War and Peace BBC1

[Richard Tarleton]

Halfway through and with episode 3 this adaptation really got into its stride. It probably helped that I switched the subtitles on as previous episodes have been afflicted by 'actor's mumble'.

Yes Andrew Davies managed to compress Pierre's intro to Freemasonry, and Denisov's mazurka demo (lengthy episodes both in the book), into the space of a couple of minutes each, a masterclass in the adaptor's art On the vocal side, Natasha seems to have developed a sort of husky lithp whenever she talks of love.....

[Historian]

You are right to be sceptical about wearing full dress all the time, I think. Most of the officers we see in 'War and Peace' would have been relatively well-off (or at least notionally so in Nikolai Rostov's case) so may have been happy to parade in their finery. However, it would have been more usual to wear some form of undress uniform, or even civilian clothes. Of course, attendance at court would have been a different matter. Prince Andrei was wearing a 'gala uniform' at last night's ball which showed why Guards' officers needed to have a decent private income.

Your point is also valid about officers in other adaptations, for example the naval officers you mention. Furthermore, I felt that the troops shown on campaign would have been covered up more in order to preserve their uniforms e.g. shako covers. While we're on the subject of uniforms, the Russian troops were shown wearing the 'khiver' shakos which are fine for the forthcoming 1812 scenes, but anachronistic for the Austerlitz Campaign of 1805.

I realise that the above may read as if I am the history equivalent of a train-spotter, but in mitigation Mercia did ask.

[mercia]

thanks for the reply historian. I think some train-spotters have been watching Dickensian - apparently Martha Cratchitt couldn't have married to Mendelssohn's Wedding March and Miss Havisham's breed of dog didn't exist until the 1920's, according to online comments.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

- apparently Martha Cratchitt couldn't have married to Mendelssohn's Wedding March

She didn't - it was Wagner's from Lohengrin: written in 1850, and not used in churches until after one of Queen Victoria's daughter's (the mother of Kaiser Bill) weddings eight years later. (Which means that in Dickensian, the events of Dickens' A Christmas Carol must have occured in 1865 at the earliest: eighteen years after it was first published.)

The only train-spotting I've ever done is on Leeds Station, Platform 9 wondering where the blazes the 10:47 to London has got to!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

And then spotting it leaving from Platform 11

[mercia]

She didn't - it was Wagner's from Lohengrin!

oops, I misread the original comment, not having seen the episode myself

[DublinJimbo]

Halfway through and with episode 3 this adaptation really got into its stride. It probably helped that I switched the subtitles on as previous episodes have been afflicted by 'actor's mumble'. For all the spectacular visual quality of the great battle scenes I have to say I prefer the more intimate moments and this central episode did not disappoint. I still don't care much for Jim Broadbent or Adrian Edmondson in their particular roles as they remain under-characterised but both Pierre and Andrei are really making there mark. Great stuff from Paul Dano and James Norton.

Yes Andrew Davies managed to compress Pierre's intro to Freemasonry, and Denisov's mazurka demo (lengthy episodes both in the book), into the space of a couple of minutes each, a masterclass in the adaptor's art On the vocal side, Natasha seems to have developed a sort of husky lithp whenever she talks of love.....

Yes indeed, Episode 3 was truly wonderful. The scenes between Andrei and Pierre were especially affecting.

[Ferretfancy]

You are right to be sceptical about wearing full dress all the time, I think. Most of the officers we see in 'War and Peace' would have been relatively well-off (or at least notionally so in Nikolai Rostov's case) so may have been happy to parade in their finery. However, it would have been more usual to wear some form of undress uniform, or even civilian clothes. Of course, attendance at court would have been a different matter. Prince Andrei was wearing a 'gala uniform' at last night's ball which showed why Guards' officers needed to have a decent private income.

Your point is also valid about officers in other adaptations, for example the naval officers you mention. Furthermore, I felt that the troops shown on campaign would have been covered up more in order to preserve their uniforms e.g. shako covers. While we're on the subject of uniforms, the Russian troops were shown wearing the 'khiver' shakos which are fine for the forthcoming 1812 scenes, but anachronistic for the Austerlitz Campaign of 1805.

