Coronation Chicken

[vinteuil]

I deliberately omitted the word 'alone' because I didn't understand him to have said 'alone' - since he didn't say it. Two people in the same room sitting 'en repos' would have been quite acceptable, I think

... interesting, isn't it? - that English translations make explicit the 'alone'. But the context shows that Pascal is thinking of a single man -

"Quand je m’y suis mis quelquefois, à considérer les diverses agitations des hommes et les périls et les peines où ils s’exposent, dans la cour, dans la guerre, d’où naissent tant de querelles, de passions, d’entreprises hardies et souvent mauvaises, etc., j’ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d’une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos, dans une chambre. Un homme qui a assez de bien pour vivre, s’il savait demeurer chez soi avec plaisir, n’en sortirait pas pour aller sur la mer ou au siège d’une place. On n’achètera une charge à l’armée si cher, que parce qu’on trouverait insupportable de ne bouger de la ville ; et on ne recherche les conversations et les divertissements des jeux que parce qu’on ne peut demeurer chez soi avec plaisir."

And French commentators certainly read this as 'a man alone' -

"Dans les Pensées, Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) part d’un constat : le malheur de l’homme vient de son impossibilité à rester seul et en repos.
Mais si le confinement est le remède à tous nos malheurs, comment expliquer que les gens ne savent pas rester en repos ? Qu’est-ce qui explique l’angoisse extrême de devoir rester chez soi ? La réponse se trouve, pour le philosophe français, dans la peur qui nous habite tous et qui n’est autre que la conscience de notre finitude. Nous sommes des êtres fragiles, nous mourrons tous, un jour ou l’autre, et cela nous pousse dans un paradoxe où l’on fuit sans arrêt la seule situation qui nous mettrait, pourtant, en sécurité, à savoir la solitude, dans notre chambre. Le repos, qui nous éloigne du danger, n’est qu’une première étape vers le repos éternel qui arrivera inéluctablement, et qui nous terrifie." [la pause philo]

[muzzer]

Isn’t there massive irony in the fact that we are enduring an age of rampant populism, and yet the monarchy seems unable to benefit from it? I struggle to see anything intelligent in public disocurse at all these days. Britain is an absolute disgrace. If I could afford to emigrate, I hope I’d have the guts to do so.

[french frank]

... interesting, isn't it? - that English translations make explicit the 'alone'. But the context shows that Pascal is thinking of a single man -

Yes! The point surely being that in one sense everyone is 'alone', even if there are others present. But adding the word to the translation does make it explicit that the man [sic] must be physically on his own. But not so, I think.

Have just thought to check Bartlett and the Oxfd Book of Quotations, both of which give the French with an English translation. Neither has the word 'alone', though 'demeurer en repos' is translated at 'sit still' or 'at ease'. It is stillness and quiet which are key.

[oddoneout]

Yes! The point surely being that in one sense everyone is 'alone', even if there are others present. But adding the word to the translation does make it explicit that the man [sic] must be physically on his own. But not so, I think.

Have just thought to check Bartlett and the Oxfd Book of Quotations, both of which give the French with an English translation. Neither has the word 'alone', though 'demeurer en repos' is translated at 'sit still' or 'at ease'. It is stillness and quiet which are key.

Indeed. Plenty of people sit(alone or otherwise) in a room but are winding themselves and others up, via the internet, into a volatile state that has no acceptable or suitable outlet. The blurring of reality and virtual, and the inability to differentiate between the two, compounds the problem.

[eighthobstruction]

Indeed. Plenty of people sit(alone or otherwise) in a room but are winding themselves and others up, via the internet, into a volatile state that has no acceptable or suitable outlet. The blurring of reality and virtual, and the inability to differentiate between the two, compounds the problem.

[teamsaint]

Isn’t there massive irony in the fact that we are enduring an age of rampant populism, and yet the monarchy seems unable to benefit from it? I struggle to see anything intelligent in public disocurse at all these days. Britain is an absolute disgrace. If I could afford to emigrate, I hope I’d have the guts to do so.

Is this really an age of rampant populism, more than any other ? The opinion polls , fwiw, suggest otherwise , given the big Labour lead.

Britain has many serious problems to be sure , but it is far from alone in that, and that includes Western Europe .
I agree with you about the general state of public discourse , I think.

[eighthobstruction]

Isn’t there massive irony in the fact that we are enduring an age of rampant populism, and yet the monarchy seems unable to benefit from it? I struggle to see anything intelligent in public disocurse at all these days. Britain is an absolute disgrace. If I could afford to emigrate, I hope I’d have the guts to do so.

