"Great Expectations" (BBC1, 2011)

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Do you mean Alison Graham? I think she's rather good, and I agree with her most of the time.

Cue the usual remarks......

I couldn't possibly comment. However, I'm a little disappointed that such an unpleasant and vitriolic square-eyed journalist is given so much credence by the RT editor.

[mercia]

blacksmiths forge depicted on tv or film

on the subject of the forge can those of you who have read GE tell me where the forge is situated 'cos it's always struck me as odd, in the adaptations, for it to be in the middle of nowhere .... who exactly are they forging for? ............. there's nobody about

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

on the subject of the forge can those of you who have read GE tell me where the forge is situated 'cos it's always struck me as odd, in the adaptations, for it to be in the middle of nowhere .... who exactly are they forging for? ............. there's nobody about

That's an interesting observation, mercia. Obviously Pip's first meeting with Magwitch would have taken place away from habitation, but I've skimmed through the opening chapters and the best reference seems to be:
"Show us where you live," said the man. "Pint (sic) out the place!"
"I pointed to where our village lay, on the flat in-shore among the alder trees and pollards, a mile or more from the church."
...and later...
"Joe's forge adjoined our house, which was a wooden house, as many of the dwellings of our country were - most of them, at that time."

So you appear to be right.

[DracoM]

Adaptation's fault. Book's crystal clear details sacrificed for pretty pictures. There's a VILLAGE in the book, notice BBC team?
Did you see a village in that GE adaptation? No, neither did I.
You quote a perfectly usable bit of chat from the book, but it has to be cut because the 'adaptation' doesn't require a 'village'.
So Young Pip has walked a mile in vile weather to the churchyard to visit his dead parents and siblings. In itself a very telling detail from which to start the story of PIP's life as an orphan.

[antongould]

Finished this last night having, due to family commitments, watched the first "episode" live and then followed behind these very interesting discussions. I read my Dickens, OMG, 40 years ago and found GE one of my least favourites. Lady Gould had it as her O level book and therefore considers herself something of a world authority and Princesses Natasha and Krystal have, much to my and society's shame, never read any Dickens at all.
I enjoyed it and thought Gillian Anderson was mesmerising, Winstone superb and the boy Booth(?) on a hiding to nothing as IMHO Pip past 11 or whatever is somewhat of a wimp. Lady Gould lamented the loss of the characters and the humour already referred to above.
But what may be of interest is that the girls absolutely loved it - no iPhone tinkering no PC shopping whilst they gave it half their and eyes and half their ears - they watched every second. They intend in the new year to move on to the recent and again IMHO very accomplished Bleak House.
As to whether they will be motivated to read any Dickens - possibly not.
Would a longer, more faithful, adaptation possibly without "the stars" have appealed so much or even been big enough to attract their often limited attention - I don't know, after all they are only my daughters!

[MrGongGong]

Adaptation's fault. Book's crystal clear details sacrificed for pretty pictures. There's a VILLAGE in the book, notice BBC team?
Did you see a village in that GE adaptation? No, neither did I.
You quote a perfectly usable bit of chat from the book, but it has to be cut because the 'adaptation' doesn't require a 'village'.
So Young Pip has walked a mile in vile weather to the churchyard to visit his dead parents and siblings. In itself a very telling detail from which to start the story of PIP's life as an orphan.

I really fail to understand this sort of pedantry

It's TV FFS

IF you want it to be exactly like the book in your head then READ THE BOOK
personally i'm not a great Dickens enthusiast but did enjoy this ADAPTATION (the CLUE is in the words !!!)
great photography and casting IMV

come on Draco at least it didn't have GIRLS singing on the soundtrack !!!!

[aeolium]

personally i'm not a great Dickens enthusiast but did enjoy this ADAPTATION (the CLUE is in the words !!!)

An adaptation ought to retain essential qualities of the original whatever modifications are applied, and the lack of almost any of Dickens' language and his humour made this production an entirely reworked version which used the shell of the Dickens story. That, to me, is just the adapter exploiting the Dickens name to create something loosely based on the original, yet still pretending it is a reasonably faithful adaptation. If you are going to do that, then it would be better if you were to go the whole hog and make up your own story. That it is TV is neither here nor there.

I don't mind adaptations which obviously make no pretence at any kind of fidelity to the original but use it as a springboard for something new, like the modernised Sherlock version (or, going back, I Claudius, which imo was an inspired improvement on a couple of dullish books by Robert Graves).

Still, it's interesting that quite a number of those who admire this production are either those who dislike Dickens' work or have never read it - perhaps that is the intended audience.

[MrGongGong]

That it is TV is neither here nor there.

.

