"Great Expectations" (BBC1, 2011)

[vinteuil]

I suspect they cast a pretty-boy Pip with an eye on the overseas market.

... yes, that's quite likely. But then - given the budget they've got - why did they not cast a pretty-girl Estella to match? This one is hardly up to the standard of what we've become used to! (And I detect no chemistry at all between them. But the pretty-boy is probably too much in love with himself... )

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

And I detect no chemistry at all between them.

Really? Not even the moment in the lake when Pip slowly reached out to touch Estella's cheek, and her reaction? (A superbly-acted mixture of terror and desire, I thought - more effective and affecting than the kiss that followed.) Electricity if not "chemistry" at least?

[vinteuil]

Yes! Traddles was the lad at DC's school who drew skeletons in the margins of his exercise books?

... the very same. "I used to wonder at first what comfort Traddles found in drawing skeletons; and for some time looked upon him as a sort of hermit, who reminded himself by those symbols of mortality that caning couldn't last for ever. But I believe he only did it because they were easy, and didn't want any features."

[Anna]

Anna - my main complaint is that, regardless of how faithful it may or may not be to the content and spirit of the original, this adaptation just seems to drift along aimlessly. Very little seems to happen, and there seems to be little or no motivation for what does. Structurally, it's less substantial than one of CD's 'London particulars'.

Unsubstantial drift is right. There is no complexity, no interweaving and worse, no humour, it's somehow very wooden. And Estella is far too plain. I think, for me, it's been a disappointment but I suspect that's because I have very recently read the book, which is often not a good idea as it's too fresh in my mind.

[DracoM]

This BBC version is all about making pretty pictures.

Camera lingers for ever on set piece pictures eg Satis House, obsessive quirky camera angles, and lost in the finicky attitude to lighting. No 'particular'?

The NARRATION which in the original is already strong accelerates neurotically as soon as Magwitch reappears.
The marsh scenes are still the best cinematically.
Herbert Pocket is good, but how on earth he ever found this Pip a fine companion beats me.

As many seem to agree, seasonal fowl or what.

[Anna]

... And I detect no chemistry at all between them.

I thought there was more sexual chemistry and tension between Herbert and Pip when Herbert was teaching Pip to dance than between Estella and Pip in the lake!

[DracoM]

Could not agree more, Anna. Of course, Victorian friendships were often very close, expressive both verbally and physically both between man/man and woman/ woman.

I am still reeling from the number of important character details that have been simply excised. Miss Havisham is important, but does the presence of La Anderson in terms of global / US market appeal not have the effect of foregrounding Satis etc far more than it has in the book? The decay is spectacular and visually exciting in an age of luxury and endless houses on TV series, and I can see that for any TV unit it would be a must, but NARRATIVELY how important is she except in the training of Estella? Yes, she is an example of the LOSS of great expectations, but you can feel that the prominence in this TV version is largely due to reasons other than narrative ones.

Wemmick's Walworth castle / Aged P plays a huge role in civilising Pip, of giving him an insight into love in action utterly different to what he saw on the marshes, but so far we have seen nothing of it. Jaggers is far more complex and important than the Poirot-noir re-hash we are getting from Suchet, and the Molly stuff might be better sketched in.

Downton Abbey shows the importance of detail, and this GE version shows what happens when other pre-occupations get in the way of simply story telling. OK, we still have the Satis House fire to come, stuff on the river, Death of Magwitch etc - all VERY soapy visuals that i bet the team salivated to convey, but for me that will not retrieve the superficiality and meretriciousness of this BBC version. Huge disappointment.

[amateur51]

I thought there was more sexual chemistry and tension between Herbert and Pip when Herbert was teaching Pip to dance than between Estella and Pip in the lake!

Apparently, when Alec Guinness (who plays Herbert Pocket in the David Lean film) was arrested in a gents' public lavatory he had the foresight & wit to give his name as "Herbert Pocket" and thus escaped the flinty majesty of the law.

John Gielgud grasped the principle but not the whole principle unfortunately for later when he too was arrested under similar circumstances, he altered his first name but not his family name - "Fred Gielgud" perhaps?

[Nick Armstrong]

I'd heard the Guinness story from my own Agèd P... but not the Geilgud sequel!!!