....but where would you go muzzer....I take your point, and myself would love an Atlantic facing lonely cottage, near both beach and cliffs on coast [obviously ] of Ireland....I might like enough money not to need to give a toss about politics/populism/media....I do see much [not from me I might add] that is intelligent in public discourse in an era when the nature of this country is changing as things do change ....it is a time [for me] of high cognitive dissonance - cultural relativism -expedience - intangibles....and I'd probably be taking all that to my eutopia....Where I live now folk are diffident just needing to put bread on table and haven't got much to say (who knows what they know)....The Worded Classes are doing what they have always done (since vote and education Acts) they are at odds with the morals (+ and-) of the Elites, Landed/Moneyed, the corrupted/ over indulgent....there are differences/changes but in all 'things' are pretty much the same....some have more intelligent things to say that others

[eighthobstruction]

....

[muzzer]

Whilst trying to correct typos in my post I’ve managed to delete it. I feel that’s rather 2023.

[kernelbogey]

Whilst trying to correct typos in my post I’ve managed to delete it. I feel that’s rather 2023.

Time to issue a statement saying you are sorry if anyone felt upset at what you had written....

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Let’s be clear. We shouldn’t be discussing partisan politics here at all. That can be done (with care) in Ideas and Theory - nowhere else. Introducing it under other threads risks closure.
Please remember this before posting.

[smittims]

Humpf.. well, all I can say is that, having looked forward to this Coronation for years, the more I read about it the less I want to see of it.

[french frank]

I've just completed a YouGov survey. On media coverage of the coronation, 29% thought there had been too much, 8% too little, 45% about the right amount, 18% (including me ) said they didn't know.

On whether the government (i.e. taxpayer) should fund the coronation 51% said it shouldn't (which I should have said but wasn't asked), 32% said it should, 18% don't know. But I wouldn't mind the government funding a much more modest, low-key affair - just the minimum to get the business over and done with. I think it's very wasteful but then I think most people are very wasteful compared with me .

On how likely people were to participate in or watch the coronation, 46% were either very or fairly likely (19:27), 20% were not very likely and 28% were not at all likely (I would have been one of the 28% but only because I hate any sort of pomp and circumstance (whatever that is) even if it was celebrating our first elected president.

On how much people care about the coronation 33% said a great deal or a fair amount (9:24), 35% not very much, 29% not at all. Personally I find it a rather odd question: I don't care about the coronation in the same way that I don't care about the Royal Family. Not relevant to my life but I wish them no harm.

[gurnemanz]

I remember enjoying the Royal Tournament when I was a boy (now discontinued and Earls Court demolished) but I am not nowadays so interested in the military pomp on which with such royal events rely. It hasn't been revealed whether the monarch will be wearing military uniform. He isn't a soldier and I hope he doesn't. Such strong reliance on religious elements in the appointment of a Head of State is for me also an anachronism, but we should at least have some decent music to listen to - unlike at the Coronation Concert where scarcely any of the contributions appear to correspond with my personal musical taste.

[kernelbogey]

On how likely people were to participate in or watch the coronation, 46% were either very or fairly likely (19:27), 20% were not very likely and 28% were not at all likely (I would have been one of the 28% but only because I hate any sort of pomp and circumstance (whatever that is) even if it was celebrating our first elected president.

On how much people care about the coronation 33% said a great deal or a fair amount (9:24), 35% not very much, 29% not at all. Personally I find it a rather odd question: I don't care about the coronation in the same way that I don't care about the Royal Family. Not relevant to my life but I wish them no harm.

I'm with the middling ones.

On Breakfast today I half heard, then tuned in a bit, reluctantly, to the Ireland Epic March. It had the precise tone of much music of the era when I was little (although composed I think in1942). Orb and Sceptre has the tone I'm thinking of: confident, heroic, a bit military, midde-of-the-road musically. I think if formed a background to life in the early '50s as I began to be aware of music. it's even there in the music for Pathe News and Look at Life features at the cinema.

Our domestic life was then continuing in the rhythms of World War II - rationing, BBC 9 o'clock news on the Home Service and austerity. Looking back from 65+ years hence it seems much more a continuation of the 1940s rather than any kind of looking forward to the revoltionary 1960s. (The continuous sense of threat came from the risk of nuclear war rather than conventional warfare or invasion.) And some of my antipathy for this style of music is personal rather than any Zeitgeist.

And now, greater openness reveals that in the brave new Commonwealth, British police in Kenya and elsewhere were beating people up and torturing them: the 'brave new' was largely cosmetic. So hat's what this jaunty music evokes for me. And I take no pleasure in listening to it.