Actually that is the point
I don't watch a lot of TV but I know enough not to conflate TV with Theatre or Literature
Whenever there is anything on TV that is about something one knows about then one will sit watching with a continuous stream of "NO NO , it's not like that" in ones head. Which is not to say that Television is ALL rubbish but that it is always about what makes good television ......... one of my nephews is studying Physics at University and knows shed loads about quantum mechanics etc BUT can't stand watching Brian Cox's programmes as they seem to miss out essential information. Same with the reaction to the Symphony series etc

It's TV
Dickens didn't make Television programmes he wrote BOOKS (intended to be read aloud !)

[DracoM]

But that tosh about Drummle and Pip doing the brothel and chirupping about Pip's virginity......where the hell did all that come from in the book?? Pip LOATHED Drummle. i.e. the scene was included why? Incidentally, in the BOOK, Drummle is a tiny, tiny character useful for Dickens to sketch in the sulky, sullen cruelty and chilly heart of the London idle rich but the whole point of it is that Estella deliberately throws herself away on him. HE, per se, does not feature. Joe's character was eviscerated, Jaggers turned into a silly caricature retrieved by Suchet doing what Suchet does - i.e. a breeze for him and a very easy pay day, BUT Jaggers/Wemmick's impacts on Pip are huge, mentoring and not peripheral as in the TV. Molly is not Jaggers's mistress. Dickens makes that clear, the TV version made it very clear that she was. Why? Miss Havisham is vivid, but nothing like as central to the BOOK, and Satis House is GONE by the time Estella and Pip meet for the last time, by which time Pip has ALREADY been abroad working for some time. Did we get any of that at all? No.

That is NOT pedantry: it is pointing out several crucial milestones / relationships in the BOOK that the TV version made pretty well no attempt at all to even suggest let alone include.

My real fear is that kids studying maybe a Dickens novel for exams [ Ha!!] will get the DVD of this appalling version and then wonder why their teachers tell them to forget it. And if Douglas Booth ever works again in any TV context except ads I shall be surprised and disappointed.

[amateur51]

Adaptation's fault. Book's crystal clear details sacrificed for pretty pictures. There's a VILLAGE in the book, notice BBC team?
Did you see a village in that GE adaptation? No, neither did I.
You quote a perfectly usable bit of chat from the book, but it has to be cut because the 'adaptation' doesn't require a 'village'.
So Young Pip has walked a mile in vile weather to the churchyard to visit his dead parents and siblings. In itself a very telling detail from which to start the story of PIP's life as an orphan.

How's your blood pressure, DracoM?

Last time I looked it was not compulsory to watch this series - give yourself (and possibly others) a break, why don't you?!

[DracoM]

What DOES upset, is that in the Bleak House series we saw what BBC and TV can do and do pretty damn well. This GE was absolutely at the other end of the spectrum and I just felt terribly sad that this was the way the Beeb had decided to start their Dickens 200 thing.

And in response to amateur 51's so polite message, I watched because I really hoped it would get better. It didn't.

[french frank]

It's TV FFS

I'd think that was intended to explain it all (for better or worse) if it hadn't been for the reference to pedantry .

The comments come, the comments go. I don't feel the smallest urge to exercise my right to watch it on iPlayer. I'd sooner read the book again.

I don't think that criticism should be confused with pedantry.

[Anna]

What DOES upset, is that in the Bleak House series we saw what BBC and TV can do and do pretty damn well. This GE was absolutely at the other end of the spectrum

Bleak House was done by Andrew Davies (who has a long list of credits and awards) and totalled 8 hours of viewing. GE was done by a scriptwriter of Holby and East Enders with only one adaptation of a Classic to her name, which was Oliver Twist 3 years ago (the one with Timothy Spall as Fagin) Bleak House also, according to wiki, had a budget of £8m. Perhaps paring the book down to a shell was to do with budget cuts? Or were they aiming for the Soaps audience?

I've spoken to two people today who watched but have never read the book. They thought it was alright as a costume drama but both said older Pip was so impossibly beautiful it was difficult to take their eyes off him but he was terribly wooden as an actor, also that they found it difficult to engage or care about any of the characters apart from young Pip.

[Persephone]

Well I thought it was mis-cast, mis-interpreted and mis-leading and was subsequently disappointed by the adaptation. I studied this book many years ago and loved it. I shall now re-read it- and although I can appreciate that another person's interpretation is valid- I did feel that the central character lacked a core authinticity.

[eighthobstruction]

#1 -#104....This is exactly the way I thought it would go; from what I read in the RT and seeing it was only 3 episodes....REALLY glad I did not watch it [I have it recorded on my digi box....but will delete it unwatched]....NO DOUBT it will be up for awards, and vaunted as a success by Beeb....

....a very good reason to read it yet again....