[Anna]

Draco, The BBC make huge sales of programmes and dvd overseas. BBC Worldwide says the top five selling programme titles in the year to the end of March 2011 were the fifth series of Doctor Who, the debut series of Sherlock, the 15th and 16th series of Top Gear, and Human Planet. So, if Gillian Anderson is very bankable at the box office and Douglas Booth is very pretty (I think he's a bit of a gay icon as well) then those factors are going to boost sales, as will beautifully filmed interiors and atmospheric marshes. So, keeping the story simple and not introducing the more eccentric characters such as Aged Parent ensures a simplified, an easy to understand story in whichever country it's watched. It's been adapted by Sarah Phelps who writes Holby and East Enders, I wonder if that's why you said soapy visuals?

[DracoM]

Well, interestingly, just now the CA on R4 previewing the GE tx tonight listed stars as FIRST Gillian Anderson, before D.Booth. Tells you quite a lot. Miss Havisham listed FIRST?? Crumbs.

As you say, it just feels like a huge amount has been spent on setting / 'the look' of the thing. La Anderson's fee etc, and the story as such has been severely chopped.

Terrific difference between that and the rather good R4 'Tale of Two Cities', which has taken 5 x 45 minutes all this week and finishes tomorrow. Almost 4 hrs as against TV's 3 hrs on a notably more complex book.

[PatrickOD]

I'm indebted to everyone for continuing to watch - saves me the bother! I got the distinct impression from the short bit I did watch that the whole purpose of the first (shrunken) part of the story was to prepare us for the vision of Miss Havisham - the real star! From what has been said by those of you much more au fait with production values and showbiz politics than I, I feel that my initial impressions were not too far off the mark. A pity really. Perhaps they should have 'adapted' the Lean film rather than the novel, and you could have discussed topics like 'wardrobe', 'costume drama' and 'film angles' instead of 'Dickens'. I can't help recalling Marty Feldman's joke about 'Grate Expectations by Charles Dickens - with 2ks.' But I'm going off topic. Back to the book.

I caught a headline in passing from the Telegraph - very complimentary to the programme. And the Radio Times writes of a magnificent adaptation. Where did we all go wrong?

Oh dear! I got Grate Expectations wrong. It should have been........
Off topic, but have a look anyway.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=PPouuA0KMO4

[Anna]

I'm indebted to everyone for continuing to watch - saves me the bother!

Patrick, as I said upthread, the BBC has to think of worldwide sales, not just domestic consumption, therefore if Gillian Anderson is box office and Great Expectations is really a story about Miss Havisham, not Pip, well ..... us Purists can always read the book instead whilst overseas sales mean our licence fee won't go up?

I'll be watching the last episode tonight, I want to see what ending it is, the BBC said it's somewhere between the original and the revised. Pip may expire in the fire, or he may be horribly disfigured and turn to religion, become a Preacher and rescue Estella who has become a Fallen Woman in a brothel in Cheapside who is being pimped by Jaggers. Or Pip and Herbert may declare their love for each other. Who can tell?

On January 10th the BBC give us Edwin Drood. This is a book unknown to me so I'm looking forward to it because I have no prior knowledge.

[french frank]

he altered his first name but not his family name - "Fred Gielgud" perhaps?

I think he said his name was 'Arthur Gielgud'. I heard both the Guinness and Gielgud stories from the waspish gossip Sheridan Morley and consequently disbelieved them both (Guinness and Gielgud both being dead by that time)

[Nick Armstrong]

Well, interestingly, just now the CA on R4 previewing the GE tx tonight listed stars as FIRST Gillian Anderson, before D.Booth. Tells you quite a lot. Miss Havisham listed FIRST?? Crumbs.

As you say, it just feels like a huge amount has been spent on setting / 'the look' of the thing. La Anderson's fee etc, and the story as such has been severely chopped.

Terrific difference between that and the rather good R4 'Tale of Two Cities', which has taken 5 x 45 minutes all this week and finishes tomorrow. Almost 4 hrs as against TV's 3 hrs on a notably more complex book.

The BBC "Little Dorrit" has been running again (unannounced) on BBC HD - 14 x largely 30-minute episodes, last one 60-minutes... so 7+ hours to tell that story. Meticulous and spirited: the scene where Pancks (the sublime Eddie Marsan) swaggers drunk into Bleeding Heart Yard to announce the good news about the Dorrits is just wonderful!