I realise that the above may read as if I am the history equivalent of a train-spotter, but in mitigation Mercia did ask.

I wonder, did the officers ever get their uniforms cleaned, and if so, how? Perhaps they just wore them until they stank and then discarded them.

Even in the twentieth century we began to forget what things were like before the arrival of easy care fabrics and washing machines. I remember what an ordeal it could be travelling on a London tram in the 1940s, especially on a Thursday, the day before bath night. Leisure wear really didn't exist and most working people wore the same clothes every day.

[johncorrigan]

Yes indeed, Episode 3 was truly wonderful. The scenes between Andrei and Pierre were especially affecting.

There was a great image about 10 minutes in walking over a bridge. And then the image where he asks Pierre if he'll come and meet his son...they're standing on top of a snowy hill...very beautiful.

[Historian]

I wonder, did the officers ever get their uniforms cleaned, and if so, how? Perhaps they just wore them until they stank and then discarded them.

Many 'historical' dramas show people and their clothing as much too clean. It's also a good job that we can't smell people from history, although I suppose if it was all around you at the time then you were more used to it, unlike today's de-odourised atmosphere.

I assume that your question was about soldiers on campaign. Senior officers would have had servants, especially if they were members of the nobility. So, these servants would have done their best to keep the officer and his uniform as clean as possible. However, the rigours of a long campaign would play havoc with everyone's uniforms, so many officers would have worn a cheaper, more robust version of their uniform when in the field (for example Wellington wore a blue frock coat and overall trousers during the Waterloo campaign). Full dress uniform was saved for peacetime, parades and, sometimes, the day of battle. Junior officers would have a 'batman' to look after them (to some extent) but their uniform would suffer during a campaign. Colours would fade, British scarlet becoming a dull brick-red for example. Plumes would droop and moult, powder and other stains would be visible. There were exceptions. One British captain in the Peninsular War spent so much on his uniform that when he was captured the French thought he was a general.

[pastoralguy]

And the characters always have perfect teeth!

[jean]

Not Silas Wegg in Dickensian!

[Anna]

And the characters always have perfect teeth!

According to the Daily Express it's not the teeth viewers are watching! They report that the series has been renamed Phwoar & Peace and that nude images of actress Tuppence Middleton in the hit BBC adaptation of Tolstoy’s War and Peace certainly set the pulses of Middle England racing on Sunday night.!! (only Middle England?)

[Richard Tarleton]

The wolf hunt...the sleigh ride...a couple of my favourite moments from the book last night. The pack of borzois were having a marvellous time - I googled "war and peace borzois" and found this item on the Daily Mail website:

SOPPY HOUNDS

One of the book’s more dramatic chapters is the big wolf hunt, in which the Rostov family use dozens of borzoi dogs to stalk their prey. Of course today they don’t hunt wolves with borzois, so the team tracked down all the pet borzois in Lithuania and roped them in as extras.

‘They were lovely dogs, all being pampered by their different owners,’ says Andrew Davies. ’The director Tom Harper was saying, “Get them organised into gangs,” because they had to run after this wolf, which wasn’t actually there. They just had to run down the hill and think, “Oh, yes, let’s get into a gang with some other dogs.”

'So they all ran down the hill and it was great. Then at the bottom of the hill, they were like, “Now what? I’m lost, where’s my mum?” They got all confused, so they had to be reunited with their owners and comforted. They were really soppy dogs. Then they had to do it all again for the next take.’

Mention of borzois always makes me think of one of my favourite Saki short stories, Cousin Teresa - where our hero dreams up a music hall turn based on the couplet

Cousin Teresa takes out Cæsar,
Fido, Jock, and the big borzoi.

A lifting, catchy sort of refrain, you see, and big-drum business on the two syllables of bor-zoi.

[Anna]

I really enjoyed last night's episode - the sleigh ride, the wolf hunt - full of symbolism of course when Natasha gazed at the wolf, her dancing with abandon and then the rather vulpine Anatole wanting to have his wicked way with her. O Foolish Girl we cried!