Wood burners - and open fires

[oddoneout]

I was quite keen on open fires until an expert on wood stove and open fire exhaust gases told me just how complex it is to get the latter to vent properly and what was in the gases/particulate matter. That nice wood fire smell is full of carcinogens...

As is so much of everyday life, especially, it sometimes seems, the enjoyable bits...

[oddoneout]

A guilty plea here as we use both a stove and an open fire. Neither produces much visible smoke as we burn seasoned and kiln-dried wood. We also have oil ch, as gas and for that matter mains sewerage have yet to find their way here, mains water only having made it it to a nearby cottage a few years back.

A lot of properties round here don't have access to gas either, which can come as a surprise to urban rats relocating - as does the lack of street lights. Private water supplies are not that uncommon - when they are accompanied by septic tank drainage it pays to do careful searches... The local council got rid of bucket privy collections in the late 80s.

[Anastasius]

My chimneys are Georgian. They are HUGE. When they need cleaning, I send the urchins up.

[Anastasius]

Trouble is it's not just wasted heat that goes up the chimney. ....

Trouble is .....we live in the middle of nowhere.

[Anastasius]

Indeed, and there has recently been focus in coroner's reports on at least one unnecessary death due to air pollution in London, though that was from external sources. ....

And she did have pre-existing conditions.

[Anastasius]

And some of those country areas may play a part in London's problems according to some research I read about some 2 or 3 years ago. Analysis of particulate matter showed that open fires from areas to the west and south of the city were, not surprisingly given the prevailing winds, contributing noticeably to the gunge in the city air. There is a certain irony perhaps that those affluent folk who work in London and live in the Home Counties with their lovely houses and statement open fires send fallout to their friends who live in London full time. The unacceptable side of that is the additional load and disproportionate effect on the already disadvantaged living in London.

I think that Sweden is perfectly capable of coping with our smoke !

Seriously ...are you really saying that someones fire in, say, Twickenham has more impact on the health of a child in Oxford Street than particulate belching buses and vans ? Maybe in Cornwall they should stop having wood burners.

[Anastasius]

A guilty plea here as we use both a stove and an open fire. Neither produces much visible smoke as we burn seasoned and kiln-dried wood. We also have oil ch, as gas and for that matter mains sewerage have yet to find their way here, mains water only having made it it to a nearby cottage a few years back.

No guilty plea required. It is what it is.

[Anastasius]

We love our open fire and although most of what we burn is smokeless fuel, very occasionally we indulge in a real coal fire - nothing beats the play of the flames and the fresh tang it brings to the air outside: although, as others have mentioned here, it would not really be helpful to burn this smoky stuff too often.

It depends where you live.

[Anastasius]

....does your cave have a number....

Idyll One
Way-back-from-nowhere

[Anastasius]

I was quite keen on open fires until an expert on wood stove and open fire exhaust gases told me just how complex it is to get the latter to vent properly and what was in the gases/particulate matter. That nice wood fire smell is full of carcinogens...

In a draughty house ? I'll take that risk.

Wonder what your experts angle was?

[Dave2002]

And she did have pre-existing conditions.

That doesn't make in unavaoidable, nor does it mean we shouldn't be appalled that that happened, and will probably happen again. The other conditions probably made the pollution effects much more obvioius, but they are almost certainly weakening a significant proportion of those who are exposed to them even if those people aren't totally brought down.

[Dave2002]

I think that Sweden is perfectly capable of coping with our smoke !

Have you forgotten acid rain - not perhaps quite the same pollutants, but it was quite a while before it was established that problems in Scandinavia were to an extent originating over here. I don't think Swedish people would appreciate more of our pollution blowing in their direction. Another incident in Russia/Ukraine polluted a very wide area well away from the origin site.

[Anastasius]

Have you forgotten acid rain - not perhaps quite the same pollutants, but it was quite a while before it was established that problems in Scandinavia were to an extent originating over here. I don't think Swedish people would appreciate more of our pollution blowing in their direction. Another incident in Russia/Ukraine polluted a very wide area well away from the origin site.

I really think a sense of proportion is called for here. You can hardly compare my little bit of smoke with that from a power station. And there are not lots of 'my little bit of smoke' where I live.

[oddoneout]

I think that Sweden is perfectly capable of coping with our smoke !

Seriously ...are you really saying that someones fire in, say, Twickenham has more impact on the health of a child in Oxford Street than particulate belching buses and vans ? Maybe in Cornwall they should stop having wood burners.

No, that's not what I'm saying and not what I wrote.

[Dave2002]

I really think a sense of proportion is called for here. You can hardly compare my little bit of smoke with that from a power station. And there are not lots of 'my little bit of smoke' where I live.

But if it’s only your little bit of smoke it will have little effect, but if everyone has a little bit, the effect could be massive. Don’t you remember the smogs of the 1950s, when you could hardly see more than a foot in front of you? They reduced very significantly when the Clean Air Acts were introduced. Admittedly a lot of the problem in those times was due to coal, but I think wood burning on a large scale is also problematic. These things do have to be taken in a context, which is why for the immediate future I’ll continue to burn wood pending a better solution, but like you we now live in a rural area, and there is so little pollution that weeds and other plants positively thrive. If we lived in a city coal and wood burning would be unacceptable. Also, I do take the warnings about wood and coal burning seriously, but there isn’t an immediately obvious better solution which ticks all the boxes. Probably heat pumps are the way to go, but we’d still need burners as a back up. Getting a heat pump installed in these times is very difficult. It’s hard to get anything done right now, even just maintaining the status quo.