Blackstuff. Even with caricatures like Alf Garnett (who strangely didn't appear among the extracts last night) his attitudes were presented in a way which didn't demonise - they were ridiculed or ignored by others in the family.

Owen Jones' thesis had been aired earlier this year by a very good erstwhile BBC producer, Tony Garnett:

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/apr/11/tony-garnett-bbc-poor-people

[VodkaDilc]

Owen Jones is an excellent fellow who gives me one reason to carry on living. I would have him cloned millions of times over. I watched this, and was amazed at his ability either to memorise the entire speech, crammed with so much insight, or deliver it off the top of his head without a visible prompt, and so persuasively. I just hope those watching were able to take all on board, and might myself have another viewing. I can't remember when such ideas were last put over on any BBC programme, radio or TV. But it would have been nice to have had a q & a session in the Reith lectures tradition at the end, I'm wondering why there wasn't.

I was sorry to miss this. Owen Jones is always a pleasure to read or watch. His Chavs book should be read by everyone with a hand in the world of politics. I love seeing him in discussions with so-called political heavyweights on television; his comparative youth and slight build might suggest he's going to be mangled by the more experienced figure. Then he begins to speak - and makes mincemeat of them.

I wonder where he might be headed in the future!

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

many thanks for pointing out this truly excellent lecture

[Serial_Apologist]

I was sorry to miss this. Owen Jones is always a pleasure to read or watch. His Chavs book should be read by everyone with a hand in the world of politics. I love seeing him in discussions with so-called political heavyweights on television; his comparative youth and slight build might suggest he's going to be mangled by the more experienced figure. Then he begins to speak - and makes mincemeat of them.

I wonder where he might be headed in the future!

It's not too late, VD - you can still watch it by clicking on the link in Message 1.

[VodkaDilc]

It's not too late, VD - you can still watch it by clicking on the link in Message 1.

Ooh!! All this i-player stuff! I'm not sure! Perhaps there will be a repeat sometime.