Parade's End

[Serial_Apologist]

I confess that I'd been put off even approaching FMF by the advocacy of Anthony Burgess in the 1970s, knowing what a bloody minded show-off Burgess could be at times. My stupid loss

Imagine if Anthony Burgess had ever met up with Shirley McLean...

[Serial_Apologist]

I assume that the English spelling of Ford's father's name, Hueffer, is in fact Hüffer in the German. Why then do all the bods on the Culture Show who pronounce it, pronounce it as Hooffer?

Maybe because Hoofer sounds aloofer?

[amateur51]

Imagine if Anthony Burgess had ever met up with Shirley McLean...

Or what if he met up with Arthur Scargill in a high wind - velcro is invented!!

[Pianorak]

I assume that the English spelling of Ford's father's name, Hueffer, is in fact Hüffer in the German. Why then do all the bods on the Culture Show who pronounce it, pronounce it as Hooffer?

Probably because the Culture Show bods are English and not Welsh.

[johnb]

Ford Madox Ford has been one of those names I've always seen from time to time on the spine of books slumbering in dusty corners of libraries, etc. The name as always intrigued me, but not enough to pick up any of the books.

However, the TV dramatisation has prompted me to buy Parade's End and I'm currently near the end of the first book of the tretrology. I am so grateful to the BBC for leading me to discover FMF.

I am not watching the TV version because I feel that it will colour my approach to the books, but I am recording the episodes so I can watch them later.

Christopher Tietjens and MacMaster come over as rather tedious characters but following Tietjens return to London suffering from shell shock I became deeply engrossed in the novel and am finding it very moving.

So - stop watching the TV and start reading the book!

[jean]

I assume that the English spelling of Ford's father's name, Hueffer, is in fact Hüffer in the German. Why then do all the bods on the Culture Show who pronounce it, pronounce it as Hooffer?

It's because very few English people can pronounce German ü - or French u, for that matter.

It's probably because it is a sound that doesn't exist in English, and many people can't actually hear the difference - just as we can't hear the difference between the several German e sounds.

I have spent fruitless hours trying to get choirs singing in German to see the error of their ways - but however carefully you demonstrate, there are always some who never get it.

[amateur51]

It's because very few English people can pronounce German ü - or French u, for that matter.

It's probably because it is a sound that doesn't exist in English, and many people can't actually hear the difference - just as we can't hear the difference between the several German e sounds.

I have spent fruitless hours trying to get choirs singing in German to see the error of their ways - but however carefully you demonstrate, there are always some who never get it.

We must not capitulate to their h'iggerance, innit jean

[Nick Armstrong]

I have an outward and return journey of some 6 hours each to my week in France coming up so what better solution can there be to this act of folly on my part

That sounds perfect! I read best on journeys....

When are you orff??

[vinteuil]

It's because very few English people can pronounce German ü.

... yeah but - no but - yeah but - no but....

When the German Herr Hüffer became the English Mr Hueffer, quite rightly the surname acquired an English pronunciation. "Hooffer" isn't bad - in America he probably wd've become Hoover*...

*... and yes, I know the Hoovers were originally Hubers....

[gurnemanz]

Maybe because Hoofer sounds aloofer?

A double consonant in German usually indicates a short preceding vowel sound. The umlaut makes it a front vowel so it would come out sounding more like "Hiffer" than "Hoofer". However, having Anglicised the spelling, they probably also Anglicised the pronunciation.

[amateur51]

... yeah but - no but - yeah but - no but....

When the German Herr Hüffer became the English Mr Hueffer, quite rightly the surname acquired an English pronunciation. "Hooffer" isn't bad - in America he probably wd've become Hoover*...

*... and yes, I know the Hoovers were originally Hubers....

"quite rightly"? - quite predictably, certainly

[vinteuil]

... of course a Hoofer going to America might change his name more radically -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Astaire

[french frank]

Nowadays I usually try to file authors chronologically rather than alphabetically...

I've tried that - doesn't work for me. If you go by DoB you have to remember all their DoBs and sometimes I can be out in my estimates by quite a lot. And with medieval writers you may only have an approximation. Alphabetical arrangement under usual form of name wins (as Chrétien de Troyes under C).

Anyone who's ever forgotten their 'memorable information' will know that straightforward is best.

having Anglicised the spelling, they probably also Anglicised the pronunciation

As Goetz > Getz, Loesser > Lesser?

[Serial_Apologist]

It's because very few English people can pronounce German ü - or French u, for that matter.

It's probably because it is a sound that doesn't exist in English

Well it of course does in Scottish accents, and distinguishes the pronunciation of a word like "school" as "skiule" with an unlaut over the "u" in many parts of Lancashire from Yorkshire - "skoowell". And I've noticed that umlaut u creeping into Home Counties upper middle class speech over the past 20-30 years as well - "yiew" or even "yee" for "you" now being widespread. It certainly wasn't there when I underwent elocution at a public school in the late 50s, where "yooo" with very little "i" was strongly insisted on, and in that instance probably started out as an affectation, or imitation of cutsie little girlie speak among those lofty echelons.

[vinteuil]

I've tried that - doesn't work for me. If you go by DoB you have to remember all their DoBs . .

... I agree that it can (initially) be a bit of an effort. My Eng Lit section has been chronological since 1995; my Foreign Lit sections are still alphabetical.
But I have found that effort to be worthwhile: the books 'make more sense' on the shelves - and it can be really instructive to see who are near-contemporaries.